Michael Jackson and Farrah died today

[dabluzman1]

I like "Twiggy View"!!!!

I know that it was not likely that the helicoptor would be needed for more important work, it is just my training that rises up against that sort of thing. As to the traffic problems with fans etc, that is what I meant. That is a VERY sad commentary on the priorities of people in this country. People put more stock in entertainers of all kinds than they do the firefighters/EMT's and para-medics that SAVE THEIR lives!!! It does just amaze me.

Talent is talent. It takes a LOT talent to be a good EMT or a good firefighter AND the courage to risk you life at any given time for someone that you have never met. Given the choice of meeting an entertainer or my garbage man I would prefere to meet the garbage man. He is of FAR more use to me and the country in general compared to the entertainer.

I never would diminish the value or respect I have for those who unselfishly give of themselves, police, firemen, emts and the like (sometimes at the cost of their own life ) to help others.
But, because you have no need for entertainers doesnt diminish their value to others.
Invalids and the aged come to mind, some who sadly have been forgotten by their own family, often only have what these performers offer as a refuge or moment of enjoyment in a life of solitude.
While this may be a very small portion of their fan base, if their existence makes one person happy, shame on you for diminishing their contribution, soley based on your code of self importance and personnel need.
I dont think I would have attended a USO show if my local garbage man was the entertainment.

 

[aristotle]

The death of Princess Diana was a graphic demonstration of the insanity that ensues when paparrazzi chase photos - the helichopper was the best move, IMO.
What saddens me, though, is how little thought is given to MJ's children. No doubt they've always been shielded from most of the horrible comments about the man who was their father, but now that he's dead, all hell breaks loose - how must it make them feel? It's bad enough that their future living arrangements are spectacularly unsuitable [their mother who never wanted them? Or their paternal grandparents who haven't done a good job raising their own brood?] but to read what people say about MJ now - it must be a nightmare for those innocent kids.

Last night, while watching news coverage of Michael Jackson's death, pictures and images of MJ's two oldest children were shown. These are the children born to Debbie Rowe. I was stunned to see they bear no resemblance to Michael Jackson whatsoever. They show no characteristics of being bi-racial. Not one scintilla. Lily white.

Michael Jackson is presumed o be the legal father of these children because they were born to his wife, Debbie Rowe, during marriage. If the truth ever comes to light, it appears Michael Jackson is not the biological father of Debbie Rowe's children. Another cruel hoax perpetrated by Michael Jackson at the expense of children.

 

[highway star]

Ed McMahon, Farrah, Michael, and now, hang on everyone...

BILLY MAYS! How much more can we take?

 

[layoutshooter]

I never would diminish the value or respect I have for those who unselfishly give of themselves, police, firemen, emts and the like (sometimes at the cost of their own life ) to help others.
But, because you have no need for entertainers doesnt diminish their value to others.
Invalids and the aged come to mind, some who sadly have been forgotten by their own family, often only have what these performers offer as a refuge or moment of enjoyment in a life of solitude.
While this may be a very small portion of their fan base, if their existence makes one person happy, shame on you for diminishing their contribution, soley based on your code of self importance and personnel need.
I dont think I would have attended a USO show if my local garbage man was the entertainment.

What I said was NOT based on any code of self importance or personal need. I do not understand where you get that from. Reading in way more than I wrote.

My garbage man helps to keep down disease and vermin. Reguardless of what you may think that is FAR more important than MJ. Sorry, but I would NOT wish to trade rat infestations for MJ.(or even those entertainers that I do enjoy) I do not dimisnish their contribution, I am putting it into the perspective of reality of TRUE NEEDS!! We all have the exact same basic needs and those who provide for those NEEDS are more important that those who provide entertainment. Entertainment is a nice thing to have but it is NOT a NEED. I do think that it is a shame that we place more of a premium on the wants and those who provide for those wants than we do for those who provide for our needs. In my opinion it is a lack of priorities.

 

[OntarioVanMan]

Last night, while watching news coverage of Michael Jackson's death, pictures and images of MJ's two oldest children were shown. These are the children born to Debbie Rowe. I was stunned to see they bear no resemblance to Michael Jackson whatsoever. They show no characteristics of being bi-racial. Not one scintilla. Lily white.

Michael Jackson is presumed o be the legal father of these children because they were born to his wife, Debbie Rowe, during marriage. If the truth ever comes to light, it appears Michael Jackson is not the biological father of Debbie Rowe's children. Another cruel hoax perpetrated by Michael Jackson at the expense of children.

Why do you chose to believe the bad in people? gee whiz...

MJ was a musical genius is his own way...Thriller was a work of art.
He was no quirkier then H. Hughes or Elvis ....

 

[dabluzman1]

I am putting it into the perspective of reality of TRUE NEEDS!! We all have the exact same basic needs and those who provide for those NEEDS are more important that those who provide entertainment. Entertainment is a nice thing to have but it is NOT a NEED.

Man are you off on this one.
My basic needs may be similar to yours, but there are variances.
But, that isnt the point I am trying to make.
While you proudly ( and I think rightly so ) talk about your helping in state of emergencies, forest fire fighting and emt service and state how you are a skilled and trained person, you diminish my abilities and skills.
I am a trained skilled musician. I attended KSU with a double major, Business and Music.
To this day I still practice weekly to maintain my chops so I can be entertaining.
Now that said, all which is on the meaningless side of your needs.
I have sat in the hospital wards, VA and public, holding the hand of a person on deaths door.
Playing and singing a song of their choice. Sometimes they would just lie there, others would sing along. I can tell you this from a personel experience, they were very grateful to have had an entertainer come to their bed and spend time with them.
Not all of an entertainers time is spent on stage in the limelight. How little you know.
My group would visit old age homes and play. You would be amazed at the number of invalids that would be wheeled into the auditorium to hear us.
I have seen wheel chair dancing, feet clapping, and sadly blank stares to even the liveliest song.
There is another whole world you dismiss because of your idea of true needs.
I dont think your being satisfied or disgruntled over entertainers is wrong, believe as you may and walk that line, I think it small of you to dismiss us and our contributions because some receive a wealth of rewards and attention.
Not all are as spartan as you in TRUE NEEDS.

 

[layoutshooter]

Man are you off on this one.
My basic needs may be similar to yours, but there are variances.
But, that isnt the point I am trying to make.
While you proudly ( and I think rightly so ) talk about your helping in state of emergencies, forest fire fighting and emt service and state how you are a skilled and trained person, you diminish my abilities and skills.
I am a trained skilled musician. I attended KSU with a double major, Business and Music.
To this day I still practice weekly to maintain my chops so I can be entertaining.
Now that said, all which is on the meaningless side of your needs.
I have sat in the hospital wards, VA and public, holding the hand of a person on deaths door.
Playing and singing a song of their choice. Sometimes they would just lie there, others would sing along. I can tell you this from a personel experience, they were very grateful to have had an entertainer come to their bed and spend time with them.
Not all of an entertainers time is spent on stage in the limelight. How little you know.
My group would visit old age homes and play. You would be amazed at the number of invalids that would be wheeled into the auditorium to hear us.
I have seen wheel chair dancing, feet clapping, and sadly blank stares to even the liveliest song.
There is another whole world you dismiss because of your idea of true needs.
I dont think your being satisfied or disgruntled over entertainers is wrong, believe as you may and walk that line, I think it small of you to dismiss us and our contributions because some receive a wealth of rewards and attention.
Not all are as spartan as you in TRUE NEEDS.

I do NOTHING to diminish your skills and was NOT talking about what I did in the past. I was talking ONLY about what I, and everyone else, NEED to survive in the present.

I don't know if you remember, or if I talked about it, but when we met I THOUGHT I mentioned about MY major in music when I was in school. I too have seen the good that music can do. I find that my work, when NOT paid, in that field was FAR more satisfiing than my paid work was. That work WAS in nursing homes etc. Working for money is one thing, giving of one's self is more important. I am sure you have done the same and would have to agree with that.

The lifting of the soul that music and entertainment in general provides IS VERY important, BUT, only if you are alive. That is what I meant. I had NO intention of lowering the value of your talent or anyone else's.

By the way, you are from Ohio, do you know the name from the VERY early '60's, Jay Morry Dean and the "Woolies"? You should. The ONLY record that I ever recorded was WITH Jay!! He was my college instructor!! The story on how that record came about is fun and interesting.

I was NOT that good at music and did NOT get some breaks. We both know that the BEST is NOT always at the top of that business. I sometimes miss playing but I chose to use other talents in my life. I was BLESSED with many and used them for others.

Do NOT mistake what I say to diminish or riducule the talents of others. I DO NOT like the the scum that often goes with the music business and MJ was at the head of the class in lack of class as a PERSON. That did NOT take away from his talent, just his worth as a person, which, in my opinion, is FAR more important. While I did NOT enjoy his work or his style, I DO, recognize his talent. It is a SHAME that so often talent comes with a price that is NOT worth it.

I hope that you understand what I am trying to say. I don't want to argue over this. I just believe that life is more important than fun and that having GREAT talent does NOT remove the responsiblity of one to live a GOOD life. Dangling your kids off a balcony is NOT leading a good life.

In my opinion, the BEST PEOPLE in the music industry are NEVER heard of. Those would be the one's whose ENTIRE career is providing joy to the likes of the nursing home residents. No fame or fortune. Just the sheer joy of the smile.

 

[Turtle]

I am putting it into the perspective of reality of TRUE NEEDS!! We all have the exact same basic needs and those who provide for those NEEDS are more important that those who provide entertainment. Entertainment is a nice thing to have but it is NOT a NEED.

Wow. Dabluzman is being extraordinarily kind when he says you are off on this one. Myself, being more straightforward and perhaps not quite as tactful would simply call this hypocritical in the extreme.

Mankind has many basic needs beyond the physical survival needs of food, clothing and shelter. One of them is the basic need to have the mind stimulated with play, in all of it's forms, be it physical or mental entertainment. That's why kids play, that's why adults read fiction, that's why people watch movies and television, listen to music and have hobbies. Entertainment can be playing softball on the weekends, watching kids at play, changing the oil in your car, building model ships in a bottle, reading a good book, listening to music, or <gasp!> going duck hunting.

Music is not only one of, if not the oldest form of entertainment, it's arguably the most important, because music is the sounds... that move... man's... soul.

 

[layoutshooter]

Wow. Dabluzman is being extraordinarily kind when he says you are off on this one. Myself, being more straightforward and perhaps not quite as tactful would simply call this hypocritical in the extreme.

Mankind has many basic needs beyond the physical survival needs of food, clothing and shelter. One of them is the basic need to have the mind stimulated with play, in all of it's forms, be it physical or mental entertainment. That's why kids play, that's why adults read fiction, that's why people watch movies and television, listen to music and have hobbies. Entertainment can be playing softball on the weekends, watching kids at play, changing the oil in your car, building model ships in a bottle, reading a good book, listening to music, or <gasp!> going duck hunting.

Music is not only one of, if not the oldest form of entertainment, it's arguably the most important, because music is the sounds... that move... man's... soul.

Ok Turtle, you ALWAYS "explore" more than I do. You most likely have FAR more education than I do. So be it. It REALLY does NOT matter. When push comes to shove, when you or I have that heart attack I DON'T want MJ coming to my house I want that low life EMT OR Para-Medic.

I understand the soul. I made my LIVING in MUSIC from age 11 until I went into the army at 19 and then, for the most part from 1973 thru 1976.

NO person, not you or Bluzeman, can feed his or her soul with music or what ever you like if you are DEAD!! THAT has NOT changed. That is all I was trying to say. Man, you guys just HAVE to read in MORE than others say or you are JUST NOT happy!!

By the way, for me at least, duck hunting does BOTH!! It feeds the body AND the soul.

First and formost is being alive and THEN you strive BEYOND just living.

Why is it SO hard for SO many to understand what I am saying? OR, do you just want to argue?

 

[DougTravels]

Does anyone understand what Layout is trying to say?

 

[dabluzman1]

Does anyone understand what Layout is trying to say?

Its all about basic needs.
Let me capsulize it for you:


FIRE BAD!!!

 

[layoutshooter]

Thank you Doug!!

 

[Turtle]

If you're dead, food, clothing and shelter ain't much good either. You stated, quite matter of factly, that "Entertainment is a nice thing to have but it is NOT a NEED." The whole of human history says you're wrong.

Is that arguing? Perhaps.

 

[layoutshooter]

If you're dead, food, clothing and shelter ain't much good either. You stated, quite matter of factly, that "Entertainment is a nice thing to have but it is NOT a NEED." The whole of human history says you're wrong.

Is that arguing? Perhaps.

What ever you say, Turtle, at least I am not SOUP!!

Get a life!!

What a joke this is. So many want to up this and that. EVERYONE has done THIS and THAT. Life and living first then play. In case you don't know what brought that on, it was agriculture. Before that mankind did NOT have time for the other stuff. Of course, I never studied any thing like that in school.

 

[Turtle]

What ever you say, Turtle, at least I am not SOUP!!

A plane crash in the right South American jungle could change that.

Get a life!!

A life by your definition? No thanks.

What a joke this is. So many want to up this and that. EVERYONE has done THIS and THAT. Life and living first then play.

Why do you think that play isn't an integral part of living?

In case you don't know what brought that on, it was agriculture. Before that mankind did NOT have time for the other stuff. Of course, I never studied any thing like that in school.

And it's quite obvious you never studied anything like that in school. Agriculture did not precipitate play, it precipitated non-migratory civilization. Music and the arts were flourishing quite well before the invention of agriculture, as the carvings and paintings in caves that predate agricultures by thousands of years so well illustrate.

 

[layoutshooter]

A plane crash in the right South American jungle could change that.

A life by your definition? No thanks.

Why do you think that play isn't an integral part of living?

And it's quite obvious you never studied anything like that in school. Agriculture did not precipitate play, it precipitated non-migratory civilization. Music and the arts were flourishing quite well before the invention of agriculture, as the carvings and paintings in caves that predate agricultures by thousands of years so well illustrate.

What ever you say. I am just a nut. I have no use. You are the man. NO, play was NOT a integral part of living until there was time for it. Ever hear of the "Climate of Invention"? When man was only involved in hunting and gathering he did LITTLE beyond that. Cave paintings were mostly primitive RELIGIOUS rederings hoping and praying for better hunts or warmer winters. But then again, I NEVER have anthropology in high school or college. I make this stuff up to argue with you and Doug. Ever wonder why they almost always depected a pregnate doe in their hunts? It was NOT because they wanted to have sex with female deer. That is a MJ thing.

 

[hondaking38]

MEDVAC IN THE MILITARY IS CALLED A NINE LINE MEDVAC, ONCE ITS CALLED IN,IT CAN NOT BE RETRACTED EVER, EVEN IF THE PATIENT DIES ENROUTE...THATS PROBABLY THE REASON IT PICKED UP THE DEAD BODY. OF MJ..just went thru the training and got a no-go because i aborted the mission..things have changed in the last 15 years since the regular army days..

 

[layoutshooter]

MEDVAC IN THE MILITARY IS CALLED A NINE LINE MEDVAC, ONCE ITS CALLED IN,IT CAN NOT BE RETRACTED EVER, EVEN IF THE PATIENT DIES ENROUTE...THATS PROBABLY THE REASON IT PICKED UP THE DEAD BODY. OF MJ..just went thru the training and got a no-go because i aborted the mission..things have changed in the last 15 years since the regular army days..

MJ was LONG dead by the time they brought in that bird. Turtle had the best explination for what happened, as sad as it was. When you called in a "Nine" or I called in "LifeLion" it was in an attempt to save a life, not avoid a traffice jam. Oh how things have changed.

 

[DougTravels]

I believe we do not do enough to show celebrities how important they are to us. I think more award shows/honors is what is truly needed to show them just how important they are. We need statues of our stars, not just in Hollywood but everywhere. People also need to heed their advice on politcal issues after all they are stars.

 

[layoutshooter]

I believe we do not do enough to show celebrities how important they are to us. I think more award shows/honors is what is truly needed to show them just how important they are. We need statues of our stars, not just in Hollywood but everywhere. People also need to heed their advice on politcal issues after all they are stars.

Only in the mind of the weak. Only the individual is truely capable of choosing what is best for them. That is, unless they are weak minded and lazy. Why must you spout slogans? I truely belive that you are better than that or our polititions are. At least I hope you are.