The Trump Card...
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danthewolf00
Veteran Expediter
Nope...I just question the fact that a federal judge blocked the request to move from the state level court to the federal level court....when charged with federal law crimes.
Oh that's right then the statute of limitations would kick in.
danthewolf00
Veteran Expediter
Because federal law is being applied to crimes....all trump is wanting is to take it to federal court. But see then the statute of limitations kicks in and boom it gets dismissed.
It is not true that "federal law is being applied to crimes."
" ... the indictment alleges that Trump:
- Caused false entries to be made in the books and records of the Trump Organization in order to conceal the existence of hush money payments made to Stormy Daniels and Karen McDougal, two women who claimed to have had affairs with Trump.
- Caused false entries to be made in the books and records of the Trump Organization in order to conceal the fact that Trump had inflated the value of his assets for insurance and tax purposes.
- Caused false entries to be made in the books and records of the Trump Organization in order to conceal the fact that Trump had received millions of dollars in loans from Deutsche Bank that he could not have repaid without violating lending covenants.
Note that § 14-100(a) is a New York STATE law, as are all other laws under which Trump was charged.
In on sense, Trump already had his day in federal court in this case. It was a federal court judge who heard Trump's request to move the case to federal court, and that judge denied Trump's request.
Regarding the statute of limitations, Trump may have a valid point.
Per Google Bard:
"... The statute of limitations for felony election fraud in New York is five years. The hush money payments were made in 2016, so the statute of limitations would have expired in 2021. However, the New York State Legislature passed a law in 2021 that extended the statute of limitations for certain election crimes, including felony election fraud. This law was passed specifically to allow the Manhattan District Attorney's Office to bring charges against Trump.
"The statute of limitations for felony election fraud in New York is now 10 years. This means that the Manhattan District Attorney's Office could have brought charges against Trump up until 2026. However, the indictment was filed in 2023, so the statute of limitations does not apply in this case.
"Trump's attorneys have argued that the statute of limitations is unconstitutional, because it violates the right to due process of law. They have also argued that the statute is retroactive, and therefore applies to conduct that occurred before the law was passed.
"The court has not yet ruled on these legal issues. It is not clear how the court will rule."
Trump's argument that the statute of limitations should apply in this case has been formally and properly made to the court.
A ruling on that question is pending. I am not a lawyer, but it seems to me fundamentally wrong to change laws and apply them retroactively. That opens the door to all kinds of abuse and unfair acts.
For example, say labor law required overtime to be paid to everyone who works more than 40 hours a week, but that law was changed to revoke the overtime requirement, and the effective date was retroactively applied to begin five years ago. That would allow employers to to claw back the overtime they paid employees for the hours they worked then in good faith, believing they would be paid overtime for that work.
Or say a new law was passed that required all CDL drivers to be on duty driving no more than eight hours a day, and that the fine for driving over that amount is $10 an hour for every hour over eight, and the effective date of that law was retroactively set to begin five years ago. Under that law, logs could be reviewed and drivers could be fined vast sums for doing what was legal then but is illegal now.
Abortion laws are changing in some states these days to outlaw abortions beyond a certain date after pregnancy. If it was allowed to retroactively apply these laws, these states would be allowed to punish women who had abortions before the new law went into effect. And I would not put it past many Republican state legislators to do just that if they thought they could.
Carrying this to the extreme, consider illegal immigrants. The law today provides certain punishments for illegal entry into the US. But if retroactive application of law was allowed, the strident anti-immigration people could work to pass a law that provides the death penalty for illegal entry, with an effective date of five years prior. This would allow lawmakers to solve the immigration problem (as they see it) by killing the illegal immigrants who have been for years stealing jobs from the "real Americans" they think should have them.
Allowing laws to be changed and retroactively applied allows the lawmakers to instantly transform vast classes of innocent people, or a targeted class of one person, into criminals and unfairly place them in legal peril. It creates an abuse of power that would be abhorrent to the Founding Fathers, and all people who believe all people should be fairly treated.
The retroactive-application-of-law question Trump is raising in this case should be raised. Unless I'm missing something fundamental in my analysis, it's difficult to see the courts allowing the retroactive application of new laws to stand.
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Here is what the Michigan AG is saying a crime and why they rounded up seniors for a document discrepancy where they put on the form that they met at the Capitol instead of a Republican committee basement. She wants to put the seniors away for 14 years because of it. Something even the Feds thought wasn’t worth pursuing.Here in Michigan they’re rounding up seniors 3 years later for a document discrepancy. A document where they signed that they convened at the capitol when instead they met in the Michigan Republican Party basement. Why didn’t the just meet at the Capitol to have the meeting? Because Gov Witmer ordered all the doors locked and people turned away.
They want to send these seniors away for 14 years over a document they signed and charging them with forgery because it said Capitol instead of where they met at. A document that wasn’t even used.
Here is an article from around that time:
Police Bar Group Claiming To Be GOP Electors from Michigan Capitol, Say Electors Are Already There
Michigan police to blocked a group claiming to be alternate electors for Trump from entering the state Capitol in Lansing Monday.www.westernjournal.com
View attachment 22638
The alternate electors arrived at the Mi. Capitol to convene, but were denied access. The Governor lied and said it was because of Covid restrictions. They wanted to submit the document but were denied. This is what the Mi. AG is wasting her time and resources with: Rounding up seniors for a document discrepancy.
If the Alternate Electors didn’t convene and submit the document then whatever potential legal challenges that were successful would have been moot because there wouldn’t have been any ( Republican) electors submitted by the December 14 deadline.
This is what the AG is calling a crime and rounding up seniors to put them away for basically the rest of their lives. Pretty pathetic right?
This is what the AG is calling a crime and rounding up seniors to put them away for basically the rest of their lives. Pretty pathetic right?
You are saying things happened in a certain way. The indictment is talking about something else. Apples to Oranges.
You are of course entitled to raise any question you wish. But for me, questions about the indictment are the relevant questions in this case.
When you are discussing how this year's crops are doing at this point in the growing season, you do not get closer to the truth by asking questions about the right kind of motor oil to use in your car.
Clarity Regarding the Michigan Fake Electors
From Google Bard:
"On July 18, 2023, Michigan Attorney General Dana Nessel announced that she had charged 16 people with forgery and other crimes for their role in a scheme to cast false electoral votes for Donald Trump in the 2020 presidential election.
"The indictment alleges that the 16 people met in December 2020 and falsely declared themselves to be Michigan's electors for Trump. They then signed certificates stating that they had cast their electoral votes for Trump, even though Joe Biden had won the state's popular vote.
"The indictment also alleges that the 16 people sent the false certificates to the National Archives and Records Administration in an attempt to have them certified as Michigan's official electoral votes. ...
"The charges against the 16 people range from forgery to conspiracy to commit forgery. If convicted, they could face up to 14 years in prison."
Links to the Official Documents: Link 1 Link 2
From Google Bard:
"On July 18, 2023, Michigan Attorney General Dana Nessel announced that she had charged 16 people with forgery and other crimes for their role in a scheme to cast false electoral votes for Donald Trump in the 2020 presidential election.
"The indictment alleges that the 16 people met in December 2020 and falsely declared themselves to be Michigan's electors for Trump. They then signed certificates stating that they had cast their electoral votes for Trump, even though Joe Biden had won the state's popular vote.
"The indictment also alleges that the 16 people sent the false certificates to the National Archives and Records Administration in an attempt to have them certified as Michigan's official electoral votes. ...
"The charges against the 16 people range from forgery to conspiracy to commit forgery. If convicted, they could face up to 14 years in prison."
Links to the Official Documents: Link 1 Link 2
The charges looks like someone that may have been heavily intoxicated.
If you think that, go ahead and believe it. I hold a different view.
Care to reevaluate that opinion?
Michigan AG Dana Nessel Gets Wasted, Wheelchaired Out of Football Game
Michigan Attorney General Dana Nessel (D) apologized in a statement laced with sarcasm for becoming incapacitated at a college football game.
www.breitbart.com
So what?Care to reevaluate that opinion?
Michigan AG Dana Nessel Gets Wasted, Wheelchaired Out of Football Game
Michigan Attorney General Dana Nessel (D) apologized in a statement laced with sarcasm for becoming incapacitated at a college football game.
View attachment 22642
This person’s judgement is deciding charges:
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No. I am confident she and her team were sober when they prepared the indictment. And court is the perfect place to evaluate her work product and judgement. That will come in due time.
That said, it's pretty stupid for a public official to get drunk at a football game. But she did, and that deed is now hers to live with and everyone's to criticize or forgive. I'm in the critical camp. Like I said, it was a stupid thing to do. Note that this happened in Nov. 2021. I'm aware of no repeat behavior since then or any other evidence that would suggest she has a drinking problem.
Are you aware of any such evidence?
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You know they call that?
Enabling
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Let me answer my own question. I never heard of Nessel before she indicted the Michigan fake electors, so I am learning. Checking with Google Bard, I learned this:
"[Nessel] has been open about her struggles with alcoholism in the past. In 2018, she wrote a blog post about how she had been sober for 10 years. However, she also said that she had relapsed a few times in the past."
So, yes, there is evidence that Nessel struggles with alcoholism. I will never condemn someone for that. One of the best gym managers I ever employed was a recovering alcoholic. The judge who presided over my wife's and my wedding was a recovering alcoholic. A political friend of mine years ago when I was active was Republican US congressman Jim Ramstead. He was a recovering alcoholic.
I could name a very long list of people who have done great things for the country, their communities and the people around them who are recovering alcoholics. At the same time, those who fall off the wagon can do great harm to themselves and others.
Backto Nessel, there is no evidence she is off the wagon now, and, for me, at least, no reason to question her present-day work product.
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False.
True
I noticed that there was a large amount of joking and excuses made from her public intoxication. That is what alcoholics do. They make excuses for their actions. Also, often what someone sees publicly from an alcoholic is just the tip of the iceberg of what is really going on with the person.
The hallmarks of alcoholics are they have extremely impaired judgment, they act very irresponsible, and their critical thinking goes to chit.
So I have reason to doubt her present day work.
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