The Trump Card...

ATeam

Senior Member
Retired Expediter
Depending on the person making the comment, it has been said that 25-35 Republican senators would vote to remove Trump from office if the impeachment vote to convict was held by secret ballot. If you assume all Democrats the two independents in the Senate vote to convict, 20 Republican votes would be needed to reach the constitutionally required 2/3 majority (68 votes). At present, those votes are not there on a public vote. But if the commentators are correct and 25-35 secret-ballot votes exist, and if the rules are changed to conduct the vote by secret ballot, Trump's conviction and removal from office becomes more likely.

Those are two big ifs. (1) Is it true that 25-35 Republican senators would vote to convict and remove Trump if voting was done by secret ballot? And (2), could the rules be so changed?
 

Moot

Veteran Expediter
Owner/Operator
If the rules are changed and the Senate gets a secret vote, if it ever gets that far; it will be more proof of Washington as The Swamp and the existence of the Deep State.

Washington D.C., our nation's capitol and the birthplace of opaque transparency . Turtle's picture captured the essence of the city and our leaders. Less the poopie smell.
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DC 1.jpg
 
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Turtle

Administrator
Staff member
Retired Expediter
Those are two big ifs. (1) Is it true that 25-35 Republican senators would vote to convict and remove Trump if voting was done by secret ballot? And (2), could the rules be so changed
Can you see it? Can you see it? How that's literally living in a dream fantasy world?
 

Turtle

Administrator
Staff member
Retired Expediter
Woman wearing a hijab working the entrance to a Walmart parking lot in Alexandria, VA.

Hard to see the sign, but I'm pretty sure it says,

"Will pray for food"

IMG_20191026_102012.jpg

Bad Turtle! Bad!
 
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muttly

Veteran Expediter
Retired Expediter
Not only would they be cancelling the votes of over 60 million people, but they would have to change the rules and vote in secrecy. Interesting...
 

ATeam

Senior Member
Retired Expediter
Trump's view of himself and himself as president is noteworthy.

Jul 22, 2016: "Nobody knows the system better than me, which is why I alone can fix it."
Jan 16, 2018: "I think that would qualify as not smart, but genius ... and a very stable genius at that!"
Aug 21, 2019: "I am the chosen one."
Aug 23, 2019: "Our great American companies are hereby ordered to ...."
Oct 7, 2019: "...if Turkey does anything that I, in my great and unmatched wisdom, consider to be off limits..."
Oct 12, 2019: Trump referred to the beginning of his presidency as "when I took over the United States.'"
Oct 25, 2019: "But here’s the thing: I don’t have teams. Everyone is talking about teams. I’m the team."
 
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ATeam

Senior Member
Retired Expediter
With all eyes on the impeachment inquiry in the House, it's easy to let the courts fade from view. How is Trump doing in the courts? Here's a review of three cases:

1. Blumenthal v. Trump, an emoluments case. Judge denied Trump's motion to dismiss and ruled the plaintiffs have standing to continue the case.

2. Maryland and DC v. Trump, an emoluments case. After a three-judge Appeals Court panel ruled in favor of Trump and ordered the case thrown out, that court's full bench decided to take up the case which will be heard on 12/12/19.

3. CREW v. Trump, an emoluments case. U.S. District Judge George B. Daniels dismissed the case on December 21, 2017, holding that plaintiffs lacked standing. On appeal, the U.S. Court of Appeals for the Second Circuit reversed the dismissal, reinstated the suit, and remanded the case to the district court for further proceedings.

Thus, all three emoluments cases remain live and are proceeding. In all three cases, the most-recent rulings have gone against Trump.

Also of interest (to me at least) are four other cases:

1. The case in which Trump is suing to quash a New York State subpoena that would provide the Manhattan D.A. with Trump's tax records. At the appellate level, both sides have agreed to certain conditions that are likely to speed this case to the Supreme Court, which both sides appear to want..

2. The case in which Trump is suing to quash the subpoena that would provide the House Oversight Committee access to the Trump financial data specified in the subpoena.

3. The case in which Trump is suing to quash the subpoena that would provide the House Ways and Means Committee access to the Trump financial data specified in the subpoena.

4. The case in which the Justice Department was recently ordered by the Court to release certain grand jury materials from former special counsel Mueller’s investigation to the House Judiciary Committee amid its impeachment inquiry.

It is tedious to track these cases. I'll try to provide a better summary as time permits.
 

Ragman

Veteran Expediter
Retired Expediter
Trump's view of himself and himself as president is noteworthy.

Jul 22, 2016: "Nobody knows the system better than me, which is why I alone can fix it."
Jan 16, 2018: "I think that would qualify as not smart, but genius ... and a very stable genius at that!"
Aug 21, 2019: "I am the chosen one."
Aug 23, 2019: "Our great American companies are hereby ordered to ...."
Oct 7, 2019: "...if Turkey does anything that I, in my great and unmatched wisdom, consider to be off limits..."
Oct 12, 2019: Trump referred to the beginning of his presidency as "when I took over the United States.'"
Oct 25, 2019: "But here’s the thing: I don’t have teams. Everyone is talking about teams. I’m the team."


I think the answer is evident.
 

muttly

Veteran Expediter
Retired Expediter


I think the answer is evident.
McCaffrey is a Never Trumper. Employees still have free access online to those two and have at least 3 liberal leaning newspapers still available.
 
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Turtle

Administrator
Staff member
Retired Expediter
A 4 star General, someone who is supposed to be (Muttly beat me to it as I was typing this) well trained by the US military, is supposed to be smart, is supposed to be trained in logical thinking, is supposed to be trained to set aside hyperbole, thinks Trump canceling subscriptions to the Times and to WaPo, publications that every federal employee has access to regardless, is a watershed moment, and then invoked Mussolini. That is so ridiculous as to be laugh out loud funny. Seriously. Laugh out loud funny.

And at the same time makes me suspicious and a little sad at the quality of people who can attain the rank of General in our military. I still have a lot of respect for our military, but this diminishes it just a smidge.
 
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ATeam

Senior Member
Retired Expediter
It's also meaningless until the Supreme Court rules on them.

Yes and no. If you focus on the cases alone, yes, you are correct. The Supreme Court has the final say.

But the lower court rulings have impacts beyond the cases themselves. We've already seen a judge in one of these cases reference another of these cases. The judges are paying attention to the rulings made by other courts.

The recent finding by a court that the House impeachment inquiry is legitimate and constitutional was made in case #4 listed above. While that ruling was made as part of the case, it also becomes part of the ongoing political debate and perhaps influential in it. Republicans have been questioning and/or condemning the impeachment inquiry process followed by the House. Their argument/talking point is defeated by the court finding. Unless and until a higher court finds otherwise, the House impeachment inquiry process is officially constitutional.
 
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