van line haul distance

[LDB]

Van drivers, there's a lot of debate on companies that set a specific limit on single transit line haul distance. Comments suggest at least some people believe there should be no restriction at all so van drivers what sort of rules are sensible? How many miles in total, deadhead and line haul combined, should a van driver be given without a break? At the end of that long run, whatever the maximum length is, how long should the minimum break time be before the next load offer and run?

 

[highway star]

I don't think there should be any arbitrary, one size fits all rule. Leave it up to the individual, and whatever a particular load may call for. When dispatched at 45 mph, I was willing to run as many miles as they could come up with. There will be sleep time built in to a 45 mph dispatch. If they're looking for a 60 mph average, things change a bit.

 

[ebsprintin]

I say none. Let me manage myself. But with the gotcha clause in the regs that say a company has to safely manage all vehicles legit companies will have some kind of policy however loose it may be. I look for five hours of sleep for each full day (as a general rule). I'll go farther if I've had a good break. If I'm running that hard I'll go out of service to catch the necessary rest. I just like to have the flexibility to decide. For me the bigger peave is how much time is allocated to the run regardless of length. Calculate the run at 45 mph and I can incorporate my rest into the longer runs, and it gives me the necessary cushion for traffic conditions. There is a reason Dominoes did away with their 30 minute delivery guarantee. Expedited freight shouldn't be defined as fast. It should be defined as dedicated and direct.

eb

 

[chefdennis]

I agree, I know when i need to sleep and i do it when i need to. When a run is disaptched, I know what i can handle and if its outside of that, i'll let dispatch know and we can either make changes or give the load to another driver.....

As far as rest time in between runs, all that is needed is to simply, "go out of service" , rest and then go back in.....it has never been an issue in the short time (16 months) that i have been doing this...

 

[CharlesD]

I have one van leased on other than myself and I trust him to tell me if he can do a long one or not. I also trust him to let me know when he's had enough rest and is ready to run again. That's worked pretty well so far.

 

[Pilgrim]

I know this has been pointed out before, but all it's going to take for some federal limitations on van hours to be put in place is for some c/v driver to fall asleep at the wheel on the last leg of a 1200 mile trip and kill some carload of kids on the way home from a school or church outing. IMHO, 800 miles would be a reasonable limit to put on a van trip before requiring an 8 hour break - that allows about 12 hrs drive time if you're on mostly interstate averaging 65 mph. As previously stated, most dispatches are based on 45 mph, so the 12-hr standard would only allow for 540 miles. At any rate, we're talking about time behind the wheel being the important factor. If there were to be a limit (which I'm not endorsing), 12-15 hrs drive time would be reasonable before the required break.

 

[FIS53]

In my case there are no rules for a run. For the longer ones I check if the customer or consignee have been given a time limit for the run (say a max time it should be there or a deadline for getting there). If there is time built in for rest or other happenings then I'll run as far as possible safely and catch some sleep within the time allowance. I like to keep some time available besides for problems on the road but there are runs there is so little time available I find it hard to work with.

I like the greater freedom of no set limits as I choose how to work it. This allows for optimum selection of rest periods, eating and fuel stops and also of timing (if allowances are there).
Rob

 

[LDB]

I know our regulars are top shelf but as a whole do you think it's safe to have no limitations? I know of a handful of guys I wouldn't want to be within 100 miles of because they'd take back to back 700-800 mile runs with no break time in between if offered. So, should there be some structured system in place regulating everyone because of the few who would abuse things if given the chance? If so, what's sensible? Maybe 1 hour break between offers per 100 miles of prior job over 300-400 miles with a max of 8-10 hours? IOW, if a 700 mile run was complete then 7 hours break before the next load and if it was a 400 mile run then 4 hours before the next load?

 

[greg334]

You know that every company seems to have some limits but they are applied differently.

Here is something that I have had happen a few times. I was offered a load for 850 miles for my van after sitting for a day and a half, the dispatcher said "we have to cross dock the load because you are limited to 750 a day" so I still accepted the load. I got 500 miles out of it, which was ok with me until I got to the dock and help load the other van. The other van was also a solo driver who just did a 700 mile run a few hours before and was going to do the 300 more miles. I later learned that it is not written in stone at the company but rather because the driver was in good standing, they favored him over others.

 

[Moot]

Panther has a quasi 16 hour rule. 16 hours on duty and then a swap or a 5 hour break. Friday I accepted a 1300 mile direct load at 45 mph. Safety informed me I had to take my 5 hour break. Dispatch said it would swap, but they didn't know where.

After about 600 miles and hearing nothing from dispatch, I took my 5 hour break and resumed my trek. I got caught up in a major traffic back up due to an accident. I delivered 20 minutes late.

I don't mind swapping a load, I just want to know ahead of time so I can plan my route and pace myself accordingly. When I was with Con-Way they had terminals nationwide. Often I was given a choice of where to swap. I would base my choice on best location for the next load, not on total miles.

 

[panther_art]

Last weekend waited in Richmond until 1700 for a load and no loads went out that day so I decided to go to the Pittsburgh board because I always get good loads out of there on Mondays so stopping a few times on the way up and taking catnaps never stopping for 5 hrs so my clock is running. I stop at some friends house ok I now am in 14 hrs on my 16 hr clock, I get I call for a 850 mile run that has to be delivered on Sunday so I tell the dispatcher that I only have 2 hrs of drive time left so he said go to the shipper and take about a 3 - 4 hr break there and I should be ok to run the whole load so it takes me 20 mins to get to the shipper and 10 mins to get loaded so now I still have 1hr and 20 mins left on my clock so I get on the PA turnpike into Ohio and go to the first service area and stop there and start my 5 hr break and 3 times dispatch calls and ask why I am not moving. When I tell them I am taking a 5 hr break they said no one told you to do that, you are showing a 6hr delay. The load was going to a nuke plant and the shipper told me that they can't swap it out. Got to the consignee 1hr and 30 mins early.

 

[LDB]

Panther is bad about not telling you where they will swap when you know they will swap. That makes it impossible to accept a load. They are also bad about routing. I had a load from TN to MI that I would have taken up through KY and OH. The dispatcher told me to take it up through IL or put it back on the dock. I argued a while and was very tempted to tell him ok and then go the way I wanted to go. They swapped the load from me in Effingham, paying crossdock fees and perhaps additional deadhead to the other driver because they forced it up and around Purgatory. My way was 12 miles farther but no Purgatory to deal with and higher speed limits. I knew better, being the one out doing the job. They have a number of dispatchers who probably should be assembling burgers. That's not to say the whole dispatch team as they have a number who are excellent but some really need to listen to the drivers more than they do.

 

[Moot]

There is little or no communication between dispatch, safety and the swap department.

 

[Doggie Daddy]

They have a number of dispatchers who probably should be assembling burgers.

Apparently this is not as easy a job as you make it out to be,judging by the amount of times that these "assemblers" get my order wrong.

 

[guido4475]

As I have said before, the above reasons are why I am where I am.No load limitations,etc.As I have found out from past experience,Once you condition your body to staying up for a long period of time, the long runs seem like a piece of cake.I used to run for a company in the past that would give me coast to coast loads like from L.A. to Miami non-stop.At 45 mph average speed given, it is real easy to buid up time for a 4 hour nap 1/2 way through a load such as that.My dad used to run with 4 hours of sleep per day and never had a problem.Even at 80 years old retired, he still doesnt sleep that much, it's what he conditioned his body to.He has never had an accident of any kind in the 3.5 millon he has driven running this way.

 

[TheOGExpediterGuy]

the way i see it is just let us run as long as we want to...there are people who can run 1000 miles no problem...so just let us go at our own discression....Most of my loads are 700 miles and over...

 

[Doggie Daddy]

the way i see it is just let us run as long as we want to...there are people who can run 1000 miles no problem...so just let us go at our own discression....Most of my loads are 700 miles and over...

There needs to be rules and laws to protect us from ourselves,to say that there are people that can run 1000 miles with no problems to me says that they haven't had a problem YET.

There is no way that you can convince me that you are driving with the same alertness level at 1000 miles that you have at 500 miles.

 

[piper1]

Leo is right, most of us on here would likely be considered the top of the heap and would be professional enough to know when to say when. I have swapped with guys from my own carrier (we have a rule) that have been so poor at managing their sleep they look stoned after 300 miles. I don't want that guy driving on the same road as my family...or even with the same brand as me on the side of his van. When I first started in this business I had a fairly regular run that was 1250 miles straight thru. I shouldn't have done it, I had to speed usually to make sure I could do the run before I fell asleep. That's stupid and it's embarrassing that I did it. Why did I do it, of course...big money. As long as we see dollar signs associated with a long run, many will put better judgment aside and run.

I like a limit and think it should be around 8-850 miles and then an automatic bed card for 8 hours in which hopefully you will get at least 5-6 hours of solid sleep. HAZMAT, 500 miles. Just because we are in a van doesn't make us automatically safe. We can cause carnage just like a big truck.

 

[Doggie Daddy]

I like a limit and think it should be around 8-850 miles and then an automatic bed card for 8 hours in which hopefully you will get at least 5-6 hours of solid sleep. HAZMAT, 500 miles. Just because we are in a van doesn't make us automatically safe. We can cause carnage just like a big truck.

That sure sounds alot smarter and safer than allowing people to run unrestricted.

 

[LDB]

DD has it right, the YET is missing. No offense, but the people who think they can do 1000 miles with no significant break are the ones I'm most concerned about being on the road with. There is no way a human can do 18 hours behind the wheel and be anywhere near as alert and capable during the last hour as they were during the first few hours. The only question is where should the line be drawn that doesn't unduly restrict those that are capable of pretty long distances while also keeping people from going beyond what's reasonable and what they are truly capable of to what they haven't (yet) failed at.