To Post or Not To Post - That Be The Question Y'all

CharlesD · Apr 15, 2012

A driver who is signed on with one carrier finds himself in an out of the way city like...I don't know...Boise. He is the only van within 200 miles and a load pops up. His carrier, knowing there is no competition, gets $1.50 a mile or more and pays him well over $1.

3 carrier Bob delivers in Boise a few days later and is again the only van around. A load pops up and 3 carriers are bidding against each other and the load goes for $1.05 a mile, with about .85 or less going into Bob's pocket. Does Bob have a right to blame the carrier for only paying him .85?

zorry · Apr 15, 2012

Yeah. No carrier should ever bid low out of Boise.

zorry · Apr 15, 2012

CD, would that carrier bid that low with company equipment there ? Then don't bid low for the O/O. He should have got enough money going to Boise to be able to bounce to a respectable load.

jelliott · Apr 15, 2012

ARTIFICIAL CAPACITY!!!!!! All it does is drive rate down for everyone. It messes up the natural order of supply and demand.

zorry · Apr 15, 2012

John, Do you use multi-carrier trucks ? Is the benefit really worth the damage it does ? Instead of ban the van should the call be to Ban the Multi-Carrier van ?

Rocketman · Apr 15, 2012

zorry said:
John, Do you use multi-carrier trucks ? Is the benefit really worth the damage it does ? Instead of ban the van should the call be to Ban the Multi-Carrier van ?

I could answer that....but I think John might enjoy it more...lol

highway star · Apr 15, 2012

Rocketman said:
I could answer that....but I think John might enjoy it more...lol

LOL... And, the question was right below message #44!

chefdennis · Apr 15, 2012

I don't think the OP was busting on the "low rate" at all...As i read it, he is fine when he needs them and the low rate is ok when he needs to get out of a bad area..but to LEAVE HIS PORCH, he isn't going to run out cheap...all he was saying to the carrier was, i am in service, but you really don't need to look fo anything for me because i need a higher rate to leave home...when i need you, ill let you know....and my other carriers will cover me leaving the porch...

Maybe not the wisest way of doing things, but I see the point..and i also see the carrier telling him to take a hike...i mean, that carrier is good enough to take a low rate from when it is to the OP's benefit, but not when the carrier needs him..... and on that note, yea the e-mail was also not the best way to do it, id have called him myself.....

zorry · Apr 15, 2012

HS, the ANSWER is right below #44. Just trying to stir the debate about muti-carrier guys. Are they needed, or are they selfish with the attitude "I don't care what I'm doing to the industry, I just care about me ?" I don't know or understand the van segment. Curious to learn what makes those vanners tick.

purgoose10 · Apr 15, 2012

jelliott said:
ARTIFICIAL CAPACITY!!!!!! All it does is drive rate down for everyone. It messes up the natural order of supply and demand.

Hey John, How many reading that knows what it means? LOL!

zorry · Apr 15, 2012

If you are picking your own loads you should understand what it means.

purgoose10 · Apr 15, 2012

zorry said:
If you are picking your own loads you should understand what it means.

Evidently you didn't see the LOL. Anyway there are a lot of people that don't know what it means.
As far as picking my loads, well when my customers call I go, I don't have the luxury of picking my loads.

Rocketman · Apr 15, 2012

Zorry, I dont think they have that attitude. There is obviuosly a need for freight sharing so that the carriers can get their overflow loads moved and keep their customers happy.

Over the years, there have been many smaller carriers emerge who get their freight exclusively from the load boards (the overflow freight). Some of these carriers have done a good job of moving freight and keeping the rates a decent level.

Over the last few years, there has been an emergence of smaller carriers who will allow you to lease to them along with any number of other carriers. This is where the "false capacity" comes into play. If your leased to 3 carriers and they all post your truck available in the same location and bid on the same load...the rate will drop. They will come on here with every explanation, justification and excuse under the sun....but its all BS. If it weren't BS, people like PreacherRich wouldnt have to be fighting to get .90/mile.

Rich means well. Afterall, he's been told that he's doing "really good" and he probably has done really good in the multi-carrier world of low ball, aggressive bidding. What people dont see is that if they would just re-evaluate their place in the industry, they could make more money, with less effort by treating their business as a business and investing in it in a responsible way. Rich could trade up from a cargo van to a sprinter type unit for a very few thousand dollars. Then, he would be qualified to lease to a better carrier that would respect him and his ability to move freight vs kicking him to the curb because he asked for a decent rate.

It boils down to people taking advantage of the uninformed. They show them how easy it is to get a cargo van and do "really well". Then they spend a lot of time re-convincing them....or in this case kicking them to the curb.

jelliott · Apr 15, 2012

We generally do not use a carrier that operates it's vehicles under a multi-carrier structure. I have concerns not just about supply and demand, but also insurance, compliance and safety liability with these type carriers. While I will not say never, it is pretty much our last resort option to protect a customer.

Rocketman · Apr 15, 2012

Taking advantage of an opportunity isnt what gets me. I would consider that myself....if the money was there. Taking advantage of the opportunity so that you can make LESS is what just blows my mind.

The false capacity is just a by product of an already bad business model...and it hurts the industry as a whole.

highway star · Apr 15, 2012

chefdennis said:
Maybe not the wisest way of doing things, but I see the point..and i also see the carrier telling him to take a hike...

I'm on board with you Chef, except this part. Being in northern Michigan, he could have been one of few units in the area. If that was the case, this carrier that seems hellbent on going low no matter what could possibly have gotten him an excellent rate on something. It seems a huge over reaction to cancel his contract over this. I guess their low rate means a lot to them.

chefdennis · Apr 15, 2012

Highway Star wrote:

I guess their low rate means a lot to them.

Bingo!! And while i don't agree with them dumping him as they did, with the fact that they like their low rates and the fact that went they need freight covered and he is available, but won't take it but when he needs them, he will...i do understand it....

Rocketman · Apr 15, 2012

chefdennis said:
Highway Star wrote:

Bingo!! And while i don't agree with them dumping him as they did, with the fact that they like their low rates and the fact that went they need freight covered and he is available, but won't take it but when he needs them, he will...i do understand it....

IF they are actually trying to service a true customer...yes. But more than likely, their just bidding off a board and dont want to waste time trying to get a decent rate. You know, that aggressive bidding stuff. If you get aggressive enough (cheap enough), you can probably load trucks pretty quick...if you can brow beat people into running that cheap.

Imagine what a company like LoadOne could do if they started bidding rates like these guys do. They could probably keep every van out here moving..lol. Broke...but moving!

PreacherRich · Apr 15, 2012

Wow, what a cool thread!

One of my carriers main focus is servicing their own customers and will use the boards to keep trucks moving.

One of my carriers focuses on the alliance but 60% of their business is from broker calls.

Another carrier focuses on NLM loads and their own customers and has for years.

One carrier does a mix of all that.

I think I have an awesome mix. Granted my van may be posted by several carriers but I only allow one carrier to bid on each load for me. The first one to call gets to bid it. I personally think it would be stupid have my partners bidding against each other to see who can get me the least money. Has that happened? Sure it has, but I try my best to make sure it doesn't happen. All these carriers have relationships with many different brokers and shippers and I benefit from that.

No disrespect Rocketman but most of my carriers and their dispatchers care very much about the rate they are bidding. Most dispatch teams are commission based and the more money they get the more money they make. Most of my carriers will ask me before bidding what I have to have to run the load, I tell them, they add a certain percentage to it and away we go.

The "over flow" carriers wouldn't exist if there wasnt a need for them. Many aren't actually overflow though when they are filling in the gaps of an existing customer base, just like every other carrier. I understand how having 20 vehicles posted in an area when in actuality there may only be 8 drivers can have a negetive affect on rates but there are solutions to that as well. It would just take a small tweak at the bid board level.

If both Selectus and NLM would assign life long driver numbers. Example is ABC Expedite sings on PreacherRich as a driver they assign him a driver # that will follow him with every carrier he ever runs with. ABC posts PreacherRich available in Laredo and show all the companies he is running with and only show one vehicle. It would also give shippers and brokers a true picture of who is hauling their frieght. They can give the drivers a score just like they do with carriers. It would also eliminate bad drivers from jumping carrier to carrier or fleet owner to fleet owner when you can look up their performance history. Just a thought..it would put an end to "ARTIFICIAL CAPACITY"