Implications of new 34 hour restart rule

[zorry]

We do it legally under the present rules.
The new rule will be a problem.
We will not be stopping for lunch on these loads.
We may be routed to a secure location for these breaks. More likely the shippers will get the rule amended for obvious reasons.
This is more than an expeditor problem. Think Baggett. TriState Motor. AATCO.
There are major carriers,that have friends in high places, that need help on this rule.

 

[davekc]

Ok...that was my point. It is the new rule coming that will create the problem. Not anything under the current ones.

 

[zorry]

The break on the front won't help, unless you can do 8 hr or less shifts of driving. At that point you won't need the break.
On some loads you could drive 8 and your partner MAY be able to start his 8 of driving.
Or,after your 8 you play guard until your partner is ready. You've slowed the trip down by two hours or less each time this happens.
If you do this,worst case is you'll wait two hours for tour partner, but you didn't do a 30 min break, so the net loss is at worst 90 minutes.
Thank you, FMSCA. 8 hour driving shifts for the old man.

 

[zorry]

Any inconvenience can be offset by a raise in revenue.
We'll all be working by the same rules.

 

[turritrans]

I think he was using the max per day calculation....which is extreme to say the least...

Of all you that have commented..How many would have fallen into this situation? and if you did how many times would it have happened?....

Some of our dedicated trucks and team operations are going to have to deal with this issue right away.

Yes I was using the extreme circumstance, I'm sure there are situations we are not even considering yet with this until we all actually put the rule to the log book.

Good points on that 30 minute break with sensitive freight on board.... another issue they did not consider when coming up with these rulings

 

[beachbum]

Here's the 1/2 hour break rule, for people who haul 1.1 1.2 and 1.3 read the last paragraph.

Thirty-Minute Break
Effective July 1, 2013, the hours of service regulations will require that if more than 8 consecutive
hours have passed since the last off-duty (or sleeper-berth) period of at least half an hour, a driver
must take an off-duty break of at least 30 minutes before driving. For example, if the driver started
driving immediately after coming on duty, he or she could drive for 8 consecutive hours, take a halfhour
break, and then drive another 3 hours for a total of 11 hours. In another example, this driver
could drive for 3 hours, take a half-hour break, and then drive another 8 hours, for a total of 11 hours.
Because of this new short break provision, drivers will be able to work 13.5 hours in the 14-hour
period (if they are driving after the 8th hour on duty). The driver must be off duty for at least a half
hour. Meal breaks or any other off-duty time of at least 30 minutes qualifies as a break. This time
does count against the 14-hour driving window, as allowing off-duty time to extend the work day
would allow drivers to drive long past the time when fatigue becomes extreme. In addition, FMCSA
has also added an exception to drivers of commercial motor vehicles carrying Division 1.1, 1.2, or
1.3 explosives to allow them to count on-duty time spent attending the commercial motor vehicle,
but doing no other on-duty work, towards the break. This 30-minute break is further explained in
greater detail throughout this document, particularly as it relates to the 11-hour driving rule.

 

[beachbum]

Phil is correct. As it works now, one of the people in a team is on duty. With putting a break in there, that would be happening while there other is doing their 10 hour sleeping time. That is where the problem is. Two people would be off duty for that 30 minute break. That is a problem on some loads.

Under the old 11/14 hour rule there was NO way a driver could come out of the sleeper to babysit the load while the driver was away from the vehicle and not be on duty. Period. Even with the new rule the same applies except if the driver takes the 30 minute break in the cab of the truck. If at anytime the co driver in the sleeper sits in the front they would still break their sleeper berth time and have to restart.

Read the rules, there never has been an exception to the sleeper berth rule except 2 hours in the jump seat and eight in the sleeper that started last year.

 

[ATeam]

what exact security does a driver provide when a well thought out attack starts?....absolutely none....the drivers are expendable to the bad guys...

This is a difficult topic for drivers in this business to discuss because they are not supposed to discuss such things, and for good reason. Kindly honor their need to maintain their professionalism and their duty to keep their mouths shut.

I provided a link to a public web site to illustrate some of the services offered. I am happy to discuss the regulations that are now part of the public debate. But it is not cool to say much beyond that, nor is it cool to ask.

 

[ATeam]

You forget things like you have to fuel go to the bathroom, eat, take a shower and the list goes on and on.

Heck how do you do it now, because you would have to be cheating already when ever you do any of the above during a run.

Carriers provide guidance to their drivers on this exact thing. Not cheating. Not something wise to disucss here. If you are curious, talk to the people at the carriers that make the rules and train the teams. If they are willing to tell you, fine. I am not. Seriously, you don't want to pop up as someone who is overly interested in such things.

 

[ATeam]

Good points on that 30 minute break with sensitive freight on board.... another issue they did not consider when coming up with these rulings

If they did not consider it, it was only because they chose to ignore the input which was submitted. If they did consider it, it appears the result came because they ignored the input anyway. It pleases me to no end to see one government agency pushing back against another one on this. The DOE is not a union or a trucking company or OOIDA.

They are struggling with a very real problem created by the FMCSA. Hopefully, the FMCSA will see this as a wake-up call and provide a solution not only to DOE trucks and drivers but to all trucks and drivers in a similar predicament. We can't count on that, however. Notice that the DOE is advocating only for itself.

This is about the time where some people like to talk about how important it is to have our voices heard. These developments provide clear evidence that if trucker voices were heard, they were ignored. FMCSA: "I hear what you are saying but we don't care." or "I see your lips are moving, driver, but don't hear a word you say."

Listening sessions, my ***. The FMCSA was told specifically about this issue and what came out of it? An exemption for 1.1, 1.2 and 1.3. They tried really hard, didn't they?

This is a very real problem that easily could have been avoided but it was not avoided, was it?

 

[beachbum]

Phil, maybe you can show me in the regulations where the FMCSA has exempted carriers from the HOS rules for babysitting loads. If there is no exemption then the companies are allowing drivers to
falsify their logs.

I've never read anything in the rules that allows the co driver to leave the sleeper and sit up front and not be on duty, which would break their sleeper berth time and at that point would have to start the sleeper berth over.

 

[ATeam]

Under the old 11/14 hour rule there was NO way a driver could come out of the sleeper to babysit the load while the driver was away from the vehicle and not be on duty. Period.

You are misinformed but I am not at liberty to say more here. Sorry.

 

[paullud]

Phil, maybe you can show me in the regulations where the FMCSA has exempted carriers from the HOS rules for babysitting loads. If there is no exemption then the companies are allowing drivers to
falsify their logs.

I've never read anything in the rules that allows the co driver to leave the sleeper and sit up front and not be on duty, which would break their sleeper berth time and at that point would have to start the sleeper berth over.

The new rules allow it.

 

[zorry]

Beachbum. I see you are with Landstar.
Their safety dept can answer your questions.

 

[beachbum]

You are misinformed but I am not at liberty to say more here. Sorry.

Well will have agree to disagree, you make everything sound like it's top secret...

 

[beachbum]

The new rules allow it.

Read the new rules they allow the split sleeper berth for teams to be 2 off duty in the jump seat and eight hours in the sleeper, just as if a solo driver is doing the split. The 1/2 hour break for 1.1,1.2 and 1.3 is on duty, but you get to use that as your break.

Nowhere, Ive seen does it allow anything else, but I could be wrong. Now if you have a regulation you can post to show me how wrong I am please do. I like learning things for future reference.

 

[beachbum]

Beachbum. I see you are with Landstar.
Their safety dept can answer your questions.

They do, and I get the same answer I posted their is no way around the team split of 2 off and 8 in sleeper or the 1/2 hour on duty for watching loads. I talk to the head of that department every time I go to safety meeting during the truck shows or other BCO events.

 

[xmudman]

I wanna know who the rocket scientist was at the FMCSA who decided that this break had to be taken off-duty. IMHO it should be loggable as on-duty-not-driving. I mean, really: Would it be that much more tiring to be on-duty while you're sitting in the truck eating your lunch & playing Angry Birds on your phone, than it would to be off?

 

[BobWolf]

Our coments dont even get opened not to mention read, discussed, and considered.Just like most laws, regulations, and safety programs made by for and in the best intrest of the unionized, ATA membered, Government subsidized, mega fleet, politician high dollar contributors. I see our job getting more dificult, dangerous, and more invaded by the FMCSA than ever before.

Bob Wolf.

 

[BobWolf]

I wanna know who the rocket scientist was at the FMCSA who decided that this break had to be taken off-duty. IMHO it should be loggable as on-duty-not-driving. I mean, really: Would it be that much more tiring to be on-duty while you're sitting in the truck eating your lunch & playing Angry Birds on your phone, than it would to be off?

Ether way, it still counts against your 14 hours.
Bob Wolf.