Expediter Services leaving E-1
- Thread starter DragonLadyTN
- Start date
If a married couple do 3,000 miles a week....they'll get $1,050 , an unrelated would be half that at $525 a week....for not having any real responsibilities other then just driving, ain;t such a bad gig...for a wheel holder....don't even have to do any logging...just drive.....3,000 should be easy since they get paid ALL miles...
ebsprintin
Veteran Expediter
What I find fascinating about this discussion is the difference in company cultures. The drivers associated with the different companies almost have distinct personalities. FedEx has it's advocates and detractors. Load One is llike a rolling party. And here is ES--everyone is a wallflower until this week. I just find it interesting. Look at how different the carrier forums have developed.
eb
eb
paullud
Veteran Expediter
What about Bolt drivers like you and I? We always speak our minds I guess.
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Opinionated...Bolt Drivers...you, EB and Rlent...
commonly referred to as Boltheads....LOL
ebsprintin
Veteran Expediter
The Bolt carrier forum sums it up. The only conversations there are boltheads asking why no one hangs out there.
eb
eb
paullud
Veteran Expediter
Yeah and then the ones that complain about no one hanging out there never check back to see that people have responded.
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No. And especially no to "anyone" in the context you attempted to pigeonhole me into right there.
I said no already.
Yeah, that one.
People with ES call themselves independent contractors. They also tend to talk, and by reasonable inference think (whether you agree with it or not) like employees. They will tell you that making the decision to go to work for ES was a good, if not great business decision. Most of the fawning over ES is all about what ES does for the drivers and how, essentially, a lot of the decision-making is removed from the drivers and transferred to ES thus creating a comfortable safety net (at a price, tho). For example, "IF you ever have an issue with them OR FDCC, all it takes is ONE PHONE CALL to your E.S. dispatcher/Liason and within minutes the issue is resolved, no matter what the issue is." So, if you have a problem with FDCC, ES will fight your battles for you. They will give you empty moves out of bad areas, something you don't have to concern yourself with on your own. They will tell you when and where to get repairs done, no effort on your part required.
Having no safety net is having your own authority. Leasing on with a carrier provides a safety net, which is I believe what jdevidts was referring to with the jockstrap metaphor, and for which you pay a significant amount of money. Adding another layer of jockstrap safety net on top of that, and paying a significant premium for it, is quite the safety net, indeed, especially for an independent contractor.
OK, in that context, jdevidts notes and questions the thick irony of an independent contractor with the safety net of a virtual employee who also thinks like an employee. You can't dismiss the terminology as simply being a longstanding familiarity with the terminology, as the language is very consistent across all posters, and the issues they discuss (the ones that are particularly wonderful) are the very issues and decisions that employers handle for their employees. Drivers who drive for a fleet owner, even those who are used to thinking like an employee, overwhelming use phrases like, "I drive for an owner," not "I work for an owner".
"put in an application and come join the rest of us that are PROUD of whom we work for... FYI; I DO NOT work in the office of E.O. or FDCC, I am a driver, 12 1/2 year veteran with T/T and Expedite, PROUD of what I do and PROUD of whom I work for."
"I worked for them for 6 months..."
"I have worked WITH them since 2008. We have worked for other "so called" Fleet Owners at Panther and been taken to the CLEANERS & LIED too, but working for Expediter Services has been the best experience we have had over ALL!!!!"
These are quotes from people who know the difference, or at least should, yet they consistently use the language of an employee. Others have consistently done the same in these forums in the past.
So we've got independent contractors who talk like employees and have a dual safety net for which they pay through the nose. They talk of discounts, which quite frankly any fleet or truck owner could provide at 35%. The drivers are literally paying themselves for those discounts out of money they should have gotten in the first place, and most of the discounts come directly from the carrier, anyway. But it's a great and smart business decision to go to work for them.
So again, in that context, they open themselves up to (i.e., provoking), as you put it, an unprovoked attack on their thoughts, just reeking of condescension, and it's why I said it wasn't really unprovoked, since they opened the door for that context.
So, to answer your original question again, now in the proper context, no, I am not saying that anyone who is 'just a driver' is making poor business decisions and therefore provoking contempt and ridicule from the members who feel their own business decisions are superior. What I am saying is that ES drivers have been by and large hoodwinked into thinking that going with ES is one of the best, if not the best business decision that can be made by a driver in this industry. Granted, there are some people who need that dual safety net and prefer many of their decisions be made for them, and for those people ES may very well be the perfect place and the best business decision they'll ever make. But for that many drivers to use the same phrasing patterns, language and questionable enthusiasm about "working" for ES, while in the process of advocating that others make the same decision, opens them up to all manner of ridicule and condescension, as it smacks of either mass delusion or well structured indoctrination, blatant recruiting, or planted shills.
Reading all the above...How the heck can ES even lay claim to independent driver operators...they look to be spoon fed and babysat.....they decide little...go here, do this...and so on...gee whiz...they'd have a good case to be employees in the IRS eyes..
FREE TO FAIL
Seasoned Expediter
Well Ontariovanman, can you tell me what the deductions are out of that money? 1050 per week for a team but what do they have to pay? Workmans comp? Knock off 80 bucks a week for the pair.... other deductions like prepass, advance fees or some other crap? even if it was free and clear 1k doesnt seem like enough to make it worth while, life on the road aint cheap....
Additionally what do you figure the per hour driving rate is? I figure it is about 18 bucks an hour assuming that you can average 55 miles per hour, for just driving time no sit time. Again thats assuming you get the full 1050. I just want to open a discussion so people can get an idea on what to really expect. I dont consider 18 dollars an hour a good rate for otr drivers.
Additionally what do you figure the per hour driving rate is? I figure it is about 18 bucks an hour assuming that you can average 55 miles per hour, for just driving time no sit time. Again thats assuming you get the full 1050. I just want to open a discussion so people can get an idea on what to really expect. I dont consider 18 dollars an hour a good rate for otr drivers.
Re: OOPs, Typo-s
I have thought about this post and I have thought back over the years of drivers I have talked with. There are no complaints about the company, they pay on time, they answer the phones, they give guidance when needed, their loads are available to the driver to make a decision on where to go after they deliver. I have heard their fuel discounts are deeper then what we are getting, their insurance is cheaper then what I am getting.
The complaints that I have heard are:
The sleepers do not have enough storage room...
They did not micro manage me enough and I was not sure what loads to take are turn down. This was followed up with the question have they ever said anything to you about the loads you take? The answer was NO.
And I could not get the truck washed as often as I would like.
What I have heard is the company is open with you on what their trucks are doing and where to go after a load is delivered.
I have thought about this post and I have thought back over the years of drivers I have talked with. There are no complaints about the company, they pay on time, they answer the phones, they give guidance when needed, their loads are available to the driver to make a decision on where to go after they deliver. I have heard their fuel discounts are deeper then what we are getting, their insurance is cheaper then what I am getting.
The complaints that I have heard are:
The sleepers do not have enough storage room...
They did not micro manage me enough and I was not sure what loads to take are turn down. This was followed up with the question have they ever said anything to you about the loads you take? The answer was NO.
And I could not get the truck washed as often as I would like.
What I have heard is the company is open with you on what their trucks are doing and where to go after a load is delivered.
Good point about the personal deductions they flew right over my head...
and about the per hour rate...I don't log.I can't really say but down here us lowlys, most consider to be on duty 24/7 unless OOS officially..so the per hour rate sucks in the big picture..
skipr4520
Seasoned Expediter
wolf in lambs clothing
first off, i could agree that it could be a "wolf in sheeps clothing". secondly, i could agree that "every other company i have worked for....." but, this is MY experience, NO ONE ELSES! YOUR experiences may vary from mine or it may be the same, irrelevant. i have been driving OTR 12 1/2 yrs in an 18 wheeler, but am new to a short expediter truck (4 months) also, yes, i am new to this site AND I dont "generally" reply to topics, as i said, BUT these are MY experiences. YES, ALL carriers/fleet owners.....are generally nice in the beginning and do what they have to do to get you on board, but AFTER that, MOST companies/dispatchers.....could care less to E-V-E-R hear from you again and if they do, its generally for a negative reason, not a good reason. Does the company u work for call you and tell you "your doing a great job and keep up the good work?" Or, do they only call or qualcomm you when your late or doing something wrong?! I AM NOT an office worker, E.S. staff, FDCC staff or whatever, I am a team driver happy with my fleet owner. At this point, as long as i have been employed by E.S., I have YET to have ANY TYPE of bad experience with E.S. BUT, as i said twice previous, this is MY experience with them, no one elses. If the person you work for is or has been giving you "attitude" or "always hateful" then its time to move on to one that doesnt, as I have done. I dont get the attitude when they have had bad days, we all have bad days, E.S just doesnt take it out on the drivers. Anyone can say what to bout E.S., they have that right, BUT some peple just like DRAMA in their life, I dont. Some people always SLAM and pick apart other peoples posts just to keep the drama going irregardless of the topic. If you really want to know how a E.S., FDCC driver truly feels, ask them in person when you see them.
first off, i could agree that it could be a "wolf in sheeps clothing". secondly, i could agree that "every other company i have worked for....." but, this is MY experience, NO ONE ELSES! YOUR experiences may vary from mine or it may be the same, irrelevant. i have been driving OTR 12 1/2 yrs in an 18 wheeler, but am new to a short expediter truck (4 months) also, yes, i am new to this site AND I dont "generally" reply to topics, as i said, BUT these are MY experiences. YES, ALL carriers/fleet owners.....are generally nice in the beginning and do what they have to do to get you on board, but AFTER that, MOST companies/dispatchers.....could care less to E-V-E-R hear from you again and if they do, its generally for a negative reason, not a good reason. Does the company u work for call you and tell you "your doing a great job and keep up the good work?" Or, do they only call or qualcomm you when your late or doing something wrong?! I AM NOT an office worker, E.S. staff, FDCC staff or whatever, I am a team driver happy with my fleet owner. At this point, as long as i have been employed by E.S., I have YET to have ANY TYPE of bad experience with E.S. BUT, as i said twice previous, this is MY experience with them, no one elses. If the person you work for is or has been giving you "attitude" or "always hateful" then its time to move on to one that doesnt, as I have done. I dont get the attitude when they have had bad days, we all have bad days, E.S just doesnt take it out on the drivers. Anyone can say what to bout E.S., they have that right, BUT some peple just like DRAMA in their life, I dont. Some people always SLAM and pick apart other peoples posts just to keep the drama going irregardless of the topic. If you really want to know how a E.S., FDCC driver truly feels, ask them in person when you see them.
paullud
Veteran Expediter
These are questions and not attacks, you said "as long as I have been employed by E.S." Are you an employee or an independent contractor? Do you have weekly deductions? Your favorite thing about ES seems to be the way you are treated, when I was a truck driver I was motivated more by money and home time than what the people in the office did. I loved the office people at my first company but did not like the people at the second company I went to but the pay was better and home time was better so I wasn't going back. Why would a person on the other end of the phone or Qualcomm make you take less pay?
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anyone ever met some of the stellar drivers out there? I mean some of them are dump as a stump..not just ES either..why besides being a steering wheel holder are they even driving?
paullud
Veteran Expediter
now with EOBR they don't even have to draw the lines...LOL the quality is dropping....LOL
paullud
Veteran Expediter
Man back when I was a trucker I didn't even have a ruler to draw a straight line, these kids today don't know how lucky they are.
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