Waterboarding is torture says McCain

[AMonger]

I'll see your State Department Counselor Philip Zelikow , former Deputy Secretary of State, Richard Armitage, former Homeland Security Chief Tom Ridge, former head of the Office of Legal Counsel Jack Goldsmith, General David Petraeus, General Ricardo Sanchez, FBI Director Robert Mueller and Susan J. Crawford.

And raise you the resident windbag at FoxNews Sean Hannity, I'm only on T.V. because of my father, Liz Cheney, an overrated political moron who has a corporatist news network at his disposal, Karl Rove, the delusional, deceptive and war criminals, Donald Rumsfeld, G.W. Bush and I shot a man in the face Cheney, the tantalizing, empty headed Fox political analyst, Andrea Tantaras and the woman with an adam's apple who likens waterboarding to hazing, Ann Coulter.

Hannity's not a raise...he's a lowering. That's like being in an actual card game and saying, "I'll see your $20,000 and squat down and produce a turd and raise you that."

--

You know the problem with bad cops? They make the other 5% look bad.

 

[Tennesseahawk]

Hannity's not a raise...he's a lowering. That's like being in an actual card game and saying, "I'll see your $20,000 and squat down and produce a turd and raise you that."

--

You know the problem with bad cops? They make the other 5% look bad.

OMG! If I had read this a couple of minutes ago, there'd be mac n cheese all over the screen!

 

[MCGohio1985]

We are fighting an unconventional war to my knowledge the taldian and al queda was not a apart of the genea convention so in my so opinion waterboard or pull there finger nails of or whatever else u can think of to keep are men and woman over seas and are country safe.

Posted with my Droid EO Forum App

 

[purgoose10]

I don't understand all the fuss about Water Boarding. Yes it's torture, So what? It's been proven that we waterboarded a total of 5 Al Quada guys and they were the leaders and organizers of the 9-11 attack. So if it's torture than bring it on. Kill'em all and let God sort it out. No body has said a word about them cutting heads off our press reporter or others, is that torture? I watched that tape and it took them 5 minutes to decapite that reporter. Oh my I don't want to hurt their feelings.

 

[LDB]

It is a terribly unpleasant activity but one leaves with the same number of fingers and toes one arrives with. For that matter one even leaves with the same number of fingernails and toenails one arrives with. It isn't torture. I'll still pass on trying that or police pepper spray.

 

[Ragman]

I don't understand all the fuss about Water Boarding. Yes it's torture, So what? It's been proven that we waterboarded a total of 5 Al Quada guys and they were the leaders and organizers of the 9-11 attack. So if it's torture than bring it on. Kill'em all and let God sort it out. No body has said a word about them cutting heads off our press reporter or others, is that torture? I watched that tape and it took them 5 minutes to decapite that reporter. Oh my I don't want to hurt their feelings.

It's not about hurting their feelings, it's about being better than that.

I, for one, do not want to lower ourselves to that level.

 

[cheri1122]

It's not about hurting their feelings, it's about bring better than that.

BINGO!

I, for one, do not want to lower ourselves to that level.

It's about adhering to principles in word and deed, and wanting the US to BE better than those we oppose.
Real patriotism isn't cheering the soldiers & waving the flag, it's demanding the leaders of our country do the right thing and obey the law - even when they think they can disguise truth with sophistry. "Enhanced interrogation" is torture, "extreme rendition" is kidnapping & murder, and calling it something else doesn't make a garbageman a sanitary engineer.

 

[LDB]

We only sink to their level if we torture children and innocents. Harshly interrogating terrorists is NOTHING like being at their level. Harshly interrogating terrorists is also nothing like torturing them although were they alive even torturing bin Laden or al Said or other top terrorists would not put us at their level either.

 

[layoutshooter]

We only sink to their level if we torture children and innocents. Harshly interrogating terrorists is NOTHING like being at their level. Harshly interrogating terrorists is also nothing like torturing them although were they alive even torturing bin Laden or al Said or other top terrorists would not put us at their level either.

It is often those who have never had the responsibility of keeping others safe that rattle off the most. I wonder, IF we could have used "harshness" to stop the attacks on 9/11, who would or would not? I wonder, how loud some would rattle about not doing enough to stop those attacks? All from the safety provided by the very people that they ridicule.

 

[davekc]

If by chance I was in a situation to save 3000 of my fellow citizens and time was limited in securing information to save lives, it is a no-brainer assuming you have exhausted all other options.
I would gladly drop to whatever level to get it done.
No need to complicate the simple or "worry about hurting someones feelings".

 

[Ragman]

It is often those who have never had the responsibility of keeping others safe that rattle off the most. I wonder, IF we could have used "harshness" to stop the attacks on 9/11, who would or would not? I wonder, how loud some would rattle about not doing enough to stop those attacks? All from the safety provided by the very people that they ridicule.

Come on now, being harsh is a whole different thing than torture.

Please don't think I am in any way ridiculing anybody. I have the utmost respect for anybody that serves his/her country.

 

[layoutshooter]

Come on now, being harsh is a whole different thing than torture.

Please don't think I am in any way ridiculing anybody. I have the utmost respect for anybody that serves his/her country.

I did not name anyone nor did I imply anyone in particular.

I would do anything that I could think of if it would save lives. I learned that when fighting forest fires that one of the best tools we had was more fire. I would fight this war with any "fire" I needed to win. There are only winners and losers in war. The dead lost. The living win. This is nothing in between. What ever it takes.

 

[cheri1122]

It is often those who have never had the responsibility of keeping others safe that rattle off the most. I wonder, IF we could have used "harshness" to stop the attacks on 9/11, who would or would not? I wonder, how loud some would rattle about not doing enough to stop those attacks? All from the safety provided by the very people that they ridicule.

So, who is the 'they' to whom you refer? Because I haven't seen or heard the slightest hint of ridicule here [or anywhere] on this subject...Fact: it was torture when the Japanese did it to our soldiers, and they were prosecuted for it. Ditto for the Texas sheriff - illegal, prosecuted, sentenced to jail for torturing people.
Illegal is illegal, immoral is immoral - word games don't change eternal verities, no matter how clever they are.

As long as we're throwing catchy slogans around, here's my favorite: War doesn't prove who's right, just who's left.

 

[layoutshooter]

It is often those who have never had the responsibility of keeping others safe that rattle off the most. I wonder, IF we could have used "harshness" to stop the attacks on 9/11, who would or would not? I wonder, how loud some would rattle about not doing enough to stop those attacks? All from the safety provided by the very people that they ridicule.

So, who is the 'they' to whom you refer? Because I haven't seen or heard the slightest hint of ridicule here [or anywhere] on this subject...Fact: it was torture when the Japanese did it to our soldiers, and they were prosecuted for it. Ditto for the Texas sheriff - illegal, prosecuted, sentenced to jail for torturing people.
Illegal is illegal, immoral is immoral - word games don't change eternal verities, no matter how clever they are.

As long as we're throwing catchy slogans around, here's my favorite: War doesn't prove who's right, just who's left.

OK, you know that Hitler, Stalin, etc, are going to kill MILLIONS of people. You have a chance to learn how to stop them, You have to torture one man to get the information. Then kill them before they kill the 50-80 million that they killed. Would you do it? I would. Is one or two lives worth more that the millions that were lost? THAT is the choices made every day. Could you make that choice?

 

[layoutshooter]

OK, here is one from my world. My job, for 5 years, was targeting our nukes. If I had too I would have did my best to wipe out as many Russians, military and otherwise, as I could. At a moments, notice. I could do it, could you? That is the reality of the world. It was no different when I was an EMT. The term there was most salvageable. I made that choice, in less than a minute. Life, and death, is tough and real. Not fairy tale books.

 

[greg334]

There is a moral imperative that we protect our own first.

There are times we have to look at what can be done to limit the damage to ourselves and the people we care for, no body in their right mind would allow someone to harm someone they love by being passive unless they have strong religious convictions and even then it may not be enough to restrain them.

If my family was put in harms way to make a political statement - which most terrorism is - then I expect every measure taken to secure my family and to stop it from happening within the confines of laws of my country.

 

[tbubster]

They hijack planes fly them into buildings killing thousands of people.They strap bombs unto woman then have them go to U.S check points and blow themselfs up killing hundreds of people.They load cars up with bombs and drive them into busy shopping plazas and blow themselfs up killing hundreds of people.They target women and children.This one is easy for them to do because they know they can blend in with them and not fear the us because they know in a square full of women and children we will not just start shoting.They capture our guys and use real torture on them then slowly cut their heads off while viedo tapping it to use it as a recruiting tool.

We strap a terrorist to a table and pour water over their heads and face,yep that is the same thing.That is lowering ourself to their level.

On Mar 26, 2001, a Palestinian sniper took aim at 10 month old Shalhevet Pass, who was sitting in her stroller. She was fatally shot in the head. This was hardly an “accident.” She was the target, even though her father was standing right beside her.

May 9, 2001 — Yossi Ish-Ran, 14, and Kobi Mandell, 14 , both of Tekoa, were savagely beaten to death with stones in a cave about 200 meters from the small community south of Jerusalem where they lived.

Everyone can feel how they want but for anyone to say waterboarding is the same as what the terrorist do is just wrong.

 

[cheri1122]

OK, you know that Hitler, Stalin, etc, are going to kill MILLIONS of people. You have a chance to learn how to stop them, You have to torture one man to get the information. Then kill them before they kill the 50-80 million that they killed. Would you do it? I would. Is one or two lives worth more that the millions that were lost? THAT is the choices made every day. Could you make that choice?

Answering a question with a question is a distracting technique- I asked you a question first, please answer it.
Who is ridiculing whom?

 

[layoutshooter]

Answering a question with a question is a distracting technique- I asked you a question first, please answer it.
Who is ridiculing whom?

I already did, several posts ago. Do I need to answer twice? Any who, assuming you just missed it. I said that I was talking about no one in particular, just speaking in general.

 

[Ragman]

Everyone can feel how they want but for anyone to say waterboarding is the same as what the terrorist do is just wrong.

Nobody has ever remotely equated waterboarding with the cowardly acts of terrorism.

What we are saying is that it is torture.