Title in Limbo

Tennesseahawk · Aug 13, 2007

I just bought a truck in FL, and the title is still in the hands of the former owner's financing co. I called MI Sec of State, and they said I need the title to register it. The dealer I bought it from told me the bill of sale would do. He was wrong. I feel like an idiot for not making sure everything was in order before the sale, so I don't need comments on that, thanx.

Does anyone know how to get these ppl moving on the title? I'm not making any money, and it's pizzing me off.

-Vampire Super Slooth Trucker!!!

davekc · Aug 13, 2007

A bill of sale only will work if you are going to title and register it in the same state.
If you finance it, your finance company will pursue the title for you. If you paid cash, then you will have to call his finance company directly, and have them overnight the original to you. They must have their payoff funds available to them before they will proceed.
If they haven't recieved the payoff, then you have to get the dealer to pay it off.
In future circumstances as you have found, get the title at the time of sale. Usually the dealer will have it overnighted, or if the finance company is local, they will send a courier to get it.
Always a worthwhile step just in case there is a lein on it.
Hope that helps

Davekc
owner
23 years
PantherII
EO moderator

x06col · Aug 13, 2007

Yep when I buy a truck, the cash goes across the desk north, and the title goes across the desk south, meet in the middle at the same time. Not negotiable!! You can rest assured, that they have your money, and will have no sense of urgency. Tuff to push a chain.

FireGears · Aug 13, 2007

YIKES..!!!!

"Title in limbo" and more trips to the DMV

It would probably be easier to be facing
a sentence of "Death by 1000 Cuts"..!!!

Hope all goes smoothly and QUICKLY..

STAY FROSTY..

plus ...

Wingnut · Aug 13, 2007

Try contacting the state attorneys general for that state and explain the situation. They are usually great about helping in these kind of situations.

You also could go thru the phone book (I know it's a pain) and call a lawyer or 2 and see what they tell you. Most lawyers will give you free advice VIA phone call on how to go about handling this situation yourself. This way you won't have big lawyer bills. I've used this method often over the years. Good luck!!!!

rollnthunder · Aug 13, 2007

IS this a commercial vehicle?If so how did you transport it home with no plates.I bought my straight truck in florida and i had to get a temp in florida and get permits to legally transport it home.Then i had to go to irp and transfer the title here in michigan.

x06col · Aug 13, 2007

Hey roll'in, what's that got to do with his dilema?? He want's to learn how to push that chain.

Tennesseahawk · Aug 13, 2007

Thunder... I got a temp plate from the dealer to bring it home.

Talked to the salesman who is dealing with the owner's finance company, who holds the title. He said it's a fight, but believes we'll be in business in one to two more days. Otherwise, he said it's normal to take a few days when dealing between two finance companies.

I'm wondering if the owner did not notify his finance company until the sale was done, and therefore the company is taking their normal time to process. Otherwise, his company should've had everything ready to go once they got paid. The reason I say this is because in my contract, I have to notice my company 10 days prior to selling the truck. So, it's either lack of initiative on the owner's part, or lack of motivation on his bank's part.

Thanx for the help. I'm hoping I'll be on the road in a couple days.

-Vampire Super Slooth Trucker!!!

x06col · Aug 13, 2007

More than likely the owner, was wonder'in if the buyer was really going to show up. I've had a number of false alarms with these truck buyers and expediters myself. So, you know the story, sumpin bout the whites of their eyes.

greg334 · Aug 13, 2007

T-Hawk,
First thing is, the people at SOS is full of sh**, you do not need a title, a bill of sale will work but in order for you to do this the right way, you need to call the owner and have them get a letter of release from the finance company â€“ no other thing will work, when they contact Florida, there will be a lean on the title and nothing will change that fact except a letter to release the title from the lean.

Also do not go to a regular SOS, go to the one in Canton, on Ford road west of 275 - like a super wal-mart of SOS's. They seem to help with problems like this but the alternative (which you may have to do for your plates) is to go to Lansing to the place they issue titles and get the title there. you may also have to have the state police inspect the VIN of the truck, the form they will give you at the SOS for this is pretty straight forward and has to be signed by the police.

The other thing is, in Michigan you â€˜applyâ€™ for a title, you do not
â€˜transferâ€™ a title especially vehicles from out of state. They streamlined the process but it is basically the same and I have done it hundreds of times. Many states have laws (like New Hampshire) that if the vehicle is 25 years or older, no title will be issued, they accept a bill of sale for plates. I always had problems with the idiots at SOS and got a hold of their little rule book when I was buying cars out of state to know what is needed to get passed the idiocy there. I have had a few arguments with the dumb person at the desk and always won.

Oh if the owner will not get the letter for you, I think driving the truck back to Florida to the dealer and taking them to court for selling it without the permission of the finance company may be the last thing you can do.

ATeam · Aug 13, 2007

Tennesseahawk,

A while ago, you mentioned a blown engine in one of your posts. Perhaps I got it all wrong, but your post came across as humor instead of something more serious. When I read it, I did not believe your engine blew. I thought you were kidding. Now, you are talking about a new truck. Did you have a blown engine? Are you buying a new truck because of it?

Also, blown engine or not, new trucks are fun to hear about. Please tell us about your new ride.

highway star · Aug 13, 2007

Greg, if Hawk plans to keep the truck titled in Florida he will need to take the title to Lansing to register it. My truck is titled in Ohio and I was able to avoid sales tax that way. That eliminates the stop at the local SOS office. It's also a perfectly legal loophole. My name and address are on the title and the folks in Lansing told me they had no problem with it. Michigan wants sales tax on your first truck purchase and then it's tax free after that.

greg334 · Aug 13, 2007

Ken,
I am truly puzzled about the taxes that you mentioned, it was mentioned somewhere else too.

I paid $0 in taxes, not a dime - I paid the IRP fees and the transfer fees but not a dime for the 'Use Tax' (it is illegal for Michigan to actually charge a sales tax on a vehicle, Mich Supreme Court determined that in the early 90's and it has not been changed except they call it a sales tax).

What I was told at both the IRP, the SOS offices and when I called Lansing that in my case, over 26K but under 54K and use the vehicle for interstate commerce, I pay no use tax on the purchase of the vehicle. This was signed into law by the old ****** herself to bring michigan into the 21st century.

In T-Hawk's case, he is also buying a used vehicle for the use of interstate commerce which is the same case as I had.

Phil,
T-hawk may correct me but I think that the international he was driving for someone else had a motor issue and this triggered the purchase of a new 'used' truck.

davekc · Aug 13, 2007

Star,
If you leased the truck to a carrier, then it is exempt for that year.
You either have to have a copy of the lease and or a letter of intent from the carrier depending on the state.
I would file a addendum to your registration to get a refund on that tax money that you paid on the first truck. There should be no tax paid if used in interstate commerce.
I don't believe I have ever paid any sales tax on a commercial vehicle.
There is an exception in TX and I believe AR, for property tax. I don't know all the perameters on that, but Leo might have some idea. I believe that law went into effect 5 or 6 years ago.

Davekc
owner
23 years
PantherII
EO moderator

easyrider2697 · Aug 13, 2007

>Star,
>If you leased the truck to a carrier, then it is exempt for
>that year.
>You either have to have a copy of the lease and or a letter
>of intent from the carrier depending on the state.
>I would file a addendum to your registration to get a refund
>on that tax money that you paid on the first truck. There
>should be no tax paid if used in interstate commerce.
>I don't believe I have ever paid any sales tax on a
>commercial vehicle.
>There is an exception in TX and I believe AR, for property
>tax. I don't know all the perameters on that, but Leo might
>have some idea. I believe that law went into effect 5 or 6
>years ago.
>
>
Please tell me of this addendum, I just had to pay sales tax on my truck when it was transferred in June almost 2000 in sales tax, truck has been leased to panther for over a yr..would be nice to get my money back
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>Davekc
>owner
>23 years
>PantherII
>EO moderator

Tennesseahawk · Aug 13, 2007

Ateam... no, I was not kidding about the blown engine. Greg is right. I was driving a truck for someone else, and the engine blew around 254k miles. Surprisingly, I found the same kind of truck for sale on the EO classifieds. Everything that went wrong with our truck went wrong with the truck for sale. Turbo, water pump, a/c, and engine (around 200k). It's not a coincidence in my mind. From now on, it's class 8 for me.

I applied for financing on one truck, in NJ. Everything was ready to go, until I was notified the true miles were more than 500,000 more than the odometer mileage, which is around 340k. Nix on that. Then I applied for a 2001 Century with around 500,000 on it. Signed the paperwork, drove it home, and that's where I'm at... waiting on the financing company.

I've actually heard of horror stories like this... a finance company dragging their arse, and causing misery to the buyer. Usually, that was with home buyers.

-Vampire Super Slooth Trucker!!!

Doggie Daddy · Aug 13, 2007

>Ateam... no, I was not kidding about the blown engine. Greg
>is right. I was driving a truck for someone else, and the
>engine blew around 254k miles. Surprisingly, I found the
>same kind of truck for sale on the EO classifieds.
>Everything that went wrong with our truck went wrong with
>the truck for sale. Turbo, water pump, a/c, and engine
>(around 200k). It's not a coincidence in my mind. From now
>on, it's class 8 for me.

And I hate to say that I tried to warn you,but I tried to warn you.I just hope that you decided not to buy the truck,as I know that you were thinking about doing last year.DD.

Tennesseahawk · Aug 14, 2007

DD... I didn't buy that truck. Funny thing too. I was talking to the owner about buying it just before it broke down. The owner doesn't remember our first conversation where he said he would co-sign, so he tried to find someone to finance me. Even the engine going didn't deter me. I would get a truck with a new engine... what could be better?

The owner of the exact same kind of truck, International 7500 Alumibunk special, who had the exact same kind of problems, basically made me rethink that. Not to sound mean here, but I'm glad it broke down before the owner found me financing. I don't want a truck that a head mechanic at an International dealer admitted about them putting junk in those trucks. Not built for long haul, therefore, not good expediters.

-Vampire Super Slooth Trucker!!!

ATeam · Aug 14, 2007

So, just so I understand, with this purchase, you are making the transition from fleet driver to owner-operator, correct?

Tennesseahawk · Aug 14, 2007

Been an o/o before, under a lease-purchase. To put it kindly, it didn't work out. This time around it's soley on me to make this work, and I have no doubts about doing that.

-Vampire Super Slooth Trucker!!!