clcooper
Expert Expediter
thank goodness we have homes on wheels, when the system finally breaks, there will be a roof over our heads.IMHO
or you can find a FEMA Camp
The Obama Record
- Thread starter Pilgrim
- Start date
or you can find a FEMA Camp
clcooper
Expert Expediter
or beside the missing watergate tapes.
clcooper
Expert Expediter
but what choices do the voters get to vote on . if the voters have a choose the peice of crap or that peice of crap . how are they going to vote for anybody better .
Tennesseahawk
Veteran Expediter
To quote Mencken: "Democracy is the theory that the common people know what they want, and deserve to get it good and hard!"
Only problem is, the those in the minority don't deserve this.
Just an additional fact or two to point out (bold emphasis mine):
The one thing that's glaringly different about Obama's recession compared to Carter's is interest rates. Right now interest rates are near zero, while in the 1970s they were near 20%. I personally had a money market account in the mid '70s that paid 17% interest. Retirees right now living on fixed income and that depend on interest bearing accounts for their retirement are lucky to get 1.5%. CDs are paying .15% - that's FIFTEEN ONE-HUNDREDTHS OF ONE PERCENT. They may as well keep their money in a coffee can buried in their garden.
Keep in mind, if interest rates were anywhere near where they should be, the national debt burden would have already smothered the economy into depression.
Now who is it that wants four more years of this kind of economic management?
witness23
Veteran Expediter
What else happened in 1982 under Reagan? You can read it hear: FactCheck.org: Treasury Tax Expert to Bush: Clinton's Increase WASN'T The Biggest.
excerpt from the article:
I give Reagan credit for lowering taxes when he first took the Oval Office, but he did raise taxes 11 times while he held that office. Because the tax rate was to low, they had to be risen. I give him and our Representives credit for using common-sense and doing what was right for the American people.
Fast-Forward to the present. You have President Obama doing the exact same thing, keeping the Bush Tax Cuts in place when he took office, which is a tax cut. They were set to expire in 2010 and he extended them. Now it is time to let them expire, call it a tax hike or whatever, but it would essentially be the same thing Reagan did. Although, Obama would extend those tax breaks to those making under 200-250,000. That's where he made his mistake because that gave the Republicans to cry about class-warfare He should've just let all of them expire.
Yeah, yeah, I hear ya......"What about our spending, it's out of control?" I agree, spending cuts have to be made (4 trillion would've been a good start) and the Bush Tax Cuts allowed to expire. Not just for those making over 200 & 250,000, all of them.
And I blame Obama for not making that happen, but I do give him some wiggle room because of the lunatics that he is dealing with. Reagan had responsible men and woman to work with. Obama, not so much, he's dealing with an entirely different animal.
I know, I know "entitlements", well I know most in the soapbox and these members in Congress right now want those programs gone. Well, this is what we have, just like Reagan had what he had, deal with it for now.
I've been wanting to say this but haven't had the chance. We get it, you want to get rid of S.S., Medicare, Medicaid, Education and Welfare altogether, fine. It's not going to happen, atleast not the way you want it to happen. It will take time and patience and a whole lot of citizens getting involved with their Representitives. The U.S. would and will be in the same perdicament if their was a Republican in office if he had to deal Democrats acting like the Republicans are now.
This is all about making Obama a one term President and putting party over the people no matter the consequences. It's about signing idiotic petitions that won't allow you to negotiate, but that's a whole 'nother story. The Republicans are scared sh*tless that if anything at all makes this President look like he's done anything remotely well, it will cost them the election in 2012, and d@mmit, they're just not going to let that happen, no matter the consequences we, the American people, have to endure.
excerpt from the article:
I give Reagan credit for lowering taxes when he first took the Oval Office, but he did raise taxes 11 times while he held that office. Because the tax rate was to low, they had to be risen. I give him and our Representives credit for using common-sense and doing what was right for the American people.
Fast-Forward to the present. You have President Obama doing the exact same thing, keeping the Bush Tax Cuts in place when he took office, which is a tax cut. They were set to expire in 2010 and he extended them. Now it is time to let them expire, call it a tax hike or whatever, but it would essentially be the same thing Reagan did. Although, Obama would extend those tax breaks to those making under 200-250,000. That's where he made his mistake because that gave the Republicans to cry about class-warfare
He should've just let all of them expire. Yeah, yeah, I hear ya......"What about our spending, it's out of control?" I agree, spending cuts have to be made (4 trillion would've been a good start) and the Bush Tax Cuts allowed to expire. Not just for those making over 200 & 250,000, all of them.
And I blame Obama for not making that happen, but I do give him some wiggle room because of the lunatics that he is dealing with. Reagan had responsible men and woman to work with. Obama, not so much, he's dealing with an entirely different animal.
I know, I know "entitlements", well I know most in the soapbox and these members in Congress right now want those programs gone. Well, this is what we have, just like Reagan had what he had, deal with it for now.
I've been wanting to say this but haven't had the chance. We get it, you want to get rid of S.S., Medicare, Medicaid, Education and Welfare altogether, fine. It's not going to happen, atleast not the way you want it to happen. It will take time and patience and a whole lot of citizens getting involved with their Representitives. The U.S. would and will be in the same perdicament if their was a Republican in office if he had to deal Democrats acting like the Republicans are now.
This is all about making Obama a one term President and putting party over the people no matter the consequences. It's about signing idiotic petitions that won't allow you to negotiate, but that's a whole 'nother story. The Republicans are scared sh*tless that if anything at all makes this President look like he's done anything remotely well, it will cost them the election in 2012, and d@mmit, they're just not going to let that happen, no matter the consequences we, the American people, have to endure.
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tbubster
Seasoned Expediter
more democrats voted to extend the tax cuts then republicans.not something they admit.look at the record.the cuts Obama is willing to make do not take effect for 8 years.the tax cuts expire next year.why are the democrats making such a big deal out of it.If the tax cuts are really that big of a demand for democrats maybe they should not have voted to extend them and let them run out last year
Its funny how people on the left admit that there need to be changes to welfare.yet when the right points out ideas the left says the changes dont do enough,so that plan is no good.LIke people from the left on here have said when talking about republicans It has to start somewhere!!
Its funny how people on the left admit that there need to be changes to welfare.yet when the right points out ideas the left says the changes dont do enough,so that plan is no good.LIke people from the left on here have said when talking about republicans It has to start somewhere!!
Tennesseahawk
Veteran Expediter
Big difference between Reagan and Obama raising taxes. Reagan signed his hikes when the recession was over. Obama wants hikes while we're in a depression.
witness23
Veteran Expediter
paullud
Veteran Expediter
Are you referring to TEFRA? I know that passed in late '82 but was designed to close loopholes. I am not saying you are wrong I just can't think of anything else.
Posted with my Droid EO Forum App
I remember being in the DARK AGES during carter and REAGAN starting to rebuild this country- 600 ship NAVY and more, I serviced the ships at PORTSMOUTH DRYDOCKS back then.. and REAGAN did much more to REBUILD this country and destroy the EVIL Empire as well.. boy obumer is rebuilding?????????????? his poll numbers
SORO'S Cable news. Making the ignorant.....confident.
witness23
Veteran Expediter
Go away kid, you're bothering me.
Numerous times you have called forum members kid and that term is condescending. I'm sure no one likes to be called it so please stop.
NEVER!! Ain't going to happen, not until they pull my cold dead finger off my mouse..
SORO'S Cable news. Making the ignorant.....confident.
Keep in mind that Factcheck.org is an extension of the Annenberg Public Policy Center at the Univ. of PA. You just can't get much more liberal than they are - and I believe this has been pointed out before on this forum.
As a counterpoint to their view, here's the finding of an exhaustive analysis from the Heritage Foundation - a conservative think tank that offers thorough analysis and excellent support of their conclusions:
HOW DID REAGAN'S POLICIES AFFECT ECONOMIC GROWTH? Despite the steep recession in 1982--brought on by tight money policies that were instituted to squeeze out the historic inflation level of the late 1970s--by 1983, the Reagan policies of reducing taxes, spending, regulation, and inflation were in place. The result was unprecedented economic growth:
- This economic boom lasted 92 months without a recession, from November 1982 to July 1990, the longest period of sustained growth during peacetime and the second-longest period of sustained growth in U.S. history. The growth in the economy lasted more than twice as long as the average period of expansions since World War II.10
- The American economy grew by about one-third in real inflation-adjusted terms. This was the equivalent of adding the entire economy of East and West Germany or two-thirds of Japan's economy to the U.S. economy.11
- From 1950 to 1973, real economic growth in the U.S. economy averaged 3.6 percent per year. From 1973 to 1982, it averaged only 1.6 percent. The Reagan economic boom restored the more usual growth rate as the economy averaged 3.5 percent in real growth from the beginning of 1983 to the end of 1990...12
No matter how advocates of big government try to rewrite history, Ronald Reagan's record of fiscal responsibility continues to stand as the most successful economic policy of the 20th century. His tax reforms triggered an economic expansion that continues to this day. His investments in national security ended the Cold War and made possible the subsequent defense spending reductions that are largely responsible for the current federal surpluses. His efforts to restrain the expansion of federal government helped to limit the growth of domestic spending...
For the entire article, see the following link:
The Real Reagan Economic Record: Responsible and Successful Fiscal Policy | The Heritage Foundation
And the sky is green, the sun rises from the North - anyone who understands 2+2=4 knows ending tax cuts results in a tax increase. Obama left them in place because even he and his socialist advisors knew a tax increase would further damage the economy.
No one has said that - anytime, anywhere; that statement is a complete fabrication, but some liberals still use it as a talking point if they don't mind getting laughed at. However, it's common knowledge that these entitlement programs are going broke, probably sooner that predicted. People are going to have to understand that there are going to have to be adjustments to the quantity of government goodies because the money simply won't be there 10-12 years from now. If Obamacare is allowed to be implemented things will be even worse. Cutting back on these sacred cows is in reality NOT cutting back at all - because the resources for these programs will not be there anyway. Those over 55 yrs of age right now might see some of what they were promised if they're lucky - but beyond that they may as well resign themselves to the fact that these programs as they exist today won't be there for them when they reach 65 or 70 yrs old. They can only hope that this country hasn't become like Greece or Italy by then. That's where Barack Hussein Obama wants to take us, and he along with his liberal Democrats in congress have made a good start.
witness23
Veteran Expediter
Okay sure. Just because FactCheck.org doesn't match up with what you want to believe doesn't mean it has a liberal bias. FactCheck.org is probably one of the more trusted fact check sites around. But I won't convince you otherwise.
That's debatable on their "liberalness"(is that a word?). Pointed out by whom? The few times it has been brought up I think the consensus was that they are a reputable site for checking facts. But again, I won't convince you otherwise.
Like I said, Reagan raised taxes during a recession, a year later after he had lowered them. The hi-lited area was for chickenhawk.
I gave props to Reagan for lowering taxes, but he raised taxes in the middle of a recession in 1982, a year after he lowered them, then proceeded to raise them 10 more times before he left office. I'm not disparaging the guy, I just like how some like to think that he waited until the recession was over, then raised taxes. I wouldn't be surprised if many here in the soapbox even realized he raised taxes 11 times during his tenure until I mentioned it.
Socialist advisors? You're contradicting yourself, if Obama was such a Socialist why didn't he let the tax cuts expire, especially when he had a Democratic Congress and role down the street throwing dollar bills out the window to spread the wealth?
Yes, he did leave them in place. If anything, that might tell you he is capable of compromise. That was two years ago, and the Bush Tax Cuts have been in place for 10 years and they haven't done what they said they would do. Reagan realized he had to raise taxes a year later, Obama is a year behind and the tax cuts should be left to expire. And he's only talking about letting those at 200-250,000 expire and leaving the others where there at.
Heres another parallel that came to me when reading your article. Reagan was able to reduce Military spending after ending the Cold War. Us getting rid of Osama bin Laden is a close comparison, where as, we could start saving money by bringing troops home.
Are you a 9-11 truther as well?
Tennesseahawk
Veteran Expediter
Damm it was nice here without your personal attacks. Could you possibly go back on vacation?
I swear... some people are a waste of space.
Tennesseahawk
Veteran Expediter
So I finally have some time to address this, since you decided to go personal on me...
The Tax Equity and Fiscal Responsibility Act of 1982 (TEFRA) basically repealed a few of the FUTURE benes from The Economic Recovery Act the year before. However, there were NO CHANGES to individual income taxes. If we're blaming the president for signing bills, which is perfectly fine, the Recovery Act of 81 lowered the top income tax rate from 70 to 50%! The bottom rate fell from 14 to 11%. Also, there's some argument that the promised spending cuts in TEFRA weren't upheld. Geez... imagine that... Congress didn't keep its promise.
[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]"Baker assured his boss that Congress would approve three dollars in spending cuts for every dollar of tax increase. To Reagan, TEFRA looked like a pretty good "70 percent" deal. But Congress wound up cutting less than twenty-seven cents for every new tax dollar. What had seemed to be an acceptable 70-30 compromise turned out to be a 30-70 surrender. Ed Meese described TEFRA as "the greatest domestic error of the Reagan administration," although it did leave untouched the individual tax rate reductions approved the previous year. (TEFRA was built on a series of business and excise taxes plus the removal of business tax deductions.)"[/FONT]
So, Reagan was essentially stabbed in the back, while Clinton advocated his tax hikes. What does the resident liberal hack have to say about them apples?