Here's what he said:
And he can say these rates are cheap because this is the internet and everybody can say anything they want, even people without a clue. Check out some of the stuff I say.
Percentage Based or Flat Rate?
- Thread starter lenny52682
- Start date
Here's what he said:
And he can say these rates are cheap because this is the internet and everybody can say anything they want, even people without a clue. Check out some of the stuff I say.
Personally I like percentage. You have shared pain and share gain. But the when the carrier does better for the truck they generally are doing better for themselves. It helps align common goals and in my opinion that helps to build a winning team.
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tenntrucker
Expert Expediter
Make that a double "right on" and I'm not even leased to Load One!
Wait. You're not the creepy guy in truck 326?
BigCat
Expert Expediter
Dave you know a lot of trucks at panther aren't even getting $1.35. I drove for an owner and his was getting $1.05 solo and $1.10 team.
BigCat
Expert Expediter
I don't see where he said his utilities were a business expense. I see where he said "household expense". And yes those will come out of your settlement or you won't have a house or utilities very long. Anything after all bills being paid is "profit".
You're reading something into what I posted that I didn't post. Business and personal are seperate. My point is, if the business does not make enough money to cover all business costs, and all personal costs, then have money left over at the end... ....it is an unprofitable business...
Not knowing much at all about the going rates for cargo vans and straight trucks doesn;t mean I am clueless about how trucking companies operate. A trucking company is a trucking company be it big trucks or small... Someone who knows, preferably someone with experience in both big and small trucks tell me if this is wrong.... .....I know for a fact that flat rates from all of the trucking companies out there, for BIG trucks, are dirt cheap rates that barely cover some of the truck's operating costs, and make nothing above and beyond that... In fact most of them don;t even pay well enough to do that... And there are lots of suckers out there who line up to haul for those rates... There are even independanst who don't do much better themselves... So, flat rates to cargo vans and straight trucks are the road to riches?? riiight, that's what I figured...
I say with reaosnable certainty that flat rates offered to small trucks by all the expedite companies are along the same lines. I know for a fact that the rates many of the expedite companies are paying their big truck owner operators, while sometimes better (but not always), than typical 95 cents a mile plus a fuel surcharge at a general freight company are still not all that great... I saw one ad for expedite big truck that claimed "up to" $2.10 a mile or something like that... The "catch" there being "up to". Knowing what I know about ads and how companies overhype what they have to attract suckers that is likley a rate that doesn;t include any deadhead... and likely those trucks are doing good if they're clearing $1.50 a mile all miles in... $2 a mile is CHEAP for a big truck and a person can do substantially better than that on a loaded miles rate with expdite and yes, even general freight....
All I'm saying is that a savvy operator will make out far better on percentage than any of the cheap flat rate offers out there. Flat rates are ALWAYS cheap in trucking..... But one man's cheap is another's gold mine I suppose...
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Never heard of numbers that low. A truck signing on currently is 1.20 with no qualifications. The FSC, DH, and EM are in addition to that number. I think it is 1.25 with hazmat if a solo plus FSC.
Sure enough John... They spend mega bucks recruiting when what they ought to focus on is recruiting business minded small business owners... The thing is a lot of owners don't understand just what it takes to get solid rates in trucking. I spend a lot of my 10 hour break studying, there's never an end to the paperwork, crunching numbers... thinking about trends I see from my small point of view... ....I remember the good old days as a company driver when I wheeled in somewhere, caught the logs up and turned in for a good night's sleep... You don;t just sign up somewhere and someone says, "here, take this $4 a mile 600 mile load and when you get doen with that I'll give you anotrher one going........" Driving is the easy part that any yahoo can do.... A person has to market themselves, they have to have people skills and the ability to network... their word must be their honor.. No slacking and no excuses... You can never excell at flat rates.. It's just grind out the miles and hope for the best - I also feel very strongly that it damages customer service... You see these drivers who haven't showered for days, they've been grinding out miles or they're complaining and grousing to anyone that will listen how bad it is and they're not getting any miles.... I think it has a lot to do with prevailing attitudes and perceptions about this industry.. But it is what it is. I'm gald the whole system is based on miles because it allows me to capitalize on the freight that a majority deems as worthless and make a nice profit in the process...
Spend some of that 10 hours boning up on basic arithmetic, especially the chapter on percentages. Also enlarge your small point of view.
Get your calculator out and work through this tricky word problem: Dilbert is on a flat rate of $1.75 per loaded mile. Rogmar is payed on percent basis of 70% of the total linehaul charges. Both carriers tariffs are based on $2.50/mile. On an 843 mile load, which driver got paid more money; flat rate Dilbert or percentage Rogmar?
Clue #1: Both loads originated in Denver.
Clue #2: Dilbert's load was 44,000 lbs. of lead ingots. Rogmar's load was 44,000 of paper.
Clue#3: Rogmar's trailer had side skirts, Dilbert wore skirts.
BigCat
Expert Expediter
Yep my old owner was asking me to comeback and saying his new truck was getting $1.10 for a team. I said no thanks. I get $.42 cpm now which is better than $.22 I was getting.
If that's all I was payin I wouldn't advertise it either.
You totally miss the point. I don't need schooling on math. Math is the easy stuff. Planning 2, 3, or 4 moves ahead from booking that first one, contacting people touching base, actually pulling that off with spotmarket load after load and keeping steady moving is the real work.. Doing it for solid rates every load, even more-so.... No-one has yet to challenge what I said that flat rates are always cheap. It's true and everyone knows it. Percentage.... ....IF the owner is allowed the freedom to find/negotiate/dictate his own terms on every load, regardless what that percentage is - that percentage driver will always come out ahead every time if he is business savy... Regardless of normal market ups and downs... Would like to see some actual flat rates that expedite carriers are paying to cargo vans, straights, and tractor trailers then we could really pick apart the numbers... Many of them are so ashamed they don't even post them on their websites and the ones I have seen that do ought to be ashamed... ...but if owners will sign up and roll for those rates who could blame them right?
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Ok...I will challenge you and ask again. What do you consider a cheap rate for a straight truck. Followed by, what do you think it should be?
What is good for a straight truck and what is bad? I don't know. All I've ever driven is big trucks. I do expedite with that and general freight too. That is what I know. However, I do have contacts who load up staright trucks too. I do know of one local straight truck expedite load that pays $400 going 65 miles, I would consider that a great rate for a straight truck. I do it truckload sometimes myself but not for $400... This does come from a great broker, not afiliated with Sylectus, and customer who will pony up the $$$ as needed. Is that a normal or average rate for a straight truck going 65 miles? that's what this load pays minimum every time on a straight truck. Really that is the extent of my knowledge with straight trucks. I've never worked one and have no idea about the costs associated with them. Have no clue about what is and what is not good rates for them. I do know there are guys running them on percentage who can avereag $2 a mile on every mile they turn because they know what they're doing. Most run much cheaper than that, I would think that $2 a mile average would be a small group and likely some out there do better than that with a straight truck... ...but I really don;t know, you tell me..
I base my statement that flat rates are cheap regardless the truck size on facts, plain and simple. Because they are dirt low rates. What I know of them with big trucks they are. I see no reason why trucking is any different with small trucks. Someone tell me, what are typical flat rates for straights and cargo vans? Are they practical miles or zip code miles. Is the surcharge on loaded empty or both? What is a TRUE cost per mile to roll in a cargo van or straight truck 1 mile down the road? Educate me...
I base my statement that flat rates are cheap regardless the truck size on facts, plain and simple. Because they are dirt low rates. What I know of them with big trucks they are. I see no reason why trucking is any different with small trucks. Someone tell me, what are typical flat rates for straights and cargo vans? Are they practical miles or zip code miles. Is the surcharge on loaded empty or both? What is a TRUE cost per mile to roll in a cargo van or straight truck 1 mile down the road? Educate me...
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