Deville...how would you know the miles on #1-4? maybe they were shorties...just saying.....she didn't say what the miles were....
Ok Everyone, LET ME HAVE IT! Poor it on hard!
- Thread starter Yesteryear
- Start date
That's a good point. There is value for others in your posts. They can learn from your mistakes. Newbies, note that it is much easier and less expensive to learn from other people's mistakes than it is to learn from your own.
The same applies to a driver who runs up a CSA point score that could have been kept very low.
Newbies, the thing to check into and learn from in this case is the driver's attitude toward safety, compliance and the rules. Yesteryear proceeded as if the violations did not matter. When told otherwise, she quoted a questionable source that supported her belief and laughed off ("LOL") the significance of the new regulatory regime that is now in effect.
This is a very good example of a driver committing professional suicide by trying to fit the industry into the driver's world view. Wishful thinking is literally clouding good judgement. This driver is working very hard to be right. The question is, what exactly is Yesteryear trying to be right about?
Newbies, when you are researching this industry, it is vital to not just ask a lot of questions but to ask the right questions and to ask them of the right people.
Scale cops are not the right people to ask about CSA because most of them have not yet been trained in it and most scale houses and patrol cars have yet to be equipped with the equipment that will instantly post driver and carrier CSA information to the officer's screen when the truck's DOT and driver's info is entered.
Notice the scale cop that told Yesteryear that he pulled in the truck for inspection because of how bad it looked. The CSA equipment coming to scale cops does the very same thing with your carrier, truck and driver data. Your identifying information is entered in. If your CSA score or your carrier's comes back high, a red light code is given and the officer will target you for inspection.
More CSA points mean more inspections. More inspections mean more violations (unless the truck and paperwork are perfect). More violations mean more CSA points, and so it will go until the repeat offender is literally forced out of truck driving...which is one of the goals of the new regulatory regime.
I did not do a careful count but estimate that the list of violations Yesteryear provided added about 109 CSA points to her record. That is a high number compared to what other drivers have. When CSA "starts," as the scale cop explained, cops will see a big red light flash on their screen every time Yesteryear's information is entered. That red light will prompt them to pull Yesteryear in for yet another inspection, that is if a carrier and insurance company can be found that is willing to keep this driver on board.
While the CSA points count right now. The enforcement community and a surprising number of carriers have yet to grasp its full impact. It is only a matter of time before they do, and when they do, drivers with high CSA scores are doomed.
Yesteryear provides the answer to the question I asked above; what are you trying to be right about? In this case the driver was trying to be right about her Farmville and Mafia Wars score (immediate gratification), and was not trying to be right about her CSA score (professional focus). She was asking, how can I increase my social networking scores instead of asking how can I keep my CSA score low?
You get more of what you think about. These days, professional drivers are thinking about keeping their CSA scores low.
lol course I would still be failing inspections heeheehee
Notice the "lol" and "heeheehee."
It may serve an emotional purpose to laugh off that which is uncomfortable but doing so does not make the CSA score go away. Denial is not a characteristic that serves professional drivers well.
Newbies, there are many things in this industry that make you feel bad. A long list of violations is one. An underinflated tire is another. So is driving for a year and finding yourself with a lower bank balance at the end than you had at the beginning.
It is human nature to avoid the bad feelings associated with such things. Instead of facing up to a high CSA score, laugh it off and go play a computer game. Instead of airing up the tire you notice is low, put off the task and tell yourself you will do it later when an air hose can be more easily found. Instead of developing a basic bookkeeping system to figure out why you have worked for a full year but made no money, tell yourself you will do it later and watch a football game to put the uncomfortable feelings out of your mind; or tell yourself and others that the freight is slow, carriers are thieves, you can't make money by driving legal, and things will get better for you when things out there change in your favor.
When researching this business, you will of course want to ask the traditional questions about trucks, carriers, revenue potential, etc. The most important question to ask, before all others, is, what am I trying to be right about?
If you commit to being right about a well maintained truck and act like you mean it, your emotions will follow. When you notice an underinflated tire, you won't feel bad because it will cost you time and effort to fix it, and you won't make the bad feelings go away by thinking or doing something else that feels better. You will feel bad because having an underinflated tire on your truck does not fit the professional-driver self image you have. You will make the bad feelings go away by taking immediate action to inflate the tire.
There is in this business time management, money management, maintenance management and more. There is also emotional management.
The more you can align your emotions with the deeds of successful drivers, the more successful you will tend to be. The more you lose yourself in non-professional activities to avoid the bad feelings that this job can produce every day, the less successful you will tend to be.
Do you want to be a successful professional driver? Think about the things successful professional drivers think about. Do what they do. Feel what they feel. Do it enough to make it a habit and you will find yourself among those who love their work, are good at it and are proud to be who they are.
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CSA 2010 is real.
Full implementation may be delayed again, but the info from roadside inspections, accidents, tickets, etc. is on your record and can be checked by your carrier. Or any carrier or fleet owner you are applying to.
With the information Yesteryear supplied about failed DOT inspections I calculated 102 points. And there may have been more violations that she did not list.
I was told by a large carrier that if you have over 100 points they would not even consider hiring you.
Full implementation may be delayed again, but the info from roadside inspections, accidents, tickets, etc. is on your record and can be checked by your carrier. Or any carrier or fleet owner you are applying to.
With the information Yesteryear supplied about failed DOT inspections I calculated 102 points. And there may have been more violations that she did not list.
I was told by a large carrier that if you have over 100 points they would not even consider hiring you.
A check of Yesteryear's profile shows she has a husband. If the two of them are a team, all of the violations may not have been charged to her. It may be that her co-driver got some of them, so her points from the listed violations may not exceed 100.
Regardless, the score should have been kept to zero and it remains the driver's (drivers') fault that it was not.
The points are not significant to Yesteryear and her co-driver alone. They accrue to her carrier too, which increases the red-light liklihood for all drivers running with the same carrier as she.
When CSA is in full effect, a truck will cross a scale and the cop at the desk will enter the DOT number, as the cops do now. What is different with CSA is that a red light will appear on the cop's screen when a truck crosses that is with a CARRIER that has a high CSA score.
The driver can have a perfect record and be driving a perfect truck. If the carrier has a high CSA score, the truck will be red lighted for inspection.
It is the same for carriers as it is for drivers. More CSA points lead to more inspections. More inspections lead to more violations. More violations lead to more inspections.
Once carriers grasp what CSA is all about, they will not be keen to keep a driver on board who is a repeat offender. Nor will they be inclined to keep a fleet owner on board whose junker trucks are racking up the carrier's CSA score.
If word gets out among drivers that they are being pulled in, not because of their own high CSA score but because of their carriers, many will be quick to find a new home.
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greg334
Veteran Expediter
This is a perfect illustration of a three way failure.
The first one is the carrier. A lot of carriers do not provide any training in CSA 2010, they leave that up to the driver which in my opinion is wrong. They shifted the blame onto the drivers because of the new reporting system and now look at drivers as a liability.
Going hand in hand with that is the lack of fleet wide inspections. If the issue is a truck that has problems, then there is a need for inspections that will either force the owner to repair it or terminate their contract for failing to do so.
The second part that goes with this specific issue is the owner who failed their obligation to do something with the driver and the truck. I understand that the CSA 2010 may in the future include truck owners, as it seems to include trailer owners who fail to maintain their trailer they lease to owners/drivers.
The third part is the driver. A lot of driver just don't know and many more are either in panic mode or depend on the wrong people to tell them the right things. A lot think that State DOT Officers are answer people but that's no where near the truth. A lot depend on truck stop info and even then it is 20% accurate.
I think yesteryears' just coming here means a lot, I commend her for it. She is honest, more honest than a lot of people and has yet taken offense to anything other than Phil. Phil on the other hand seems to think that she is blowing it off, which is not the impression I am getting. Her engagement with backing up the info she has is the right thing to do.
NOW we continue to say research, but you know a lot of drivers are not researchers, they don't know what to ask, let alone the right questions to ask. A lot of them (and I do too) get frustrated with the canned response "search two years back" when something is asked.
Remember that CSA 2010 is not the monster that a lot of people make it out to be. If you follow simple routines and be responsible enough to learn, identify and correct problems before someone else catches them, then you will not have to worry about it.
I would like to know how the guy in the booth knows who is driving the truck? My understanding is that the red lights are carrier triggered and will not change.
By the way, professional drivers do not always start with the person but with the way the person gets into this business. The CSA 2010 system is a post event driven system and leaves a lot to be desired. If there is a need to mitigate problems, it starts with filtering out people going into training, the training itself and testing. The last thing is the real problem, we should be required to do an actual full pre-trip not a walk around. We should prove we have what it takes to drive by a good road test, not a 15 minute joy ride.
The first one is the carrier. A lot of carriers do not provide any training in CSA 2010, they leave that up to the driver which in my opinion is wrong. They shifted the blame onto the drivers because of the new reporting system and now look at drivers as a liability.
Going hand in hand with that is the lack of fleet wide inspections. If the issue is a truck that has problems, then there is a need for inspections that will either force the owner to repair it or terminate their contract for failing to do so.
The second part that goes with this specific issue is the owner who failed their obligation to do something with the driver and the truck. I understand that the CSA 2010 may in the future include truck owners, as it seems to include trailer owners who fail to maintain their trailer they lease to owners/drivers.
The third part is the driver. A lot of driver just don't know and many more are either in panic mode or depend on the wrong people to tell them the right things. A lot think that State DOT Officers are answer people but that's no where near the truth. A lot depend on truck stop info and even then it is 20% accurate.
I think yesteryears' just coming here means a lot, I commend her for it. She is honest, more honest than a lot of people and has yet taken offense to anything other than Phil. Phil on the other hand seems to think that she is blowing it off, which is not the impression I am getting. Her engagement with backing up the info she has is the right thing to do.
NOW we continue to say research, but you know a lot of drivers are not researchers, they don't know what to ask, let alone the right questions to ask. A lot of them (and I do too) get frustrated with the canned response "search two years back" when something is asked.
Remember that CSA 2010 is not the monster that a lot of people make it out to be. If you follow simple routines and be responsible enough to learn, identify and correct problems before someone else catches them, then you will not have to worry about it.
I would like to know how the guy in the booth knows who is driving the truck? My understanding is that the red lights are carrier triggered and will not change.
By the way, professional drivers do not always start with the person but with the way the person gets into this business. The CSA 2010 system is a post event driven system and leaves a lot to be desired. If there is a need to mitigate problems, it starts with filtering out people going into training, the training itself and testing. The last thing is the real problem, we should be required to do an actual full pre-trip not a walk around. We should prove we have what it takes to drive by a good road test, not a 15 minute joy ride.
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Yesteryear
Expert Expediter
Ok, let me clarify some things. First, what I took offense to from ATeam aka Phil was being referred to as a "Sir". If Phil cannot see that I am a woman then it is he that has some serious issues with his vison. My picture is pretty plain. I do not think I look anything like a man and feel it was uncalled for to insult my gender. I would never refer to Phil as a "Miss".
Second, the 8 DOT inspections were in a very short period of time, 3 in 1 week-end. All 8 were in less then 6 weeks All of the violations were minor pick on the truck violations. There were no "mechanical or safety" violations. Things like being able to see a wire when you walked up to the truck coming from the tail light. The bumper was pushed in. The tag was bent. One of the straps securing the fire extinguisher was broken. The bottom of the bumper did not have reflection tape. Get the picture? It was picking because the truck was ugly. They could not find anything wrong with the truck so they had to find minor "look hard and you will find something" things. Every time I immediately fixed whatever the officer found wrong. The only really legit thing was the loose wire on the right flasher. I did take it to be repaired but it was working again so was stumped and thought was just a fluke. My only "BAD" on this was I, or we, should not have given the company we were with as long as we did before saying we could not drive the truck any longer however we really trusted "a few more weeks" and they would give us a new truck. I even went into our carrier and reported the 8 failed violations just incase they missed them. I did everything I could with that truck but if a DOT officer wants to find something bottom line is they will find something.
As for the other, how could I possibly get upset for you guys saying "ha ha ha. . . u got caught flat footed. . . Duh dummy how long ya been driving . . . . errrrrr duh what a stooge . . . hehehe never happen to me I'm not that stupid . . . . errrr no contract (snicker snicker snicker) what an idiot. Yep cause that is what I feel. But ya know what? If one person on here learns from my mistake and it keeps them from getting ripped, isn't a laugh or two at my expense worth it?
Oh yeah, FYI . . . I have an email from the fleet manager sayig we were getting 100% of the FSC. Should help my case a little shouldn't it? That and the backing of other teams that had the same issues and the team that brought us on board?
FYI also, sorry we don't take "cheap" freight. Never even been offered reduced rate with this carrier, ever. Alway pays the contracted rate. The amounts listed were the FSC only.
Second, the 8 DOT inspections were in a very short period of time, 3 in 1 week-end. All 8 were in less then 6 weeks All of the violations were minor pick on the truck violations. There were no "mechanical or safety" violations. Things like being able to see a wire when you walked up to the truck coming from the tail light. The bumper was pushed in. The tag was bent. One of the straps securing the fire extinguisher was broken. The bottom of the bumper did not have reflection tape. Get the picture? It was picking because the truck was ugly. They could not find anything wrong with the truck so they had to find minor "look hard and you will find something" things. Every time I immediately fixed whatever the officer found wrong. The only really legit thing was the loose wire on the right flasher. I did take it to be repaired but it was working again so was stumped and thought was just a fluke. My only "BAD" on this was I, or we, should not have given the company we were with as long as we did before saying we could not drive the truck any longer however we really trusted "a few more weeks" and they would give us a new truck. I even went into our carrier and reported the 8 failed violations just incase they missed them. I did everything I could with that truck but if a DOT officer wants to find something bottom line is they will find something.
As for the other, how could I possibly get upset for you guys saying "ha ha ha. . . u got caught flat footed. . . Duh dummy how long ya been driving . . . . errrrrr duh what a stooge . . . hehehe never happen to me I'm not that stupid . . . . errrr no contract (snicker snicker snicker) what an idiot. Yep cause that is what I feel. But ya know what? If one person on here learns from my mistake and it keeps them from getting ripped, isn't a laugh or two at my expense worth it?
Oh yeah, FYI . . . I have an email from the fleet manager sayig we were getting 100% of the FSC. Should help my case a little shouldn't it? That and the backing of other teams that had the same issues and the team that brought us on board?
FYI also, sorry we don't take "cheap" freight. Never even been offered reduced rate with this carrier, ever. Alway pays the contracted rate. The amounts listed were the FSC only.
You need not be insulted. It was an honest mistake. I did not notice your avatar because I seldom look at any of them and yours is not of great quality. The photo is more clear in your profile. After viewing it and realizing my mistake, I went back and changed male pronouns to female. Assuming that "Yesteryear" was a male was a sexist assumption to make and for that I apologize.
Deville
Not a Member
FYI also, sorry we don't take "cheap" freight. Never even been offered reduced rate with this carrier, ever. Alway pays the contracted rate. The amounts listed were the FSC only.
I've been around long enough to know what the diffrence between cheap freight & not cheap freight is. Since I make 99% of my expedite living doing runs that are 150 miles & less I can tell you with almost 100% certanity that those runs were cheap loads discounted by the carrier because they were customers that give repeat business, Dupont, GE, Time etc...
Don't even get me started on runs that are hazmat loads or require a Liftgate, those used to be PREMIUM loads. God forbid you have an inside del. or p/u & you call in looking for the increase in pay used to be no questions asked, ok do it. Now there is a deafing silence on the phone & you have to explain to dispatch that pay needs to be added, & even than there is an ueasyness & grumbling.
I'm assuming your running with FDCC, most of there runs are being offered at $85 to $1 a mile up to 500 miles, regardless of unit size.
So you might think your not running cheap freight, but you are. If your the only truck in the area & it's HOT HOT you can negioate. Used to be most units would turn down the loads & they would come around a 2nd time with a little more money, nowadays everyoneojumps on the first run they see to "keep there wheels moving" & it's not productive. That's why many new singles (& teams) fail within 6 months to a year.
Please don't be offended as that is not my intent.
nightcreacher
Veteran Expediter
are you sure thats not whats left after you had advance on the loads
nightcreacher
Veteran Expediter
when FDCC changed the way they were going to pay their FSC I contacted OOIDA.A company doesnt have to pay any FSC if they dont want to unless its in their contract with you.Since FDCC doesnt have a FSC in their contract,they wouldnt have to pay a FSC
greg334
Veteran Expediter
Yesteryear,
I hope you don't think I called you an idiot.
I think you are on the right track.
Deville, it was the FSC posted, not the rate and beside I don't hear complaints about vans running flat rate for under a buck - that's cheap freight.
Phil, you need glasses. On my wifes' netbook I could see the avatar and who it is, it is better quality than a lot of them.
I hope you don't think I called you an idiot.
I think you are on the right track.
Deville, it was the FSC posted, not the rate and beside I don't hear complaints about vans running flat rate for under a buck - that's cheap freight.
Phil, you need glasses. On my wifes' netbook I could see the avatar and who it is, it is better quality than a lot of them.
If you look at Yesteryear's profile, you will see that she currently runs with Express-1. Her previous posts mention a different carrier that she also ran with.
I was relieved to find that out. Her stream of violations put CSA points not only on her record (and perhaps her co-driver's, depending on who was driving when the citation was made) but also on her carrier's. Under the new CSA regime, the more points a carrier has, the more likely it becomes that all trucks with that carrier will be pulled in for inspections.
Fair warning to FedEx Custom Critical drivers:
This is serious business and I'm not going to mess around. If Yesteryear was running with our carrier, and I learned how she not only ran up her and her carrier's CSA score, but failed to appreciate the impact of her deeds, I would get involved, contact our safety department, make sure they knew all the facts and urge the ouster of this repeat offender from the fleet, as well as the fleet owner who ran that junker truck. Racking up over 100 CSA points is beyond ridiculous, it's criminal.
When her flurry of CSA points makes it more likely that I will get pulled in for an inspection, her problem becomes my problem. Unlike her, I won't pooh-pooh things in hopes of making the problem go away. I will solve it.
That is not to say that I will go after everyone who fails an inspection or has the misfortune of meeting a nit-picker scale cop who believes it is his job to write tickets. Lights burn out after pre-trip inspections are made. Tires develop slow leaks under load. A driver may know of a defect and be on his or her way home to have it fixed by a trusted shop when the nit-picker scale cop is met. A driver may physically check and determine that something like a U-bolt is tight only to have a cop with a pry bar determine that it is loose.
The difference between professional drivers and Yesteryear is the professional commitment get ahead of the game, maintain one's equipment and do everything in one's power to keep the CSA score low; not only for your sake but also for the sake of your colleagues in the fleet.
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I run with FDCC, Deville, and would not agree with your statement. Yes, we see runs offered at $0.85 to $1.00 a mile but we do not accept them. There are plenty of runs that pay a decent rate; like the recent New Jersey to Utah run we did at $2.55 per mile all miles, and another coast-to-coast rund we did at $2.00 per mile all miles. The short runs we do tend to pay even higher per mile. It is not uncommon to be paid $400, $500 and even $700 to move freight 200 miles or less.
A solo driver in a dry-box truck may not see such rates as often but I can tell you for a fact that we do.
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When I did drive...
I drove for a carrier their violations were so high...every time I crossed a scale I was pulled around back....
eventually the MTO cut back the companies running authority and ordered a 50% reduction in the fleet...Till they could get a handle on the maintenance..
Maybe some entrepreneur type could devise..a light monitoring device that can sense when a light goes out? I mean my sprinter knows when I put the wrong bulb in and the warning lights go on the dash...it might be worth looking into?
I drove for a carrier their violations were so high...every time I crossed a scale I was pulled around back....
eventually the MTO cut back the companies running authority and ordered a 50% reduction in the fleet...Till they could get a handle on the maintenance..
Maybe some entrepreneur type could devise..a light monitoring device that can sense when a light goes out? I mean my sprinter knows when I put the wrong bulb in and the warning lights go on the dash...it might be worth looking into?
Yesteryear
Expert Expediter
That feature is already built into our truck (2006 Volvo VNL). If a required light goes out, we get a message on the dash telling us exactly which circuit is open. It says "open circuit" but almost always the problem is a bulb. Most of the bulbs are easily changed and we carry spares where we can get to them even if the box is sealed under load.
Yesteryear
Expert Expediter
Not offended at all. The load was at the contracted rate for this truck. $1.12 per mile. The amount listed was not the load rate it was just the Fuel Surcharge. Ok, let me clareify this better:
The load rates were as follow
Load 1 - 794.08 fsc 205.61
Load 2 - 1126.72 fsc 291.74
Load 3 - 1009.12 fsc 261.29
Load 4 - 655.20 fsc 169.65
Okay now everyone understand this: PICK ON ME . . . GREAT IT IS ALL N FUN . . . PICK ON MY CARRIER . . . . I'LL WHOOP U BUTTER! cAUSE THEY DA BEEEESSST! ! !
Glad to hear that Phil....that could and will save you money and points which can equal money....
I agree with you a couple sloppy drivers and a fleet owner can effect a lot more then themselves...
Not offended at all. The load was at the contracted rate for this truck. $1.12 per mile. The amount listed was not the load rate it was just the Fuel Surcharge. Ok, let me clareify this better:
The load rates were as follow
Load 1 - 794.08 fsc 205.61
Load 2 - 1126.72 fsc 291.74
Load 3 - 1009.12 fsc 261.29
Load 4 - 655.20 fsc 169.65
Okay now everyone understand this: PICK ON ME . . . GREAT IT IS ALL N FUN . . . PICK ON MY CARRIER . . . . I'LL WHOOP U BUTTER! cAUSE THEY DA BEEEESSST! ! !
Sorry...but a flat rate FSC....makes them far from the best....
so is your owner getting the tractor FSC deal? instead of the $1.20 plus straight FSC instead....
Yesteryear
Expert Expediter
My goodness Phil! Do you have a reading comprehension disability? Please go back and re-read my post, analyze it and try to understand it! Did I not say I WENT INTO MY CARRIER AND REPORTED THE ISSUE! Did I not mention these all occurred in a very short time, 3 Dots in 1 weekend while on the same load? Did I not mention every violation but one were small insignificant things that were "picking". Come on, tell me no one else has ever had the wind to bend their tag? No one else can see a single wire when you walk up behind their truck? Every one of you have reflective tape on both the top and bottom of your bumpers? I know a lot of you don't because after it happened to me I started closely observing everyone elses to see if they had it, AND MANY DO NOT! geeezzzz Phil lighten up. I believed in a company is that so bad? I trusted them to make things right. OK when they still did not make it right we gave them notice and returned the truck.