No more prayer at High School football games

WanderngFool · Jun 17, 2014

nydriver3 said:
Don't watch broadcast news of any kind. I also don't Google it. Much was argued between them when writing the constitution. Dig back into those books in libraries from many many years ago and you can find some interesting stuff that was written before to much revision was done to the history of this country.

"Character is doing the right thing, even when no one is looking"

I can't see where you'll find less chance for revisionism than words directly from Jefferson himself. There were letters between Jefferson and Madison on the subject but the particular quote I was thinking of was in a letter from Jefferson to the Danbury Baptists. Here's an excerpt:

"Believing with you that religion is a matter which lies solely between man and his god, that he owes account to none other for his faith or his worship, that the legitimate powers of government reach actions only, and not opinions, I contemplate with sovereign reverence that act of the whole American people which declared that their "legislature" should "make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof," thus building a wall of separation between church and State. Adhering to this expression of the supreme will of the nation in behalf of the rights of conscience, I shall see with sincere satisfaction the progress of those sentiments which tend to restore to man all his natural rights, convinced he has no natural right in opposition to his social duties."

cheri1122 · Jun 17, 2014

mjmsprt40 said:
So, let me see if I got this straight. (Can't tell the players without a scorecard, so they say.)

Layoutshooter wants to abolish public schools because, in his view, they serve only to indoctrinate and only teach facts as a side to indoctrination.

Cheri thinks this is a bad idea because most parents aren't capable of teaching their children-- which brings up the issue that since most parents themselves are the product of public schools, why did the schools not teach the parents better when they were children so that they CAN teach their children today, and why should we trust this generation of kids to a system that has so obviously failed the parent's generation.

ASJ rounds things up by believing in nothing and wanting to teach our children nothing in the public schools.

Have I got that about right, or did I miss something?

I believe you did: knowledge does not a teacher make - unless it's knowledge of how to teach, from toddlers to adults. I can't do it, and neither can most who believe [without any training] they can teach their children.

And I don't think ASJ "believes in nothing and wants to teach our children nothing in public schools", either. I think he believes in reason, science, and teaching the difference between what we know, what we believe [and can support with evidence, but haven't yet proven], and what we [ok, scientists] are just guessing at. The items in the latter two categories are in flux: what is known increases constantly.
Our "virgin ears" don't object to hearing about religion - we just object to hearing it in a non religious educational setting, because the thing is, you have to choose ONE religion to do that, and that is an insult to everyone whose religion is not that one.
It was a lot easier when nearly everyone was a Christian, or claimed to be, but times change. We're tired of hearing how the US was "founded on Christian principles", because if you remember, the US was also founded on the principle that slavery was righteous, and women didn't have the same rights as men.