NATIONWIDE SATELLITE LOG BOOKS

[chuckwagon]

Earlier this week a truck driver was arrested in Indiana for killing five college students as he fell asleep behind the wheel.

It has been learned that he had drove 10-hours over the legal limit that day, faked his log book, and his company he drove for also had several safety violations.

I would like to see a federal law passed that would require all trucks that require a cdl driver be equipped with a satellite that could tell dispatchers how long the driver has been behind the wheel driving.

If we can track the location of the truck we sure in the heck could track how long the truck has been moving. This places the driver AND the company in HONEST control of log books along with increasing safety for the public and the driver as well.

It could also allow law enforcement better access to those actual records.

OK - now lets get some input from you the drivers! Would you support it or are we tired of reqs.

 

[LDB]

If the truck has Qualcomm they already can track the movements. We don't need more big brother, we need more responsibility and consequences. That driver should be charged with homicide just as if he'd stabbed them with a knife. The company also should face a HUGE fine for running the truck too many hours.

Leo Bricker, 73's K5LDB, OOIDA 677319
Owner, Panther trucks 5507, 5508, 5509
Highway Watch Participant, Truckerbuddy
EO Forum Moderator
----------
Support the entire Constitution, not just the parts you like.

 

[Moot]

Some of the large truck load carriers use "paperless" logs. Werner is one and I believe there are others.

I'm still waiting for the day when vans are required to log, paperless or otherwise.

I haven't log in a big truck in over 10 years. But I would have to say running single and logging every minute accurately and honestly would put a huge dent in the bottom line. Especially with the new hours of service. Ever been to a grocery warehouse? Case closed!

 

[RichM]

As Moot said Werner has had a paperless logging system approved by the DOT for several yaers. Whats interesting is that no other carriers have adopted it. The onus is on the driver to run within the HOS rules,if he/she doesn't the carrier is not responsible. Bottom line after all the BS it is the driver who runs on a illegal status. The Company will deny any pressure that forces the driver to run over the HOS rules.

If you are running for an outfit that wants you to break the rules,record the conversation. I used to do that years ago.

Van drivers ,it's just a matter of time before you will have to log,some guy will run into a school bus somewhere and a investigation will show he/her has been driving for 36 hours straight. The media will be all over the DOT and new rules will come down.

 

[greg334]

You know I would agree with you Chuckwagon but I see a problem - let me tell you my story first.

Tonight I got a load offer, Hazmat load from Ohio to Wisconsin. I said yea seeing I am sitting here doing nothing for the weekend. Than the nice lady said I was 22 miles from the pickup. OK, 22 miles from the pick up? Ohio is 41 miles away, so I asked her where do you think I am? She said Luna Pier. Right! Luna Pier, that was there 24 hours ago. So I could not take that offer (somehow they needed a quick pickup and being actually 65 miles away it would not work out). So I go out and start my truck, make sure I got a signal and turn it off. Went out a hour later and did it again (it shuts off after an hour) to make sure that QC picks me up where I am actually at. about an hor or so ago, I get another load offer, Monroe to Springfield MO. thinking that the QC picked up my correct location, I ask the nice lady where does she think I am? I apparently am still sitting in Luna Pier. this is a morning pickup with a sunday morning delivery.

So the problem is the system is failing me. I haven't been getting many offers and a lot of them have been weird to say the least and I am now in need of bring the truck in for QC service to make sure nothing is wrong.

My point with all of this is that the systems we have do not have real redundency built in to have a perfect accuracy. Maybe some of the logging systems I have seen in the past that upload at intervals would work but for some reason my trust in QC as wained a bit. putting me in Luna Pier when I am sitting in Redford, a 32 mile difference is a problem.

 

[Moot]

Greg,

When did you sign on with Panther?

 

[greg334]

Ahh... Let me check.... Nope the ID says FedEx Contractor.

 

[redytrk]

>
>It could also allow law enforcement better access to those
>actual records.
>
>OK - now lets get some input from you the drivers! Would you
>support it or are we tired of reqs.

In the early days of satelite Quamcom sought and recieved assurance from the Bush Sr. administration that QC records would not be used by the government.

This policy is apparently still ineffect. Having said that I am sure any lawyer can recieve the records through the courts.

Personally I feel opening the records for any "Back Woods Yokel" would open a bad can of worms. Errors in tracking would be nearly inpossible for the driver to prove,

 

[chuckwagon]

What we do (paperless, Werner) is a start, the system we have Qualcom, etc, are not fool proof that is for sure.

However, we need to move forward, put the pressure on the companies and the drivers to BOTH log properly and monitor properly so these kind of accidents and even simple violations of HOS do not take place at the pace they are now - and you know they are.

Can we at least agree - we as an industry should move towards such a nationwide satellite log book - suggest it to the feds before they make it tougher than we would do on our own.

I mean, I think it should be a federal law this is done, but if we as an industry suggest it, push it and endorse it - that would be beneficial to us and the public.

 

[dpea9]

Just what we need is another LAW!!!! If you trust the Feds you have been living in a closet. I have an idea. How about if we make everyone accountable for their own actions!!! The accident was absolutely horrible and my prayers go out to the families. But 99.99999% of us had nothing to do with it. So leave us alone. I am a resposible adult. I don't need the government more involved in my life. I run legal and will continue to do so. You can change all the laws you want but there will always be those that run illegal.
Dan

 

[greg334]

As much as I agree with the concept, there are other things that need to be done first, like more uniformed vehicle laws and more stringent controls on the companies themselves in the way of safety and education.

As I am going through an investigation about my own authority, I find that some things are too lax and other things are overlooked with the DOT. But the one thing I know is that until there is a real strong reason for some of these changes to take place, they are not going to happen.

 

[rode2rouen]

>What we do (paperless, Werner) is a start, the system we
>have Qualcom, etc, are not fool proof that is for sure.
>

NOTHING can be made "foolproof"...fools have proven themselves to be too ingenious!


>However, we need to move forward, put the pressure on the
>companies and the drivers to BOTH log properly and monitor
>properly so these kind of accidents and even simple
>violations of HOS do not take place at the pace they are now
>- and you know they are.
>

Would you be so kind as to document your allegations of HOS abuse. As a professional driver my log is available to any LEO for inspection at any time.


>Can we at least agree - we as an industry should move
>towards such a nationwide satellite log book - suggest it to
>the feds before they make it tougher than we would do on our
>own.
>

NO, "we" cannot agree. You indicate that you have just recently obtained a CDL and have yet to begin driving, so excuse me if I find your posturing a bit presumptuous.


>I mean, I think it should be a federal law this is done, but
>if we as an industry suggest it, push it and endorse it -
>that would be beneficial to us and the public.


chuckwagon, I've gotta tell you that you are coming off as though you have an axe to grind. Are you sure you aren't an undercover agent for an anti-truck group, or an aspiring politician looking for a "hot button issue"? Get a driving job. Join the OOIDA. Run compliant.


Rex

 

[LDB]

We as an industry should NOT move toward ANY form of logs or systems that gives the government any additional control or monitoring of us. We as an industry should be fighting ANY additional regulations and pushing ONLY for responsibility and consequences on those who cause a problem. We don't need the government micromanaging us to control inappropriate behaviour. We don't need the government regulating inanimate objects to control inappropriate behaviour. We need consequences and penalties so severe that people won't violate the rules. We need certain and absolute imposition of those consequences and penalties.

Leo Bricker, 73's K5LDB, OOIDA 677319
Owner, Panther trucks 5507, 5508, 5509
Highway Watch Participant, Truckerbuddy
EO Forum Moderator
----------
Support the entire Constitution, not just the parts you like.

 

[chuckwagon]

Yes, I recently did get my cdl-b, however i had a class-a back in the early 90's but let it 'expire' and entered into another business venture.

I had decided to get back into trucking and have noticed alot of areas which could use some improvement and SOME additional government regulations.

If you really thing WE AS AN INDUSTRY can monitor ourselfs you are very very mistaken - I believe we have failed in doing so thus far.

Yes MOST of us - the majority of us do indeed run within the law. However, most of us do not commit burglary, robbery, rape, etc but we still have laws against it and ways to capture those that do and monitor their activities.

And to the clown who thinks I am some sort of anti-truck group or government agent - HAY - I guess you listen to all those UFO shows too and believe them all and you most love the REAL ACTION OF the WWE!

The more I discuss this the more I really and honestly believe this would be a good thing - its off to my congressman and senator!

 

[kwexpress]

KW Express
o/o till i die


Its hard enough for a guy to make a living out here now.I see no good that would come from more goverment control.I refuse to even have a qual-com.I even hate cell phone as most of them can be tracked as well.Ive been driving for more than a few years and I know when im to tired to drive.

You talk to much like a cop thinking the goverment know best and are only interested in protecting the public. I say b/s and think if anything a law should be passed to make sure drivers are well enough paid that they dont want to drive more than x amount of hours in a day.

That will never happen.more goverment control will just make the bad badder and the goverment will just take more money from poor truckers.

Its sad that anyone dies on the highway.but what your asking for would not change that.

 

[bushhog]

I'm w/you Leo. True professionals run legal and compliant and operate safe vehicles. Add the EOR's that will be mandatory for all trucks down the road and it is seems very Orwellian. Soon they will know when we use the Pett. My two-fold gripe is the outlaws in the industry that cause the problems for the rest of us and the focus on regulations and enforcement on the trucks/drivers w/o the same focus on other vehicles/drivers. Fair for the goose, fair for the gander.

BTW, I've been told Panther is going to paperless logs. Heard anything about it?

Kel
Panther Expedited Services
Elite Services
O/O #5515, #5591

 

[rode2rouen]

>Yes, I recently did get my cdl-b, however i had a class-a
>back in the early 90's but let it 'expire' and entered into
>another business venture.
>

Did you also find the area of your other "business venture" to be needing additional legislation to make it palatable for you to engage in the business?


>I had decided to get back into trucking and have noticed
>alot of areas which could use some improvement and SOME
>additional government regulations.
>
>If you really thing WE AS AN INDUSTRY can monitor ourselfs
>you are very very mistaken - I believe we have failed in
>doing so thus far.
>
>Yes MOST of us - the majority of us do indeed run within the
>law. However, most of us do not commit burglary, robbery,
>rape, etc but we still have laws against it and ways to
>capture those that do and monitor their activities.
>

Your continued use of "we" and "us" is quite disconcerting. You obviously are NOT "one of "US" as the majority of the posts from people who are actively participating in the transportation industry and responding to your original post are NOT in agreement with your original premise.


>And to the clown who thinks I am some sort of anti-truck
>group or government agent - HAY - I guess you listen to all
>those UFO shows too and believe them all and you most love
>the REAL ACTION OF the WWE!
>

While I will admit to enjoying the Art Bell Show on occasion, I make sure that I have my tin foil lined cap on for safety's sake.
HAY is for horses, HEY is a word used to get another person's attention.


>The more I discuss this the more I really and honestly
>believe this would be a good thing - its off to my
>congressman and senator!
>

chuckwagon, I hate to be the bearer of bad news, but you haven't discussed ANYTHING. You have, in your 5 posts thus far in the EO Forums, 3 of which are in this topic, shown yourself to be a clueless newbie with regards to the transportation industry. I reiterate my earlier advice: Get a driving job. Join the OOIDA. Run compliant. After you have accumulated some "seat time" you may find an audience that is a bit more receptive to your suggestions as you will then have the experience to be able to to use the words "we" and "us" in the manner you are trying to use them now.

My mother once told me: "It's not nice to engage in a battle of wits with someone who is unarmed."


Rex

 

[ACE]

Right on LDB use the laws already on the books to prosecute violaters.

We do not need any more Govt. involvement in the trucking industry.

We all need to be responsible for our actions.

More laws will not help save anyone it will be a revenue source for the state and federal Govt.

 

[LDB]

chuckwagon, you are obviously entitled to your opinion but unfortunately it is specious at best. Your example of robbers and rapists proves the opposing point. We do not put more and more monitors on people just in case one of them may be a robber or rapist. We have laws that deal with them after they commit the offense. Obviously the penalties aren't severe enough because the laws continue to be broken. The solution isn't more laws or monitoring. The solution is harsher and harsher penalties until the consequence is too severe to risk the action. That is just common sense and the only true solution to the problem.

Leo Bricker, 73's K5LDB, OOIDA 677319
Owner, Panther trucks 5507, 5508, 5509
Highway Watch Participant, Truckerbuddy
EO Forum Moderator
----------
Support the entire Constitution, not just the parts you like.

 

[Tennesseahawk]

Chuckwagon... I suppose you don't run over the speed limit either. Come on. If you think the HOS rules are actually put there to protect the public, I have an honest senator to sell ya.

The government loves to make rules, then not enforce them. They're there to placate those who either whine too much (MATT), or those who pad the pockets (ATA). No one is interested in the fact that the more limits that are placed on us, the independant drivers, the less we can provide for our families. So if you want sympathy for your plans to put heavier shackles on the drivers, you need to join ATA or MATT, and as Greyhound says "Leave the driving to us!"

"If I claim to be a wise man, it surely means that I don't know." - Kansas