Independent Contractor or misclassification?

[ATeam]

Probably should add, after the issues with Ground, I have to think the folks at the Fed took a pretty close look at Custom Critical and I am not aware of any changes they made with regards to contractors.

One change they did make that was told to me by someone who works at FedEx CC HQ, was opening the door wider to large fleet owners. There was a time when fleet owers were prohibited from having more than five trucks in the fleet. That limit is long gone, partly because, it was explained, it makes the carrier look like more of a business-to-business company instead of a business to individual contractor (who, in view of FedEx Ground court rulings, can be deemed employees).

I have never believed and do not now believe that a FedEx Custom Critical individual contractor is in danger of being classified as an employee.

But it is nevetheless true that the FedEx Ground employee misclassification cases prompted FedEx Custom Critical to open the door wider to larger fleet owners (perhaps in response to kneejerk guidance from Big FedEx in Memphis whose people may have been feeling a little tender after their FedEx Ground case losses).

 

[zorry]

Fedex Ground has moved away from one truck operators in some locations. They encouraged, or required, single operators to pair up into three truck or larger fleets. And incorporate.

 

[ATeam]

Why its it that that drivers feel like owners owe them everything? If you think 40% of the line haul (if the drivers are paying for fuel) is making owners rich your very mistaken. We have to maintain trucks that driver love to misused and tear up. When I started drivers was given 50% of the line haul then it was raised to 60% to help offset the high cost of fuel. There was no FSC at that time, now that there is I feel that it should go back to a 50/50. The cost of trucks are almost four times they was in 1995. If drivers don't like how owners lease out the trucks, they can go buy one.

Bruno, you are a fleet owner. I am a driver. Why don't we both save each other a lot of trouble and cut to the chase. I'll give you my address and you can start sending me money there. Let's make the process more efficient by forgetting about things like trucks and freight. Just send money.

 

[zorry]

I have never believed and do not now believe that a FedEx Custom Critical individual contractor is in danger of being classified as an employee.

.

Phil, does this refer to a one truck operator, as yourself, or to a driver driving for a multi-truck owner ?

 

[ATeam]

Phil, does this refer to a one truck operator, as yourself, or to a driver driving for a multi-truck owner ?

It refers to a one-truck owner-operator like myself. It would also apply to a driver driving for a multi-truck fleet owner (like Diane and I did for a time), as long as the fleet owner and driver structure their relationship in a way that passes the independent contractor test.

Some fleet owner exert more control over their drivers than others. They are the ones who risk getting into trouble with employee misclassification.

 

[cheri1122]

Why its it that that drivers feel like owners owe them everything?

If you are thinking of all drivers as alike, [lazy, wasteful, abusive of your equipment], you're going to have a tough time finding & keeping the good ones. Just as drivers who think all fleet owners are cheap, dishonest, and unscrupulous will have trouble connecting with the ones who aren't.
I know you have seen some bad drivers, but if you let it color your perception of all drivers, it isn't doing you any good.


If drivers don't like how owners lease out the trucks, they can go buy one.

And if fleet owners don't like the way drivers drive the trucks, they can drive it themselves.
Now, isn't that just silly?

Sent from my PH44100 using EO Forums mobile app

 

[Turtle]

If you want something done right, you have to do it yourself.

 

[Bruno]

Tell that to the Ohio labor board Turtle.

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[Bruno]

I drove OTR for 17 years and you know this. I'm not talking about all drivers, just the ones that think everyone owes them the world but will only stay in service 60%. Davekc you know what I'm talking about. Misskat and her husband paid an Equipment Rental, but it was given back in the form of an in service bonus.

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[Tomtom]

This is from Blacks Law Dictionary

What is INDEPENDENT CONTRACTOR?
This term describes the person who is asked do perform an action or job who maintains the control over the job.

We have drivers that lease trucks and they pay Mayfield Express a percentage of the income from the trucks. As for providing the contractor equipment to do the job. Our driver's rent equipment from us to do the job. They have control over what loads they take or turn down.

Like Davekc we used a Lawyer for our contract.

Who do you pay? I haven't found any carrier that pays the driver with exception of those that bring the driver on as an employee and then also pay the fleet owner. A two pay system.

I understand the financial reasons why so many swear up and down that this is legal. But proof is in case law. And no one can provide a workers comp case that the fleet owner or carrier won. Plenty of cases that have been lost. And many states that have won cases against actual ICs.

Interesting side question: a lot is said about insurance and multi carrier model. What about workers comp requirements? Point blank asked Jerry about this with Ford and GM and true O/O's and was told it didn't matter. WC was required as condition of contact. Or is this insurance requirement ignored because we all think it is silly?

 

[davekc]

independent contractors and workmans comp are not the same thing. Both are viewed differently depending on what state you are talking about.

 

[ATeam]

I understand the financial reasons why so many swear up and down that this is legal. But proof is in case law. And no one can provide a workers comp case that the fleet owner or carrier won. Plenty of cases that have been lost. And many states that have won cases against actual ICs.

I'm a little confused by your post. When you say proof is in case law, what is it exactly that case law proves? When you say "... that this is legal," what does "this" refer to? What is the point you wish to make?

 

[Deville]

If I, as an IC,went and leased a truck from wherever, why wouldn't I then negotiate and/or sign a lease with the carrier of MY Choice ?

Just food for thought .

You shouldn't even have to tell them that much. At FEDEX we just sign off on the VRU or the C-link. I don't tell anyone over there anything.

I have spoken to some guys in person & read some posts on here where drivers tell the CC's or dispatch every move they make. I got news for you, these people don't give a crap about you.

 

[zorry]

D- you either missed my point, or you included the wrong quote in your answer.

My point was:
If I go to Mr DeVille and get a truck how independent am I if he says " you MUST work it at company XYZ, and you must work 23 days a month average."
That does not seem like I'm very independent.

 

[iceroadtrucker]

Here some information for ya. If its to be it begins with me.
Im not an Employee to any one. You want the load done then u deal with me. Not some one else that not here.
have nice day.
Dont do that Again.
On another note
Politicians and Lawers are truely wonderful people dont you agree.

 

[Fkatz]

Hey Guys,

The IRS had a this item with FEDEX CC and all other divisions, and they Lost that is (IRS) anyone they go after can bring up this Case in Point FEDEX VS the Commissioner, I think it was in 2008 that this occurred in reference to Indepentant Contractor VS Employee.
I do not know what the actual case was called but I think you can check online,
Stand by and I will try an find it

Franklin Katz RTP, ATP, PA, PB
Frank's Tax & Business
315 E. King St
Kings Mountain, NC 28086
704-739-4039
fax: 704-739-3934
website www.prep.1040.com/frankstax

IRS Circular 230: Pursuant to requirements ofpractice before the Internal Revenue Service, any tax advice contained in this communication (including anyattachments) is not intended to be used, and cannot be used, for purposes of(i) avoiding penalties imposed under the United States Internal Revenue Code or(ii) promoting, marketing, or recommending to another person any tax-relatedmatter.

 

[Fkatz]

Hey, Guys

Type in the Search bar FedEx Vs IRS,
The IRS started the complaint in 2007 and in Nov of 2009 FedEx won.

Check it out

Franklin Katz RTP, ATP, PA, PB
Frank's Tax & Business
315 E. King St
Kings Mountain, NC 28086
704-739-4039
fax: 704-739-3934
website www.prep.1040.com/frankstax

IRS Circular 230: Pursuant to requirements ofpractice before the Internal Revenue Service, any tax advice contained in this communication (including anyattachments) is not intended to be used, and cannot be used, for purposes of(i) avoiding penalties imposed under the United States Internal Revenue Code or(ii) promoting, marketing, or recommending to another person any tax-relatedmatter.

 

[davekc]

I think Frank you are confusing it with the one in California. That only revolved around the Ground division. They did lose that but that was because of directed scheduling, mandatory uniforms, mandatory vehicle purchases and the list goes on. The minute you start controlling those things you are in dangerous water.

 

[Fkatz]

Davekc

Did you read the post that I told everyone to look at. I really did not have a chance to do an indepth study of it,

Frank

 

[zorry]

IRT. Do you own your truck ? If so, I believe YOU are independent.
If you drive for a fleet, maybe not so much. Depending on how much freedom the fleet owner gives you.