Big Truck I work on Hino trucks. I'll answer any questions I know the answers to.

[greasytshirt]

Had that burner cavity blown out with the air.
When doing injection quantity test engine speed stayed pretty much around 1492-1508 rpm all the time.
injection quantity was going between 8.2 and 9.8.

For the max DPR out temp before we had sys.protection data reset, it was in 1780sF

Also, checking exhaust brake adjustment, I had engine at 980rmp applying the trigger.
The result on injection quantity was 6.5-7.5 before and 15-16.5 after. And you said it needs to be at difference of 12-14
So, I suppose, we'll need to adjust that too.

1492-1508 is a fairly wide rpm delta. The theoretical maximum allowed is 25 rpm, but if this truck was under warranty I would have recommended their replacement.

17xx degrees is absolutely scorching hot. The ceramic the DPF is made of melts around 1485 or something. 1700 degrees is hot enough to damage the Scr.


Since I'm troubleshooting this remotely, take this with a grain of salt: replace the injectors and DPF. Look at the DPF inlet temp. If around 1300, remove and clean the CAC, and inspect the turbo for excessive shaft wear. Reset the exhaust brake. Set soot amount to 2.2, start a regen, go to engine diagnostic menu , data monitor NOx sensor voltages, def consumption. Outlet voltage should be much lower than inlet when def is being injected. Neither voltage should oscillate. Check P/n of NOx sensors. The latest, best ones end in E0451. If you see oscillation and they're older sensors, replace them both.

My concern at this point is the Scr could have been damaged by that temp. Replacing that would raise the cost another 30%.

Adjust the valves when the injectors are replaced. No one does this on time, if ever.



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[greasytshirt]

Somewhere, someone is reading this and freaking out.

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[rhitrucking]

how on earth do you get the inside bolt off the scv without dissasembling everything?

 

[Shawhawk]

Quick question: whats a fuel optimizer for the 2011 hino 338? What does it do? Can i still drive it even tho the dealer said i need it?

 

[tom]

found more records for this truck (2011 268 with 155K miles)
had next services done by the dealer:
- at 85K
"TURBOCHARGER AND CONTROLLER HAD FAILED. - Replaced under warranty
REPLACED TURBOCHARGER, HARDWARE AND CONTROLLER.
BCU WAS MISSING. INSTALLED CUSTOMER SUPPLIED BCU. REPROGRAMMED BCU.
DRAIN PLUG WAS MISSING"
- at 123K
"INJECTOR FAILURE. REMOVED VALVE COVER. 2 VALVE COVER BOLTS BROKE IN HOUSING.
DRILLED AND EXTRACTED 2 BOLTS. REMOVED INJECTORS.
INJECTOR SLEEVES WERE LEAKING COOLANT.
REPLACED 6 SLEEVES. INSTALLED REPLACEMENT INJECTORS,
REPLACED DPR FILTER, GASKETS AND HARDWARE.
CLEANED BURNER NOZZLE AND CHECK IGNITERS. FOUND IGNITERS FAILED.
REMOVED AND REPLACED IGNITERS.
TROUBLESHOOT BCU U0100 COMMUNICATION CODE.
FUSE FOR BCU KEPT BLOWING ALL THE TIME. FOUND FAULTY DEVICE, REPLACED BCU."
So I am thinking to pause on replacing injectors for now. I will try to do injectors quantity test once again and will send to your consideration.

We also have another Hino (2013) that had Turbo replaced under warranty at 38K then Injectors with DPF (center section) replaced at 80K and again at 194K, both under warranty.
Then another Hino 2013 with the same "Injectors Failed" sentence at 168K and had it replaced along with DPF.
Just wandering is that a common issue or pure quality of injectors, or the way they are diagnosed? I've heard that some dealers also doing their best to have these things replaced

Thanks a lot for your time,
Tom

 

[greasytshirt]

how on earth do you get the inside bolt off the scv without dissasembling everything?

I feel your pain.

Gear wrench 3/8 drive, six inch allen driver with a ball end. They sell them in a set at advance auto for $30. Easiest thing I've found.

If you start to strip one, stop. Get a long narrow punch. Put it on the side of the bolt head and pop it squarely with a 12-16 oz hammer. The shock will loosen it. If you completely strip it you might have to take the injection pump off (which doesn't really take that long).

Quick question: whats a fuel optimizer for the 2011 hino 338? What does it do? Can i still drive it even tho the dealer said i need it?

Atomizer. It's like fuel injection to feed a burner (to heat the DPF for regens). It's a black and aluminum box tucked up above the burner. This part is essential. The truck will reward you with severe limp mode if this is not addressed.


What did they say is wrong with it? Sometimes pressure problems with it are misdiagnosed, but they do legitimately go bad. O-rings and regulator seals are now available if it starts leaking fuel between the aluminum base and plastic cover. Other than that, I haven't attempted to repair one. They have high core value; none are lying around the shop.

 

[greasytshirt]

found more records for this truck (2011 268 with 155K miles)
had next services done by the dealer:
- at 85K
"TURBOCHARGER AND CONTROLLER HAD FAILED. - Replaced under warranty
REPLACED TURBOCHARGER, HARDWARE AND CONTROLLER.
BCU WAS MISSING. INSTALLED CUSTOMER SUPPLIED BCU. REPROGRAMMED BCU.
DRAIN PLUG WAS MISSING"
- at 123K
"INJECTOR FAILURE. REMOVED VALVE COVER. 2 VALVE COVER BOLTS BROKE IN HOUSING.
DRILLED AND EXTRACTED 2 BOLTS. REMOVED INJECTORS.
INJECTOR SLEEVES WERE LEAKING COOLANT.
REPLACED 6 SLEEVES. INSTALLED REPLACEMENT INJECTORS,
REPLACED DPR FILTER, GASKETS AND HARDWARE.
CLEANED BURNER NOZZLE AND CHECK IGNITERS. FOUND IGNITERS FAILED.
REMOVED AND REPLACED IGNITERS.
TROUBLESHOOT BCU U0100 COMMUNICATION CODE.
FUSE FOR BCU KEPT BLOWING ALL THE TIME. FOUND FAULTY DEVICE, REPLACED BCU."
So I am thinking to pause on replacing injectors for now. I will try to do injectors quantity test once again and will send to your consideration.

We also have another Hino (2013) that had Turbo replaced under warranty at 38K then Injectors with DPF (center section) replaced at 80K and again at 194K, both under warranty.
Then another Hino 2013 with the same "Injectors Failed" sentence at 168K and had it replaced along with DPF.
Just wandering is that a common issue or pure quality of injectors, or the way they are diagnosed? I've heard that some dealers also doing their best to have these things replaced

Thanks a lot for your time,
Tom

On the injector cups: Did someone put DEF in cooling system? DEF corrodes the copper in the injector cups very badly. This does happen somewhat frequently. A bad human error, the truck has no way of failure that will put DEF in the cooling system.

BCU failure, in my experience, is very very rare. I've never replaced one. Weird electrical problems with this part of the truck is often caused by corrosion. Check the firewall junction box. Remove cover, unplug stuff, inspect closely. Replace cover if there are any gaps in the insulation.


The injector thing is a thing. It's especially a thing when people put (readily available) incorrect fuel filters on them, or never change the fuel filter, or running dirty watery fuel. New England has some crappy dirty diesel fuel, the trucks fueling up around New York are gonna suffer. In my opinion, the burner systems on the 2011-2014 trucks are the worst part of the whole vehicle. In my opinion, if you're working with one of these, be prepared to do a little bit of simple maintenance now and then. In particular, taking a few parts out and carefully cleaning them.

The root cause of the burner issues generally stem from excessive soot from failing fuel injectors.

They totally fixed the truck in 2015, moving to a much, much simpler and robust method. 2015-2017 trucks are looking very, very good. The 2013-up cabover trucks have the same setup as the 2015-up conventionals. Regen issues on the cabovers have been basically nonexistent.

 

[tom]

On the injector cups: Did someone put DEF in cooling system? DEF corrodes the copper in the injector cups very badly. This does happen somewhat frequently. A bad human error, the truck has no way of failure that will put DEF in the cooling system.

On this particular truck we had coolant leak inside DEF tank and it was fixed by replacing the whole tank with accessories. Could that lead to DEF getting into cooling circuit? If so, then it explains the issue with injector cups.

 

[tom]

The injector thing is a thing. It's especially a thing when people put (readily available) incorrect fuel filters on them, or never change the fuel filter, or running dirty watery fuel.

Hmm..just talked to a mechanic, he is 100% sure that they replace fuel filters on all the trucks at every PM, which is 12-13K miles. We buy them from our local Hino dealer.
Is there anyway to figure out what individual injector is giving a problem? Like some type of return flow test by turning off them one by one and comparing common flow.
Seems like chances small to have all of them fail at once. And all together will cost us a small fortune

 

[greasytshirt]

Hmm..just talked to a mechanic, he is 100% sure that they replace fuel filters on all the trucks at every PM, which is 12-13K miles. We buy them from our local Hino dealer.
Is there anyway to figure out what individual injector is giving a problem? Like some type of return flow test by turning off them one by one and comparing common flow.
Seems like chances small to have all of them fail at once. And all together will cost us a small fortune

Unless one is completely off the chart bad, replace them all. I've played the 'find the worst injector' game several times. You'll end up replacing them all after cooking another DPF.

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[greasytshirt]

On this particular truck we had coolant leak inside DEF tank and it was fixed by replacing the whole tank with accessories. Could that lead to DEF getting into cooling circuit? If so, then it explains the issue with injector cups.

It is much more likely that the engine will pump excess coolant into def tank than the other way around.

Did they show you the injector cups they removed?

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[ducty]

Isuzu question: Just bought a 2009 npr-hd 6.0 gas. Starts right away except if it is -15 degrees overnight, then it cranks but no fire. Checked voltage to fuel pump at pump when cranking and had no voltage. Ecm is getting power though. Will start when it warms up to 15 above. ??
Thanks for being here!

 

[tknight]

-15 fuel could be jelled? Do you plug in the truck at night?


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Didnt read gas but still plug it it

 

[coalminer]

Most times I have seen a fuel injected gas engine not start when it's really cold the coolant temperature sender (ecm sensor not the gauge sensor) is not right and it thinks the engine is warmer than what it actually is so it's not giving it enough gas to start in the cold.


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[ducty]

I'll try plugging it in when it gets cold again but the fuel pump should still run when cranking and since its not getting voltage I was wondering if it could be ice in a connector or relay? Hopefully I will have time to check connectors and maybe swap relays during this warm spell we are having.

 

[greasytshirt]

Isuzu question: Just bought a 2009 npr-hd 6.0 gas. Starts right away except if it is -15 degrees overnight, then it cranks but no fire. Checked voltage to fuel pump at pump when cranking and had no voltage. Ecm is getting power though. Will start when it warms up to 15 above. ??
Thanks for being here!

I'd start by locating the fuel pump relay and testing it. Maybe I'd put 12v into the wire going to the pump to see if it turns on, or to see if there's a break in the wiring or something.

Then again, you've got more to check. I'd want to see if the ignition system worked when cranking it over. If it had no fuel pressure and no spark, I bet it lost crank or cam position signal.

 

[ducty]

There probably was no spark either, I will clean and grease (dielectric) those connectors too and wait for -15 degrees again.
I will keep you posted, thanks again

 

[greasytshirt]

There probably was no spark either, I will clean and grease (dielectric) those connectors too and wait for -15 degrees again.
I will keep you posted, thanks again

I'd look up specs for the cam and crank position sensors, and replace them if they're out of spec, on the edge of spec, or if they have thermal damage of any sort.

Of course, this is all a guess because I'm not there in person.

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[coalminer]

Well if it's not one thing it's another, just got my oil and fuel filters changed, a new wheel seal on the right rear (again) went to start her up and nothing. The starter is clicking but not turning, guess I will pull it apart and check the brushes tomorrow.....


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[Waback]

Dealer wants to replace the tcm on my 2013 Hino 195h. It's 1000 bucks. The red atm light has come on multiple times going into the safety mode. After taking it in several times they have read the codes and not enough voltage.