Hello Panther II

[Bob and Hooligan]

Thanks for all the good info.

I have complied with all items listed in the regulations. I assume others who have had their pay held have as well.

So, my question to the company is: Why do you think your policy can change the terms of a contract signed by both the company and the contractor?

Oh yes. I want my money!

Bob and Hooligan

 

[Broompilot]

Not to critize Panther but wow thats the second time this has come up. I find that very troubling to do something like that.

Second find a small company that cares about their own success as much as yours. (Landstar seemed to be the only giant I have seen with that attitude) actually they put the whole ball in your seat.

I am with a small carrier and its right to the top if there is a pay issue and I get an answer right there or very soon. It is so easy dealing with a group that cares about you and vs - vs. I have never had an issue that was not explained to me or if I proved there was a mistake that it was taken care of in a Professional manner. Such a a pleasure being treated well. Thanks Cal, Mike, Tom, and all of our Dispatch and office Staff.

 

[Tennesseahawk]

Dave, so what you're saying is that after a week, Panther deems the lease terminated. Because that's the ONLY time, in the regs you've posted, that the company can withhold the money once all required paperwork is in.

There are some things that can result from this, if in fact Panther is terminating the lease until you're back in service. For one, do you still have insurance? Do you still have medical ins., if you decided on that at orientation?

It's obvious that Panther is twisting the words of the DOT here, to benefit themselves. And it's only a matter of time it comes back to bite them in the arse. Though it seems that this is a result of contractors walking away from Panther without telling them they're doing so. We all get punished for the crap a few jerks pull.

 

[davekc]

this is a result of contractors walking away from Panther without telling them they're doing so. We all get punished for the crap a few jerks pull.


That would seem like the likely reason. It is a gray area, thus their reason for notification prior to a extended leave to recieve last or final run compensation.
Agreement on that policy is debatable, but based on those above posted regs, they are in compliance.
That is why it hasn't been successfully challenged.

Escrow covers the QC, permits ect. But it isn't covering vehicle insurance and occ. insurance.
If one walks without notification, they are stuck with your bills.
$1,000 escrow doesn't go far if someone walks.




Davekc
owner
21 years
PantherII
EO moderator

 

[Sleepydog]

I just had this happen to me as well. I have been with Panther for two years. I spoke to a safety supervisor who informed me that the ONLY reason they do this is to ensure that they (Panther) have enough money held back "in case" you sign on with someone else or quit before they get the QC and permits back. Was told that Panther wrote off over $100k in QC's last year because they were not returned. When I asked why they didn't take legal action against those people I was told that it cost more to sue them than the equipment was worth. I do see Panther's view point to a limited degree, but also agree with a previous post - how much can a 2+ year old QC be worth. I was always under the impression that once a QC was "assigned" to a company that it took some major reprograming and downloads from San Diego before they could be used by someone else. To my knowledge Panther is the only company I know of who operates with this mind set. So I am with holding the paperwork until I go back into service. The sad thing is that 99 people can be honest, hard-working, and respectful and they aren't even thought of; but one person can screw it up for everyone. But no matter what company you are with you will find something they do you don't like. Over all I am very happy with Panther and am looking forward to the changes coming our way this year.
OK - I vented now -- where do I send the $5.00 for whining??:'( :'(

 

[terryandrene]

GIC and Bob:

Please think twice before holding back your paperwork when you go out of service. You just give your carrier all the more justification for wrongfully holding onto your earnings. There must be a better way to convince them to pay as prescribed in the Federal Regulations than for you to also violate your lease agreement.

Terry

 

[sunshinetomorow]

sunshine to all
right on big guy, about time one of you expeditors had grit;-)

 

[sunshinetomorow]

sunshine to all
that may be true but the two years i've been in this business right doesn't seem to matter. by law they are not allowed to hold on after 14 daysw but what the heh, when did the law matter when the little guy is up against the big boys. like are you are you really geting full settlement or do dispatchers play favorites not very professional but we all know its done. Till the drivers stick to gather this garbage will continue. Look at how they reversed fuel prices at election time, not at katrina time as ooida implied in their last mag. Ain't life grand.;-)

 

[sunshinetomorow]

sunshine to all
Rich you are right talked to a shipper one time because one of my bills somehow disappeared. When I went sback to them to get a duplicate, they told me they paid as soon as they signed the receipt ( the Receiver ). So despite what the the contracters say they only need those signed bills as backup to receive their monies.

 

[Sleepydog]

Just venting Terry. You are right, holding onto the paperwork doesn't help anyone. Besides that I would probably lose the paperwork. But I do know that alot of fleet owners with Panther reads the post from here and have a "little more leverage" than those of us who only have one truck. Like I said, overall I am pleased with Panther and do understand their concern, I just hope they realize that this problem has two sides.

 

[LDB]

Ok, I'm not sure I'm totally understanding this but what I seem to get from all this is:

You go out of service showing 10 days out before returning and they hold you pay until you are back in service because it's over 7 days out of service.

OR

You phone in and advise them you are going on a cruise, hunting trip, major nose picking expedition or whatever and will be out 10 days and return after that and because they got a call and know what's going on they don't hold your pay.

Am I missing something or is that what all this boils down to?

Leo Bricker, owner trucks 3034, 4958
OOIDA 677319
73's K5LDB
EO Forum Moderator 1+ Years of Service
Expediters Online.com - The Best is Getting Better!
-----
Support the entire Constitution, not just the parts you like.

 

[greg334]

Look I am no lawyer but termination is far from being out of service and the fact is that the DOT and others (DOL and IRS) have something to say about how contractors get paid. I know first hand the limitations of a company to hold back any money for work rendered. I also know unless that contractor indicated a termination or even extended time off that will lead to termination, the company has little recourse to hold any payment from the contractor.

There are a lot of court precedents about breech of contract and too many lawyers make a living in civil courts suing companies, big and small about contract issues.

If panther is so incline to hold back pay, which has been legitimately earned as part of the contract, due to some worry of equipment that has been already depreciated and insured and other contractor obligations, they open themselves up to a law suit to correct policies that can be deemed illegal under many, many different precedents that have already been decided by others. It takes only one small group to start something to make changes, it happened at Microsoft and Oracle; both are somewhat larger companies and may have a legal department the same size as Panther itself.

I go back to my advice for Newbie’s, read your contract, and don’t be afraid to ask any questions that don’t make sense. If any company does not give you the time to read the contract before signing it, don’t sign it. If you are confused about something, contact a lawyer and pay to have things cleared up. A few hundred spent on a lawyer may save you a lot of money later.

 

[huntn1]

if most loads are prepaid or paid upon delivery why do they wait two weeks to pay anyway. most carriers pay weekly some even pay the day the load was hauled.

 

[Bob and Hooligan]

So let me get this straight. They withheld my pay because I might steal a piece of equipment that has no value on the black market. So, I couldn't sell it. I would be out my escrow money. That doesn't sound like a smart thing to do.

Perhaps they are not checking the background of new contractors enough. If they have an IQ below 30, and are convicted theives, don't hire them!

I treat my truck as a business. I do the work. I submit the billing, and I expect to be paid. I think the employees at the company get vacations. Souldn't we be able to also?

I know the policy is wrong. You know it is wrong. Why don't you just correct your mistake?

 

[davekc]

Leo

That is pretty much what it boils down to in my experience. Maybe a item to discuss in orientation to eliminate any confusion.


Davekc
owner
21 years
PantherII
EO moderator

 

[tr]

Key word to this whole situation is two wrongs don't make a right.
First and formost, all of us need to read and understand our contract. I know in most cases when changing companies a contract is put in front of you and you have only a few minutes to read it and sign it, at least that has been my case. But I learned after the first time, when sigining on with another company, to have them fax a copy of the contract to me so I could read it and fully understand it. Then... do what the contract says, if you have done your part right and the company defaults on their end, you may have some recourse. What is a rational recourse? My advice, even though not a member, join OOIDA for something like $20.00 to $25.00 a year, not sure of the rates. They have a customer service department which according to their staff will support and answer all driver/member questions.. They have the clout and can help; however it will always reflect back on "have you done everything your were suppose to do". I'm not pushing OOIDA but they seem to have their stuff together. Will I join? Yep probably eventually, they have more to offer than just the soloution and or action(s) pertaining to contract problems. Go to OOIDA and check out their web page, listen to them on satellite radio and make your decision. One thing for sure most of us don't have the time or money to fight any disputes which are effecting us unnecessairly or unjustly. Anyway good luck to all who encounter problems, and most importantly let the readers of this forum know what you did to resolve the problem if you were successful.

 

[joebob1_30132]

i thought panther sold out which whould be good they need somebody who knowes how to run a buisnes:7

 

[hondaking38]

wife and i are headed to puerto-rico then aruba for 8 days on the 21st i hope PANTHER KEEPS MOST OF MY MONEY WHILE I AM GONE...that way when i get back from vacation, i will have some left

 

[Bob and Hooligan]

I would like to thank all of you who have posted about this problem.
As usual there was some very good advice given.

Read your contract! I couldn't agree more. I read mine, and see a breach in it.

Comment on both good and bad things. I promise a good comment just as soon as I can find one.

I know now what I will do to keep payment for future runs paid within the terms of the contract.

Thanks again

Bob and Hooligan

 

[huntn1]

BOYCOTT ARUBA