Firearm Choices
- Thread starter dhalltoyo
- Start date
Jefferson3000
Expert Expediter
As far as I know, it's illegal to have one in a commercial motor vehicle. Sad, but true. Probably better off with stuff that doesn't look like a concealed weapon, such as a kiddie baseball bat.
Can someone tell me if pepper spray is illegal in the truck? I'd want one of the big "Dog" Chapman style cans.
Can someone tell me if pepper spray is illegal in the truck? I'd want one of the big "Dog" Chapman style cans.
dhalltoyo
Veteran Expediter
Jeff,
The interest has come from folks that are not in the industry.
One guy has to deposit the store's funds late at night.
Another is a young lady who rides public transportation and she has to be at her stop in the wee hours of the morning. On several occasions, men have tried to coax her into their cars.
One gentlemen collects the coinage from video games, pinball machines, jukeboxes, pool tables, etc. Guess where most of them are located? A lot of the bars he has to go into are in remote rural areas.
The interest has come from folks that are not in the industry.
One guy has to deposit the store's funds late at night.
Another is a young lady who rides public transportation and she has to be at her stop in the wee hours of the morning. On several occasions, men have tried to coax her into their cars.
One gentlemen collects the coinage from video games, pinball machines, jukeboxes, pool tables, etc. Guess where most of them are located? A lot of the bars he has to go into are in remote rural areas.
nightcreacher
Veteran Expediter
Give Me A 44 Magnum,you Dont Need Bullets,the Size Of The Barrel Will Scare You Attacker To Death
BTW PEPPER SPRAY IN A TRUCK IS ALSO ILLEGAL
BTW PEPPER SPRAY IN A TRUCK IS ALSO ILLEGAL
In a prior lifetime I was one of the managers at one of the best firearms stores in the nation. We had everything from everyday home and personal protection to all grades of hunting to collectibles easily in 6 figures. I held an instructors permit for the CHL for a while then as well. The first and most important answer to your question is to throw away price as a selection criteria. If we were discussing neckties I'd say buy price. For a tool to defend myself or my family I'm buying what's best and price is immaterial.
The most important criteria in selection is training and willingness to learn. Are they going to put in the time to repetitively train and practice? If so, a pistol can be considered. If they are going to master the basics but not add training and practice as another regular hobby activity a revolver is a better choice.
It's the wrong place at the wrong time and the worst happens. The firearm has been produced and the threat has not abated. The gun is fired and on the second press of the trigger it fails to fire. What's wrong? Why didn't it fire? What do you do? How do you get it functioning again? The threat is there! What now!
Hopefully that will never be the situation. If it's a pistol did it malfunction due to a stovepipe jam? Did the magazine slip just enough to not chamber a round? Is it a bad round of ammo? Is it some other sort of failure? Which is it. FIX IT! THE THREAT IS STILL THERE!
If they are going to put in LOTS of hours on training and practice they'll have performed the drills to do that until they can do them in their sleep. It will take literally a fraction of a second to correct the problem and be back in battery. If they only want to master the basics a revovler is the way to go. If one round misfires you press the trigger, the cylinder turns, and it goes bang again, unless of course you exhausted the full cylinder of ammo already.
If they choose a pistol they also have to carry at least one extra loaded magazine with them AT ALL TIMES! Holy Cow, it malfunctioned because the magazine fell out into the mud at their feet. They can't put that filthy thing back in it even if they had the time to bend over and pick it up without being killed. Anyone carrying a pistol for protection without a spare magazine is an idiot.
For a revolver, Smith and Wesson in either 38spl or 357mag chambering. Dirty Harry's "most powerful handgun in the world" 44 mag is great for movies but not for personal defense. Virtually nobody can control the recoil to the degree necessary for rapid, well placed personal defense shots. It's better to hit them with a fly swatter than miss them with a bazooka. We're going up a good ways from the fly swatter of course. For everyday practice 38spl ammo is widely available and reasonably priced. When carried for defense 38spl +P ammo is substituted. It recoils more but not so much more they can't control it. As they continue to practice and improve, and if they choose a 357mag chambered revolver, they can move up to +P+ ammo and eventually to 357mag ammo.
For a pistol a 9mm in Glock or Sig is an excellent choice. I also really like John Browning's 1911 and 1935 designs, sold as the Colt (and others) 1911 and the Browning Hi-Power respectively. They are also excellent but require mastering the thumb safety during the presentation of the pistol, adding one more thing to learn and master. Do not go with the Beretta pistol. The safety is in the wrong place and also operates in the wrong (opposite) direction from what it should. It's the military pistol because it was cheapest, not because it was best.
Do not listen to the stores that say Taurus is just as good for either the revolver or pistol. The ones I named are the Maytag of firearms. Taurus is the excellent forgery that the casual observer would think is the exact same gun and the everyday person thinks is just as good. It's very good, but not quite at the level of the others. Again, I say all this based on my choices being what I want in my hand if I need to protect my family. If it's not THE BEST it's not good enough to defend my daughters.
I hope this helps a little.
The most important criteria in selection is training and willingness to learn. Are they going to put in the time to repetitively train and practice? If so, a pistol can be considered. If they are going to master the basics but not add training and practice as another regular hobby activity a revolver is a better choice.
It's the wrong place at the wrong time and the worst happens. The firearm has been produced and the threat has not abated. The gun is fired and on the second press of the trigger it fails to fire. What's wrong? Why didn't it fire? What do you do? How do you get it functioning again? The threat is there! What now!
Hopefully that will never be the situation. If it's a pistol did it malfunction due to a stovepipe jam? Did the magazine slip just enough to not chamber a round? Is it a bad round of ammo? Is it some other sort of failure? Which is it. FIX IT! THE THREAT IS STILL THERE!
If they are going to put in LOTS of hours on training and practice they'll have performed the drills to do that until they can do them in their sleep. It will take literally a fraction of a second to correct the problem and be back in battery. If they only want to master the basics a revovler is the way to go. If one round misfires you press the trigger, the cylinder turns, and it goes bang again, unless of course you exhausted the full cylinder of ammo already.
If they choose a pistol they also have to carry at least one extra loaded magazine with them AT ALL TIMES! Holy Cow, it malfunctioned because the magazine fell out into the mud at their feet. They can't put that filthy thing back in it even if they had the time to bend over and pick it up without being killed. Anyone carrying a pistol for protection without a spare magazine is an idiot.
For a revolver, Smith and Wesson in either 38spl or 357mag chambering. Dirty Harry's "most powerful handgun in the world" 44 mag is great for movies but not for personal defense. Virtually nobody can control the recoil to the degree necessary for rapid, well placed personal defense shots. It's better to hit them with a fly swatter than miss them with a bazooka. We're going up a good ways from the fly swatter of course. For everyday practice 38spl ammo is widely available and reasonably priced. When carried for defense 38spl +P ammo is substituted. It recoils more but not so much more they can't control it. As they continue to practice and improve, and if they choose a 357mag chambered revolver, they can move up to +P+ ammo and eventually to 357mag ammo.
For a pistol a 9mm in Glock or Sig is an excellent choice. I also really like John Browning's 1911 and 1935 designs, sold as the Colt (and others) 1911 and the Browning Hi-Power respectively. They are also excellent but require mastering the thumb safety during the presentation of the pistol, adding one more thing to learn and master. Do not go with the Beretta pistol. The safety is in the wrong place and also operates in the wrong (opposite) direction from what it should. It's the military pistol because it was cheapest, not because it was best.
Do not listen to the stores that say Taurus is just as good for either the revolver or pistol. The ones I named are the Maytag of firearms. Taurus is the excellent forgery that the casual observer would think is the exact same gun and the everyday person thinks is just as good. It's very good, but not quite at the level of the others. Again, I say all this based on my choices being what I want in my hand if I need to protect my family. If it's not THE BEST it's not good enough to defend my daughters.
I hope this helps a little.
Right on Leo, also look at Ruger revolvers and Kimbers. Kimber is a bit on the expensive side but they make a couple of nice .45 carry pieces. I carry a Ruger SP101 when I do carry. It is a 5 shot revolver in .357. Small, short barrel but a bit on the heavy side. It will do the job if needed. Layoutshooter
jaminjim
Veteran Expediter
For the average person, I think that the revolver is the better choice. less concealable, but when you squeeze the trigger it puts a round down range each time, every time. 357 SW with a four inch barrel would be my choice for knock down power.
Hey Leo what's the "P" stand for?
Most people, in my opinion don't have conviction to use a firearm. A person should never pull a weapon to scare someone off. My dad taught my brother and I to never pull a gun unless you pulled the trigger. As unpopular as that is to some of our more peaceful friends it is the best policy.
Hey Leo what's the "P" stand for?
Most people, in my opinion don't have conviction to use a firearm. A person should never pull a weapon to scare someone off. My dad taught my brother and I to never pull a gun unless you pulled the trigger. As unpopular as that is to some of our more peaceful friends it is the best policy.
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Some say it's power and some say it's powder and I don't know what it actually means, just that it gives you stairsteps of power if you go with a 357mag frame gun. Kimber is one of the (others) making 1911's and arguably the very best of the bunch. I do not suggest the 1911 as a beginner gun though because it adds learning the thumb safety to the mix. Also, it is hard to find one in 1911 and lastly it is only a single stack magazine so you lose some capacity. Ruger does make a good revolver but I'm going to have a Smith J frame in my pocket if I'm carrying a revolver.
When I carry I usually carry both. I have my primary, a pistol, in a strong side holster and my J frame in my weak side pocket. I don't think I'm Wyatt Earp. I'm prepared for the possibility of meeting my wife or daughters somewhere while I'm out. Should an incident arise I would pass them the revolver and then move away to hopefully take the fight with me. If it's my wife, the bad guy should hope he goes along and doesn't foolishly stay and wind up facing her instead of me. His odds are worse if he stays.
When I carry I usually carry both. I have my primary, a pistol, in a strong side holster and my J frame in my weak side pocket. I don't think I'm Wyatt Earp. I'm prepared for the possibility of meeting my wife or daughters somewhere while I'm out. Should an incident arise I would pass them the revolver and then move away to hopefully take the fight with me. If it's my wife, the bad guy should hope he goes along and doesn't foolishly stay and wind up facing her instead of me. His odds are worse if he stays.
I have a CCW permit issued by the State of Ohio for almost three (3) years.
The cost was $175 for 12 hours of classroom lectures by both an attorney and a licensed police instructor.
After passing written exams and range proficiency tests, you are then given an application to apply.
In Ohio, you must take the application to any Sherrif's office either in the County in which the application was given or any ADJACENT County. At this point, a background check is performed.
We were told this could take from 3-10 business days, although in my case, at least, I've never been charged with any misdemeanors or felonies, ever, and the permit was issued within two (2) days.
In addition, whenever you become engaged in conversation with ANY LAW ENFORCEMENT PERSONNEL, YOU MUST TELL HIM/HER you have a concealed weapon permit, and whether or not you are carrying at that moment.
If you are stopped by the police in your vehicle for a traffic offense, or any other matter, most of the time when they run your plate before existing their vehicle, the computer system automatically will flag your plate as a permit holder.
If someone should drive your vehicle, either a mechanic, relative, etc., etc., they too should inform the officer ASAP.
I have several Taurus handguns, and, found them to be very reliable.
Also, IMO, carrying extra clips, ammo, etc., etc., is only useful to bolster your confidence.
When a self-defense shooting occurs, both the attorney and instructor pointed out, that realistictly, in most instances usually less than 3 bullets are discharged. (Not gang-bangers involved in shoot-out).
For what it's worth, there seems to be a misconception that if you carry household items (such as hornet's spray, baseball bats, etc., etc.) in your vehicle, and these items are involved in either a fatal or nonfatal altercation, your not home free from liability.
If you use these items for self-protection, they became an unlicensed weapon and quite possibly somebody within our court system might have to prove/disprove why these items were purchased and stored in an OTR vehicle.
Be safe.
The cost was $175 for 12 hours of classroom lectures by both an attorney and a licensed police instructor.
After passing written exams and range proficiency tests, you are then given an application to apply.
In Ohio, you must take the application to any Sherrif's office either in the County in which the application was given or any ADJACENT County. At this point, a background check is performed.
We were told this could take from 3-10 business days, although in my case, at least, I've never been charged with any misdemeanors or felonies, ever, and the permit was issued within two (2) days.
In addition, whenever you become engaged in conversation with ANY LAW ENFORCEMENT PERSONNEL, YOU MUST TELL HIM/HER you have a concealed weapon permit, and whether or not you are carrying at that moment.
If you are stopped by the police in your vehicle for a traffic offense, or any other matter, most of the time when they run your plate before existing their vehicle, the computer system automatically will flag your plate as a permit holder.
If someone should drive your vehicle, either a mechanic, relative, etc., etc., they too should inform the officer ASAP.
I have several Taurus handguns, and, found them to be very reliable.
Also, IMO, carrying extra clips, ammo, etc., etc., is only useful to bolster your confidence.
When a self-defense shooting occurs, both the attorney and instructor pointed out, that realistictly, in most instances usually less than 3 bullets are discharged. (Not gang-bangers involved in shoot-out).
For what it's worth, there seems to be a misconception that if you carry household items (such as hornet's spray, baseball bats, etc., etc.) in your vehicle, and these items are involved in either a fatal or nonfatal altercation, your not home free from liability.
If you use these items for self-protection, they became an unlicensed weapon and quite possibly somebody within our court system might have to prove/disprove why these items were purchased and stored in an OTR vehicle.
Be safe.
You carry a spare magazine because one of the possible malfunctions in a pistol could be magazine failure. With a spare you do a reload and you are back in business. Without a spare you hold your paperweight hoping to live through the event. You can always take the remaining bullets out of the magazine and throw them at the assailant but they do tend to be less effective. Yes, 3 rounds or less is predominantly correct, with the rare exception, but as I pointed out in my original example if the magazine drops in the mud at your feet it's much quicker to retrieve the spare from your belt than grope in the dark for a now filthy magazine that will jam the gun if replaced.
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I should add, also, that while you are legal with a CCW permit in one state, reciprocity may not exist with another(s).
For instance, in Michigan I can carry with an Ohio permit as long as I adhere to their laws.
Driving through PA, however, I cannot carry in that state and must disarm the weapon according to PA laws.
But, citizens that have a CCW issued by PA can carry in the State of Ohio. (I think that is the current situation, still.)
These are just my experiences and opinions. Always contact the proper officials in such a serious decision.
For instance, in Michigan I can carry with an Ohio permit as long as I adhere to their laws.
Driving through PA, however, I cannot carry in that state and must disarm the weapon according to PA laws.
But, citizens that have a CCW issued by PA can carry in the State of Ohio. (I think that is the current situation, still.)
These are just my experiences and opinions. Always contact the proper officials in such a serious decision.
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arkjarhead
Veteran Expediter
I like the pistol made on the model 1911 frame that's called XD. It comes in 40 caliber Smith and Wesson, and it has a few safety features that others don't have. Like it has a section on the back of the pistol grip that must be depressed for it to fire. It cost abotu 450 dollars.
dragontrans0304
Seasoned Expediter
I carry a Magnum Research "Baby Eagle" in .45 ACP. It is compact and accurate. I have had this gun for about 6 yrs. and have never had a problem with the gun.
mrgoodtude
Not a Member
Glock Model #38 45 cal indestructible..
45 cal round will knock down anything it hits and mine is pretty accurate to 40 yards.
You can drop it in the mud, run over it and I bet you can hide it in the bottom of your aquarium and it won't hurt it.
You can get a model 20 (10mm) or choose to buy +P or +P+ (over pressure ammunition) but why?
The rounds are really hot and will probably pass through your intended target possibly hitting an innocent.
If you really want to get fancy you can get a Glock 45 cal with a Lasermax site laser for about $800 give or take fiddy.
This is a internal guide rod laser for more accuracy and is dead on for about 20-25 feet.
Heston for Prez
45 cal round will knock down anything it hits and mine is pretty accurate to 40 yards.
You can drop it in the mud, run over it and I bet you can hide it in the bottom of your aquarium and it won't hurt it.
You can get a model 20 (10mm) or choose to buy +P or +P+ (over pressure ammunition) but why?
The rounds are really hot and will probably pass through your intended target possibly hitting an innocent.
If you really want to get fancy you can get a Glock 45 cal with a Lasermax site laser for about $800 give or take fiddy.
This is a internal guide rod laser for more accuracy and is dead on for about 20-25 feet.
Heston for Prez
greg334
Veteran Expediter
I like the sig P226 navy. It was the most comfortable one I ever owned with the glock 17 and 22 right behind. I don't like heavy firearms (meaning large rounds) because if I am in tight places, it slows things down.
I also think the S&W detective special with a bobbed hammer is a good choice, easier to get out of a jacket.
I also think the S&W detective special with a bobbed hammer is a good choice, easier to get out of a jacket.
dcalien
Seasoned Expediter
I have a 357 magnum Taurus CIA model.
The CIA means carry it anywhere, not Central Intelligence Agency.
It has a two inch barrel, and is easier to hit a target at close range, obviously.
It cost about 450 bucks It is a revolver, and therefore never jams.
The hammer is recessed, and it fits easily in a pocket, without getting caught on anything.
I would hope to never shoot anyone with it, though if I did and missed, at least they would be deaf. Ha.
The CIA means carry it anywhere, not Central Intelligence Agency.
It has a two inch barrel, and is easier to hit a target at close range, obviously.
It cost about 450 bucks It is a revolver, and therefore never jams.
The hammer is recessed, and it fits easily in a pocket, without getting caught on anything.
I would hope to never shoot anyone with it, though if I did and missed, at least they would be deaf. Ha.