Crime set to increase.

layoutshooter

Veteran Expediter
Retired Expediter
ANYONE who would sell this "swill" is a danger to society. IF they are willing to help supply this poison they are likely to do anything that would harm others.

This is a SAD day. Revenues for criminal lawyers must be down. They will be getting LOTS of repeat business soon.

I am NO saying that the government SHOULD outlaw it, BUT, IF you are willing to supply it, you MUST be scum!




Inmates freed after crack penalties are eased​


WASHINGTON (AP) — Antwain Black was facing a few more years in Leavenworth for dealing crack. But on Tuesday, he was on his way home to Illinois, a free man.

Black, 36, was among the first of potentially thousands of inmates who are being released early from federal prison because of an easing of the harsh penalties for crack that were enacted in the 1980s, when the drug was a terrifying new phenomenon in America's cities.

"I can't wait for my son to get home," said Black's mother, Donetta Adams of Springfield, Ill. "I'll just be glad to hug him and kiss him and see him right now."

The 1980s-era federal laws punished crack-related crimes much more severely than those involving powdered cocaine — a practice criticized as racially discriminatory because most of those convicted of crack offenses were black.

More recently, the penalties for crack were reduced to bring them more in line with those for powder, and Tuesday was the first day inmates locked up under the old rules could get out early.

Black pleaded guilty in 2003 and was sentenced to 15 years. With changes in the law, good behavior and credit for time served in jail, he was freed from the federal penitentiary at Leavenworth, Kan., after 8½ years locked up for the crime.
Adams said her son earned a high school equivalency diploma behind bars, likes to cook and has talked about opening a restaurant.

"He told me, 'They don't have to worry about Antwain coming back,'" Adams said. "I tell him get out here and get a job and get something on his mind."

Some 12,000 prisoners are expected to benefit from reduced sentences over the next several years, with an estimated 1,900 eligible for immediate release as of Tuesday. On average, inmates will get three years shaved off their sentences. The reductions do not apply to people found guilty of crack offenses under state laws.

Kentucky inmate Darryl Flood, 48, thought he would have to wait until 2013 to get out of prison, more than a decade after he pleaded guilty to conspiracy to distribute crack. But on Monday a judge approved his release two years ahead of schedule.

Susan Cardwell, his sister in Haymarket, Va., said she was expecting him to arrive on a bus on Wednesday. She said she cried after getting a call from his lawyer with the news.
"He wants to get out, get a job and get his life back together," she said in a telephone interview. "He says he'll work two jobs if he has to."

Under the old system, a person convicted of crack possession got the same mandatory prison term as someone with 100 times the amount of powdered cocaine. Five grams of crack, about the weight of five packets of Sweet N'Low, brought a mandatory five years; it took 500 grams of powder to get the same sentence.

The law was seen as racially unfair since blacks made up the majority of people convicted of crack crimes, while whites were more likely to be found guilty of offenses involving powdered cocaine.

In 2010, Congress reduced the disparity in sentences for future cases. Last summer, the U.S. Sentencing Commission decided to apply the measure to inmates doing time under the old rules.

Chris Burke, a spokesman for the Federal Bureau of Prisons, said that he could not say exactly how many people would be let out Tuesday but that officials were working around the clock to process hundreds of orders from judges granting early release. In certain cases, prison officials have been given a grace period of several days to free inmates, Burke said.

The releases are the result of months of work by prosecutors, public defenders and judges across the country. Inmates' requests for sentence reductions were decided on a case-by-case basis, with courts taking into consideration such factors as the prisoner's behavior behind bars and threat to society.

In San Antonio, the federal public defender's office reported that it had about 15 to 20 inmates eligible for immediate release. In St. Louis, the office said it submitted 30 to 50 petitions asking for inmates to be set free right away.

In the eastern district of Virginia, which has the highest number of affected inmates anywhere in the country, public defender Michael Nachmanoff said that judges had ordered the immediate release of about 75 people.

Susan Cardwell said the last time she saw her brother was the day he went to prison. She can't wait to see him, she said, and has promised an all-you-can-eat buffet dinner to celebrate his return.

"After jail food for all those years, I'm sure he's going to pig out," she said.







Inmates freed after crack penalties are eased - Yahoo! News
 

paullud

Veteran Expediter
I guess they are looking for anyway possible to cut expenses even at the risk of the public. Why not increase the penalties for coke?

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layoutshooter

Veteran Expediter
Retired Expediter
You don't REALLY believe that they CARE about public safety do you? Drug abuse SHOULD be treated as a health issue. PUSHERS should be shot. Sort of in the words of that '60' song "Gull Durn the pusher man"! Rev Wright used the correct word in his church.
 

Pilgrim

Veteran Expediter
Retired Expediter
One of our candidates for POTUS has an answer to this problem:

...(Ron)Paul was the only candidate at the debate to make news, calling for the repeal of laws against prostitution, cocaine and heroin. The freedom to use drugs, he argued, is equivalent to the freedom of people to “practice their religion and say their prayers.” Liberty must be defended “across the board.” “It is amazing that we want freedom to pick our future in a spiritual way,” he said, “but not when it comes to our personal habits.”
...Welcome to Paulsville, where people are free to take soul-destroying substances and debase their bodies to support their “personal habits.”
But Paul had an answer to this criticism. “How many people here would use heroin if it were legal? I bet nobody would,” he said to applause and laughter...

Ron Paul’s land of second-rate values - The Washington Post
Of course Paul wasn't speaking to an audience made up of residents from inner city areas of Detroit, Memphis or Baltimore. Imagine the legions of the homeless that would end up on the streets of our cities large and small should this philosophy become the foundation for our laws regarding hard drugs.
 

tbubster

Seasoned Expediter
One of our candidates for POTUS has an answer to this problem:

Of course Paul wasn't speaking to an audience made up of residents from inner city areas of Detroit, Memphis or Baltimore. Imagine the legions of the homeless that would end up on the streets of our cities large and small should this philosophy become the foundation for our laws regarding hard drugs.

Just one more reason thank god he will never be on the ticket.
 

AMonger

Veteran Expediter
Just one more reason thank god he will never be on the ticket.

Yeah, good thing we won't have to put up with any of that freedom crap. I hate that.


Ron Paul 2012: America's last chance.

You know the problem with corrupt and abusive cops? They give the other 5% a bad name.
 

AMonger

Veteran Expediter
One of our candidates for POTUS has an answer to this problem:

Of course Paul wasn't speaking to an audience made up of residents from inner city areas of Detroit, Memphis or Baltimore. Imagine the legions of the homeless that would end up on the streets of our cities large and small should this philosophy become the foundation for our laws regarding hard drugs.

Freedom means, among other things, the freedom to fail, if that's where your choices take you. You can't eliminate that possibility without taking away everybody's freedom. Are you aware how many rights the War On Drugs has cost everybody?

Ron Paul 2012: America's last chance. If Ron Paul wins, America's chances of survival are slim. If any other current candidate wins, our chances are ZERO. Dr. Paul is the only candidate even proposing freedom and sound economics.

You know the problem with corrupt and abusive cops? They give the other 5% a bad name.
 

RLENT

Veteran Expediter
ANYONE who would sell this "swill" is a danger to society. IF they are willing to help supply this poison they are likely to do anything that would harm others.
Presumably ..... out of the mouths of babes .....

This is a SAD day. Revenues for criminal lawyers must be down. They will be getting LOTS of repeat business soon.

I am NO saying that the government SHOULD outlaw it, BUT, IF you are willing to supply it, you MUST be scum!
Just curious here - do you per chance run TVAL loads hauling psychotropic (mind-altering) drugs for large (or small) pharmaceutical companies ?

You know - the ones that are hugely over-prescribed in society at present ?

If so, it must be a real ***** to have to stoop to what essentially constitutes being a "legal" drug mule to earn a living ....

BTW, I do agree with you - people that profit (often obscenely) off the (legal or illict) drug habits or addictions of others are, in fact, scum ....
 
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RLENT

Veteran Expediter
Of course Paul wasn't speaking to an audience made up of residents from inner city areas of Detroit, Memphis or Baltimore. Imagine the legions of the homeless that would end up on the streets of our cities large and small should this philosophy become the foundation for our laws regarding hard drugs.
Better to go with the philosophy that allows criminal corporations to legally produce dangerous psychotropic, mind-altering drugs that destroy peoples lives and make them absolute basket cases, all the while reaping obscene profits in the process ?

Yeah .... that's the ticket .... afterall, it is capitalism at it's finest ...

Lemme know how you see that working out ..... :(
 
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RLENT

Veteran Expediter
I guess they are looking for anyway possible to cut expenses even at the risk of the public. Why not increase the penalties for coke?
10 And it came to pass, as Jesus sat at meat in the house, behold, many publicans and sinners came and sat down with him and his disciples.

11 And when the Pharisees saw it, they said unto his disciples, Why eateth your Master with publicans and sinners?

12 But when Jesus heard that, he said unto them, They that be whole need not a physician, but they that are sick.

13 But go ye and learn what that meaneth, I will have mercy, and not sacrifice: for I am not come to call the righteous, but sinners to repentance.


If you claim it ....... then own it ..... and live it ...
 

RLENT

Veteran Expediter
You don't REALLY believe that they CARE about public safety do you? Drug abuse SHOULD be treated as a health issue. PUSHERS should be shot. Sort of in the words of that '60' song "Gull Durn the pusher man"! Rev Wright used the correct word in his church.
I'll be waiting on an answer to the previous question I posed to you before I comment on this one ....
 

paullud

Veteran Expediter
10 And it came to pass, as Jesus sat at meat in the house, behold, many publicans and sinners came and sat down with him and his disciples.

11 And when the Pharisees saw it, they said unto his disciples, Why eateth your Master with publicans and sinners?

12 But when Jesus heard that, he said unto them, They that be whole need not a physician, but they that are sick.

13 But go ye and learn what that meaneth, I will have mercy, and not sacrifice: for I am not come to call the righteous, but sinners to repentance.


If you claim it ....... then own it ..... and live it ...

That doesn't say they shouldn't be punished though, it shows Jesus as being humble and that he is for everyone.

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Turtle

Administrator
Staff member
Retired Expediter
The conservative alternative to libertarianism is necessarily more complex. It is the teaching of classical political philosophy and the Jewish and Christian traditions that true liberty must be appropriate to human nature.
I about busted a gut laughing at that one. True liberty existed long before the constructs of Judaism and Christianity. Judaism and Christianity, and most other religions are designed specifically to control liberties and to redefine them as as others choose, and then impose those definitions onto others, believers and non-believers alike.

The freedom to enslave oneself with drugs is the freedom of the fish to live on land or the freedom of birds to inhabit the ocean — which is to say, it is not freedom at all
There are, actually, fish that live on land and birds that inhabit the ocean. Liberty means having the freedom to choose, including the freedom to enslave oneself with drugs, or alcohol, or... religion. Liberty means having the freedom to be stupid, and, if one so chooses, to put anything into their bodies they like. Liberty also means having the freedom from having someone else's versions of morality exerted onto them. Categorizing Ron Paul's views as "second-rate values" is a morality judgment, made because there are those who can't stand the thought of having to mind their own business and not be able to tell others what to do, of not being able to impose their own morality onto others in telling people how to live and how to think.

Why do Baptists object so strongly to pre-marital sex? They're afraid it might lead to drinking and dancing.
 

RLENT

Veteran Expediter
That doesn't say they shouldn't be punished though, it shows Jesus as being humble and that he is for everyone.
<sadly shaking head>

Is that all you get out of it ?

You figure that the drug abuse itself and the entirety of the personal degradation that usually accompanies it isn't punishment enough .... there has to be still more ?

What motivates your desire for retribution and vengeance .... against an individual who has committed a crime against himself ?

Love of your fellow man ?

At what point is this desire satiated .... life imprisonment ? .... the death sentence ?

You need more specificity ?

Here, try this:

3 And the scribes and Pharisees brought unto him a woman taken in adultery; and when they had set her in the midst,

4 They said unto him, Teacher, this woman was taken in adultery, in the very act.

5 Now Moses in the law commanded us, that such should be stoned: but what say you?

6 This they said, testing him, that they might have to accuse him. But Jesus stooped down, and with his finger wrote on the ground, as though he heard them not.

7 So when they continued asking him, he lifted himself up, and said unto them, He that is without sin among you, let him first cast a stone at her.

8 And again he stooped down, and wrote on the ground.

9 And they who heard it, being convicted by their own conscience, went out one by one, beginning at the eldest, even unto the last: and Jesus was left alone, and the woman standing before him.

10 When Jesus had lifted himself up, and saw none but the woman, he said unto her, Woman, where are those your accusers? has no man condemned you?

11 She said, No man, Lord. And Jesus said unto her, Neither do I condemn you: go, and sin no more.


He that has ears to hear, let him hear.

So many know the words .... but yet can't sing the tune .....
 
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OntarioVanMan

Retired Expediter
Owner/Operator
15 years for a little bit of crack?...that is nuts....this is a good thing.....meth, coke, crack are all dangerous drugs and could make some do whacky things....the sentences should of been equal....
 

layoutshooter

Veteran Expediter
Retired Expediter
All things should be equal. ALL pushers should shot. Drug pushers are disgusting. No reason for them to breathe. Their intent it to harm for profit. Evil greed.
 

OntarioVanMan

Retired Expediter
Owner/Operator
All things should be equal. ALL pushers should shot. Drug pushers are disgusting. No reason for them to breathe. Their intent it to harm for profit. Evil greed.

I would take it case by case....not just 2 high schoolers sharing a hit.....to throw a say 17 year old away for 15 years is just a waste and doesn't solve anything...if he/she wasn't a criminal before they sure will be when they get out....

so I go out and buy say 10 grams of crack and share it with a buddy...technically that makes me a pusher in a cops eye....and you'd shoot me for that?:eek:
 

jujubeans

OVM Project Manager
I would take it case by case....not just 2 high schoolers sharing a hit.....to throw a say 17 year old away for 15 years is just a waste and doesn't solve anything...if he/she wasn't a criminal before they sure will be when they get out....

so I go out and buy say 10 grams of crack and share it with a buddy...technically that makes me a pusher in a cops eye....and you'd shoot me for that?:eek:


he might not but I would...*LOL*
 

OntarioVanMan

Retired Expediter
Owner/Operator
yeah and Chef would still be doing "15 to Life" for that nickle bag of weed....LOL..................
 

Pilgrim

Veteran Expediter
Retired Expediter
Freedom means, among other things, the freedom to fail, if that's where your choices take you. You can't eliminate that possibility without taking away everybody's freedom. Are you aware how many rights the War On Drugs has cost everybody?
Let's say for the sake of discussion that starting tomorrow, cocaine, heroine, crystal meth, opium, and pot are declared legal. Let's also say that the US Govt will not get involved with the manufacture and sale of all this stuff (I know that's a stretch), so free market will control the availability, price, supply & demand - anyone with an entrepreneurial spirit can get into this industry legally. Of course there will be areas of the country where nothing will change because the gangs and drug cartels will continue to operate business as usual, not allowing any competition. However, in most areas the availability goes up dramatically and the price goes down. What are the consequences of that? Let's also stipulate - considering we're allowing everyone the freedom to fail - there will be no taxpayer funded bailouts, rehab programs, clinics, etc. In other words, if you're a drug addict you're on your own unless you can get help from the local churches or good Samaritan organizations that operate on private funds. We won't even get into the cost effect this will have on health insurance, to say nothing of property insurance and the rest of that industry. My point is that there would be a lot of unintended consequences that aren't being taken into account or that are totally unpredictable if hard drugs are legalized. The status quo isn't perfect my any means, but it's better than total legalization.

Of course some states would continue to make these drugs illegal, and the cost of law enforcement would have a direct impact on their taxpayers due to the lack of federal subsidies (Paul is decriminalizing only at the federal level). Any states that would go along with the federal legalization would probably become safe havens for the drug users and manufacturers, and create problems for their neighboring states.

The bottom line is that in spite of all the good ideas that Ron Paul promotes, it's his positions on these few areas like drugs and foreign policy that have made him unelectable to national office. His ideas sound good in theory but just won't work in the real world.
 
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