cpm gas vs diesel

mcavoy33 · Jun 20, 2011

I've done some searches on mpg and what people are getting but I didn't come across anything comparing the cost per mile of gas vs diesel.

I'm currently driving a company sprinter. I've been keeping track of mpg and how much I've been paying for fuel.

Last week, I drove 1772 miles. Fuel was $412.40

The cost per mile travelled is $0.233

On average I am getting 17.064 mpg in a diesel sprinter.

But we all know that diesel costs more $ / gal. If I take the price where I fueled up in Piedmont, SC, the cost for diesel there is listed right now at Pilot.com as $3.799 for diesel and $3.279 for unleaded.

At those prices, me getting 17.064 mpg driving a diesel. If I were to drive a gas vehicle, I would only need to get 14.7 mpg to have the same cents per mile cost.

Do others mind sharing how much it is costing them per mile to run? Do you guys keep track of that? As a noob, to me, the final cost per mile is more important to me than the MPG because its factoring the cost of fuel.

It drives me insane that the auto diesel out front is anywhere from 10-30 cents more per gallon than in the back. If I bought my own sprinter, I think I'd put a bigger nozzle on my tank so I could fill up in the back.

greg334 · Jun 20, 2011

what kind of sprinter you driving?

a box sprinter?

17 mpg is low for a 2500.

I thought the nozzle would fit.

bobwg · Jun 20, 2011

I have a Sprinter and yes the nozzle will fit you have to stay with it holding it but it will fit and almost always fill up in back with the big trucks unless the line is too long so try to fill up early in morning or late at night. I average around 20 mpg

mcavoy33 · Jun 20, 2011

greg334 said:
what kind of sprinter you driving?

a box sprinter?

17 mpg is low for a 2500.

I thought the nozzle would fit.

I actually never tried the nozzle but I was told by the other driver that it wouldn't fit and I had to go to the front.

I should note that I have a heavy foot, I pretty much always drive 6-7 miles over the speed limit so I'm doing 76-77 mph most of the time. About half of my loads have been get there asap. I haven't been told to drive for MPG so I don't.

But my company doesn't seem to mind fuel costs, they had me drive 500 miles dead head on Friday because they aren't really set up properly to get loads on weekends and they have most of their drivers home every weekend unless they come across a big load.

paullud · Jun 20, 2011

mcavoy33 said:
I actually never tried the nozzle but I was told by the other driver that it wouldn't fit and I had to go to the front.

I should note that I have a heavy foot, I pretty much always drive 6-7 miles over the speed limit so I'm doing 76-77 mph most of the time. About half of my loads have been get there asap. I haven't been told to drive for MPG so I don't.

But my company doesn't seem to mind fuel costs, they had me drive 500 miles dead head on Friday because they aren't really set up properly to get loads on weekends and they have most of their drivers home every weekend unless they come across a big load.

I haven't seen fuel be cheaper in the truck lanes, it could be if you have a fuel card that gets you a discount but I wouldn't think it would change because of where you fuel at their facility. The nozzles do fit out back you just can't run them full bore.

A company that doesn't control it's expenses may not be a company for long in this economy.

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Turtle · Jun 20, 2011

I thought 07 and later Sprinters, the big nozzle wouldn't fit. Never seen a later model getting fuel out back, anyway.

"As a noob, to me, the final cost per mile is more important to me than the MPG because its factoring the cost of fuel."

As a non-noob, you will find out that you cannot control the price at the pump, but you can control the MPG at least to a point, and the MPG has a direct effect on the cost per mile. At 17.064 MPG and a fuel cost of is $3.799 per gallon, that's 22.26 cents per mile. At 19 MPG that same fuel is 19.99 cents a mile, a 2.27 cents per mile difference. Over the course of 1772 miles, that's $40.22. At 80,000 miles a year, that's $1816.00 give or take.

As with every vehicle, MPG drops the faster you go, but with a Sprinter the drop off above 60 MPH becomes dramatic. At 55-60 MPH, you should get at least 22 MPG in that Sprinter, especially if you are getting that kind of MPG at 76-77 MPH. It's probably more like 24 MPG. But at 22, that's 17.26 cents per mile, and over the same 1772 miles that's $88.60 (and $4,000 over 80,000 miles). At 65 MPH it'll drop to 20, and at above that it drops fast.

In this business, squeezing out an extra 1/2 MPG is a big deal, and you're just throwing away 4 or 5 MPG like it's nothing. Of course, you're not paying for the fuel, and they apparently don't care (or are ignorant about the kind of fuel mileage a Sprinter can get), so maybe it is nothing.

Usually any disparity between car diesel and the big truck diesel out back is either cash versus credit, or road tax exemption, which you'll have to pay at either pump unless you are exempt, which you are not.

Incidentally, if you are required to exceed the speed limit in order to deliver on time, then you are with the way wrong carrier. ASAP means within the parameters of "safe" and "legal", and if you are exceeding the speed limit, especially routinely, then you are doing neither.

Dakota · Jun 20, 2011

I think most dispatchers would expect a 45mph average. That is the rule of thumb. Of course that is with traffic and stops built in

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mcavoy33 · Jun 20, 2011

Turtle said:
"As a noob, to me, the final cost per mile is more important to me than the MPG because its factoring the cost of fuel."

As a non-noob, you will find out that you cannot control the price at the pump, but you can control the MPG at least to a point, and the MPG has a direct effect on the cost per mile. At 17.064 MPG and a fuel cost of is $3.799 per gallon, that's 22.26 cents per mile. At 19 MPG that same fuel is 19.99 cents a mile, a 2.27 cents per mile difference. Over the course of 1772 miles, that's $40.22. At 80,000 miles a year, that's $1816.00 give or take.

As with every vehicle, MPG drops the faster you go, but with a Sprinter the drop off above 60 MPH becomes dramatic. At 55-60 MPH, you should get at least 22 MPG in that Sprinter, especially if you are getting that kind of MPG at 76-77 MPH. It's probably more like 24 MPG. But at 22, that's 17.26 cents per mile, and over the same 1772 miles that's $88.60 (and $4,000 over 80,000 miles). At 65 MPH it'll drop to 20, and at above that it drops fast.

I understand that slowing down will save MPG. That is basic common sense.

What I was looking to get out of this thread was the difference in cost of diesels vs gas. Gas is obviously cheaper per gallon.

With the improvements in the gas engines and getting better MPG than 15 years ago, is it even worth it to get a diesel anymore?

The reason I ask, is I'm looking into purchasing. Whether I go gas or diesel will likely determine whether I go with a Ford HCV or a Sprinter. I don't want to buy something based on sticker price, then turn out having a higher operating cost down the road.

bobwg · Jun 20, 2011

paullud said:
I haven't seen fuel be cheaper in the truck lanes, it could be if you have a fuel card that gets you a discount but I wouldn't think it would change because of where you fuel at their facility. The nozzles do fit out back you just can't run them full bore.

A company that doesn't control it's expenses may not be a company for long in this economy.

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Yes I fuel out back because I have a Comdata card thru Landstar and do get some dicount fueling my Sprinter in back using the card and its easier to use the card reader on the pumps to run the Comdata card, that card does not work on the pumps out front

Jack_Berry · Jun 20, 2011

I've done some searches on mpg and what people are getting but I didn't come across anything comparing the cost per mile of gas vs diesel.......3.799/16mpg=$.2374.

the only way to save more s if your carrier has a fuel discount program at ta or pilot.

xiggi · Jun 20, 2011

mcavoy33 said:
I understand that slowing down will save MPG. That is basic common sense.

What I was looking to get out of this thread was the difference in cost of diesels vs gas. Gas is obviously cheaper per gallon.

With the improvements in the gas engines and getting better MPG than 15 years ago, is it even worth it to get a diesel anymore?

The reason I ask, is I'm looking into purchasing. Whether I go gas or diesel will likely determine whether I go with a Ford HCV or a Sprinter. I don't want to buy something based on sticker price, then turn out having a higher operating cost down the road.

A diesel is much more economical to idle which most of us here do more of because of the nights away from home. Gas engines also do not deal well with extended idle time. I would say as a general rule of thumb a diesel will often last longer than a gas engine. When you own your own vehicle and are paying for fuel you will slow down unless brainless. So to figure fuel costs on what you get now compared to what you get at a lower speed is probably the wrong thing to do. When you could easily be getting 19.5 or better in the same sprinter and also avoid the cost of tickets it does not make a lot of sense to speed. No freight is that important.

Turtle I drive an 07 and always fill up in back. The nozzle will fit in the first few inches of the fill neck but will not go past the reducer so you do need to hold it and I have to hand control the flow I cannot even use the lowest setting auto shut off because of the flow speed of the big pumps.

Rocketman · Jun 20, 2011

From what I've seen posted on here and also by having a 2011 Sprinter follow me on a trip from KCMO to Lexington, KY at 63-65mph... the newer Sprinters are going to be around the 20mpg mark or less. I see a lot are averaging in the 18-19 mpg range.

Given the extra purchase price of a Sprinter (or a diesel engine in any other van), the extra maintenance costs associated with a diesel (especially a Sprinter) and then last but not least, the price difference between gas and diesel I've decided that IMO 16mpg in a gas van will give you an operating cost equal to the operating cost of a new Sprinter at 19mpg.

That's the number I'm looking for in a gas van and I've seen evidence from LDB, Jack Berry, Moot and others on here that support 16mpg and more is possible in a gas van. The new gas vans with the 6 speed transmission are closing the gap even tighter.

I really like the Sprinters, I really, really like the mpg of the pre-07 Sprinters. The '07 and up Sprinters? I can't personally justify owning one compared to something that nearly any mechanic in the country has at least touched before.

mcavoy33 · Jun 20, 2011

Rocketman said:
Given the extra purchase price of a Sprinter (or a diesel engine in any other van), the extra maintenance costs associated with a diesel (especially a Sprinter) and then last but not least, the price difference between gas and diesel I've decided that IMO 16mpg in a gas van will give you an operating cost equal to the operating cost of a new Sprinter at 19mpg.

Thanks.

Can you share some of the math how you calculated the costs.

aka how would I factor in 6-8k less in capital costs to my operating costs on a per mile basis.

I guess, I would use an average maybe?

mcavoy33 · Jun 20, 2011

paullud said:
I haven't seen fuel be cheaper in the truck lanes, it could be if you have a fuel card that gets you a discount but I wouldn't think it would change because of where you fuel at their facility.

A company that doesn't control it's expenses may not be a company for long in this economy.

Not every Pilot or Love truck stop charge different but many do. I've pulled over at an exit and seen the auto diesel price $0.20 / gallon higher than the advertised diesel price.

The first time I seen that, even though it wasn't my money, I seen a Love TS down the road, so I went for a drive to check it out and their auto diesel price was only $0.10 more than the advertised price on the big sign. So I fueled up there.

But when I took the truck back to the shop on the weekend, when I filled up, I noticed the price on the pump was $0.30 / gal more.

As for your comment about the company not controlling expenses kind of baffles me as well. Today when I picked up the van, I asked if I should slow down and try to get a better MPG and they looked at me like I was crazy, dispatcher said is there anything wrong with what you are doing now? I said no, he said keep on driving and went back to his seat.

But in our warehouse, I see all of the owners toys, he's got a 30+ foot 5th wheel travel trailer, a new Mustang and another car under car cover that I have no clue what it is, a big suped up Chevy truck, his boat. He seems to be doing really well. He's been in business for 15 years and says he could use more vans.

He's paying me fairly so I can't complain. They treat me good.

Turtle · Jun 20, 2011

mcavoy33 said:
Not every Pilot or Love truck stop charge different but many do. I've pulled over at an exit and seen the auto diesel price $0.20 / gallon higher than the advertised diesel price.

Where are you seeing this? Because others aren't seeing it at all. It's actually illegal to advertise a different price than is at the pump. The only difference you will see involve CASH, CREDIT, or TAX EXEMPT.

paullud · Jun 20, 2011

Turtle said:
Where are you seeing this? Because others aren't seeing it at all. It's actually illegal to advertise a different price than is at the pump. The only difference you will see involve CASH, CREDIT, or TAX EXEMPT.

Maybe it is Indiana, they don't include all the tax in the advertised price but you end up paying the same in front or in the back.

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Moot · Jun 20, 2011

Come on Turtle, you know what Tom Waits says: "The large print giveth and the small print taketh away".

He's reading the price on the sign but missing the small print denoting "cash price". When he gets to the pump he sees the price is higher at the pump than what's stated on the sign.

Some Road Rangers are posting a lower price for gas on their signs and the small print states: "With Road Ranger Credit Card".

Jack_Berry · Jun 20, 2011

i've seen the "auto diesel" price signs also. might have been indiana. never went to the truck pumps to check if there was a difference, was in the gas truck not the tdi jetta so it was not a concern. gonna look next time,,,,and btw mac, whats the hurry? remember the ticket you get for speeding goes to you not dispatch. what company do you drive for?

LDB · Jun 20, 2011

Well, to be brutally blunt, any driver running several mph over the posted limit is doing a disservice to the fuel buyer. If that driver converts to an owner and continues to drive those speeds he does himself a disservice.

At 68mph over a 1450mi TX to NC load in my Chevrolet 3500 with 6.0L I got 17.4mpg but I drive as a business owner with a goal of maximizing income and minimizing expenses. If you drive with an I don't care lead foot it doesn't much matter what you drive.

Oh, with $3.299 gasoline an 18cpm fsc that put my actual cpm on one fillup at 0.96cpm, just under a penny a mile.

Oh again, yes I could have done even better at 62mph if I'd had more time in the load. I did however stay a little below the limit rather than "Officer I dare you to write me a ticket" over the limit.