Dakota
Veteran Expediter
If he was under the influence, wouldn't he lose his CDL permanatley? I am sure it would be very hard to get behind the wheel of any vehicle if you killed another person.
Amish Girl Killed In Buggy/Truck Accident
- Thread starter dieseldiva
- Start date
If he was under the influence, wouldn't he lose his CDL permanatley? I am sure it would be very hard to get behind the wheel of any vehicle if you killed another person.
moose
Veteran Expediter
I don't know about that. Every time one of their trucks passes me, i'm kinda hopping it'll stop and a Cinderella will jump out of the Pumpkins .i have a shoe ready just incase.
Dakota
Veteran Expediter
She is a night dispatcher.
Dakota
Veteran Expediter
Someone will probably get offended because we are talking about Pumpkins and Cinderella in a serious thread
let alone taxes and hooves
We should return to the original. I should know better.
Amish Buggy Accidents (statistics, causes, number of accidents, etc.)
Buggy Accidents - Mission to Amish People (pictures, news blurbs)
Buggy Accidents - Mission to Amish People (pictures, news blurbs)
Education of drivers, both horse and engine driven, would help, but only to a point. Education will not solve the root problems. Over crowded roads, Vehicles that are too large for the roads that they are on. Speed limits are often higher on some roads than what they were designed for.
These are well known problems. Nothing is being done. You will not see a ban on semi's with 53' trailers on roads that were built for 40' trailers. You will not see larger roads built. In many case, in rural Amish country the roads are already as wide as they can be. Often, like in the mountain regions of PA the roads are twisting and turning with many blind areas. Those roads will not be improved either.
The Amish already know that buggies and cars don't mix. They are reluctant to change. Many have, there are "fancy Amish" who own cars. They still hold their core beliefs.
There is no easy answer.
These are well known problems. Nothing is being done. You will not see a ban on semi's with 53' trailers on roads that were built for 40' trailers. You will not see larger roads built. In many case, in rural Amish country the roads are already as wide as they can be. Often, like in the mountain regions of PA the roads are twisting and turning with many blind areas. Those roads will not be improved either.
The Amish already know that buggies and cars don't mix. They are reluctant to change. Many have, there are "fancy Amish" who own cars. They still hold their core beliefs.
There is no easy answer.
greg334
Veteran Expediter
My point is not to educate the people in the buggies or on horse back because out of the millions of vehicles that are on the road, they make up less than .001%. It is the truck driver who we should hold to a better standard than a 14 year old student driver. It is educating them that matters. I said in another thread about Mexican trucks that we face bigger issues than those Mexican drivers - our own drivers and this proves it. I can't imagine a pumpkin driver who is in a hurry being safe and I see it a lot. I drive on two lane roads every week along with buggies and horse back riders on the same road, I take my time, not get mad that they are there and most of all I am concern with their safety as much as mine. I see many are in such a hurry that they have to pass them so close that it looks like they are a bit angry they are there to begin with. I've also seen people not realize they are there until it is almost too late.
Well if it is a well known problem wouldn't it make sense to be sort of aware of your surroundings and slow down?
Nothings being done because everyone screams about rights. So how about the right of a victim of a traffic accident because the idiot behind the wheel can't drive regardless?
AND?
So I assume you are blaming the Amish for ignoring any rules of safety on the road. It sure looks like you are asking them to change their ways which are not the problem at the same time justifying the truck driver (any of them) to drive in an unprofessional manner. They, the Amish are not stupid because they know the cause and effect of their actions but how many truck drivers know what their actions can cause?
Yes there is, it is so easy - tighten up on the licensing process with more education, more training with more qualified training programs that actually weed out drivers before their road test.
Oh what a concept, not allowing everyone behind a wheel of a truck that weighs 80,000 lbs.
Doggie Daddy
Veteran Expediter
I am thinking that you are assuming way too much, nowhere in the article does it say that the driver was headed to the Walmart distribution center.
And come on, how can you say with absolute certainty what the road conditions were? "This is flat ground or slightly hilly" makes no sense whatsoever.
All I was trying to show is that it is NOT as simple as everyone wants to make out to be. That there are REAL problems that span years and different groups of people. The problems are caused by everyone private citizens and government alike and it is going to take years to fix it.
It is as if your in your contrary mood again. Believe it or not it is possible for more than one group to be both right and wrong at the same time. This is one of those times. The Amish AND the general driving public share both the blame and both hold the answers.
Tennesseahawk
Veteran Expediter
What do you propose, Greg? A day's lecture on sharing the road with our Amish friends? Better watch it. PETA will want a three week course on How to avoid hitting Bambi, by wrapping your truck around a tree. Then Greenpeace will object by saying you should run it into oncoming traffic instead, saving the tree.
It's tragic. But no amount of classroom lectures, experts, etc., will negate what has become common in a lot of drivers of all types of vehicles... impatience and aggressiveness.
I hate to say it, but you sound like our nanny government. Wait for a huge accident, and suggest a bandaid as remedy.
It's tragic. But no amount of classroom lectures, experts, etc., will negate what has become common in a lot of drivers of all types of vehicles... impatience and aggressiveness.
I hate to say it, but you sound like our nanny government. Wait for a huge accident, and suggest a bandaid as remedy.
greg334
Veteran Expediter
Hate to say (not really) this but I guess my standards and expectations seem to be a bit better than those who just try to justify the accident by blaming everyone BUT the driver.
Some realistic training for those behind the wheel is needed, not just "this is a tire, this is how you turn and this is where you stop for a rail road track".
Even though you are partially right that no amount of training will eliminate the aggressive driver, it becomes a point where they become more identifiable and gotten off the road while those who are starting to form bad habits because no one cares will be given a chance to change.
It is the same issue I have with the CSA, although it could be a good program, it is reactive without the other components needed to be a progressive positive program.
Some realistic training for those behind the wheel is needed, not just "this is a tire, this is how you turn and this is where you stop for a rail road track".
Even though you are partially right that no amount of training will eliminate the aggressive driver, it becomes a point where they become more identifiable and gotten off the road while those who are starting to form bad habits because no one cares will be given a chance to change.
It is the same issue I have with the CSA, although it could be a good program, it is reactive without the other components needed to be a progressive positive program.
Hawk: remember when 4 wheelers didn't know to stay out of the empty right lane when a t/t was waiting in the left lane to make a right turn, and a lot of them got crunched?
They've been educated now, and that's what I'm talking about: pointing out what drivers don't know about the other vehicles' needs.
Sure, some will ignore it, but those who just aren't aware can be shown what can happen when a bigger vehicle collides with a smaller one, and how to avoid it.
Like distracted driving, it should be a message people get, repeatedly, until they internalize it.
They've been educated now, and that's what I'm talking about: pointing out what drivers don't know about the other vehicles' needs.
Sure, some will ignore it, but those who just aren't aware can be shown what can happen when a bigger vehicle collides with a smaller one, and how to avoid it.
Like distracted driving, it should be a message people get, repeatedly, until they internalize it.
dieseldiva
Veteran Expediter
Well I hate to say this (not really) but you're beginning to act more and more like some elitist liberal.....your "standards and expectations" are better than some here?? Really?? I guess the rest of us dumb arse truckers have a lot to learn from you, don't we now.......
Layout calls it "contrary", maybe he has more patience than I.
All the education in the world will not fix the problem of a 53' trailer NOT being able to get around a curve that is too tight. That it gets forced into the oncoming lane. LOTS of those up in parts of PA around the cabin. The ONLY solution is to restrict trucks that are longer than the roads were designed for. That WILL NOT HAPPEN.
Saying "educate" is VERY simplistic.
The State and county know quite well that today's rigs cannot safely drive on those roads. Those are the very roads where Amish buggies are present in LARGE numbers. On Sunday's they out number cars by a wide margin.
When a trailer is running in the oncoming lane it is a REAL problem.
I have even been on roads where my straight truck could NOT go around a curve because the roads were too narrow and turn too tight. Once in PA and in California.
Saying "educate" is VERY simplistic.
The State and county know quite well that today's rigs cannot safely drive on those roads. Those are the very roads where Amish buggies are present in LARGE numbers. On Sunday's they out number cars by a wide margin.
When a trailer is running in the oncoming lane it is a REAL problem.
I have even been on roads where my straight truck could NOT go around a curve because the roads were too narrow and turn too tight. Once in PA and in California.
greg334
Veteran Expediter
The simplest things are sometimes the best thing to do. BUT it seems a few of you will justify what happen with excuses of other issues that have nothing to do with the basic and simple skill of watching the road ahead of the truck and slowing down then things are in your path.
IT ISN'T about driving a tractor with a wide load down a road that is 7 feet wide while trying to make a hairpin turn but it is about how to handle one's self when everyday things get boring and people get complacent in their driving skills.
It isn't about the buggy that has the 3 year old in the passenger seat tolling down the road at a great relative speed but how a truck should actually pass them without killing them or someone else in the process.
It isn't about to just stop the truck at a light but how to judge what's going on in front of you to know enough that just maybe you need to slow down a bit when you see something ahead YOU don't recognize and prepare for something that id not normal.
I watch a lot of what's going on around me and know that many of these drivers, especially these cookie cutter company drivers who you all seem to want to defend want to hurry up or don't give a crap what is safe and what isn't.
BUT with that said, education will do one important thing - it will make the person know he or she isn't a frickn' commodity to be used to make the company a buck. THIS alone is the biggest problem we have when accidents happen, they seem to be in a BIG hurry because their dispatcher or company rep is pushing them. The company does not care about how they train the people just how they will capture the revenue in the long run. Educate the driver what the company can or can't do and how he or she is in control of the truck - it would be better for all of us.
IT ISN'T about driving a tractor with a wide load down a road that is 7 feet wide while trying to make a hairpin turn but it is about how to handle one's self when everyday things get boring and people get complacent in their driving skills.
It isn't about the buggy that has the 3 year old in the passenger seat tolling down the road at a great relative speed but how a truck should actually pass them without killing them or someone else in the process.
It isn't about to just stop the truck at a light but how to judge what's going on in front of you to know enough that just maybe you need to slow down a bit when you see something ahead YOU don't recognize and prepare for something that id not normal.
I watch a lot of what's going on around me and know that many of these drivers, especially these cookie cutter company drivers who you all seem to want to defend want to hurry up or don't give a crap what is safe and what isn't.
BUT with that said, education will do one important thing - it will make the person know he or she isn't a frickn' commodity to be used to make the company a buck. THIS alone is the biggest problem we have when accidents happen, they seem to be in a BIG hurry because their dispatcher or company rep is pushing them. The company does not care about how they train the people just how they will capture the revenue in the long run. Educate the driver what the company can or can't do and how he or she is in control of the truck - it would be better for all of us.
I'm not sure you can teach people to pay attention. Which I think will be the main reason of this accident. It happens almost daily with some admitting it. Others denying it.
Around St Louis in the last two years there have been a car load of people losing their life to big rigs & in a case last year school busses. Last year a women driving a school bus in a construction zone ran over a car. The women in the following bus ran into the first, pushing it onto and crushing the car and driver which were stopped for the construction.
Also out by Six flags traffic was stopped, a van with Amish being driven home from a funeral in Kentucky was run over by a big rig killing 3-5 persons inside it. The drive said he was reaching for his cell phone and didn't know traffic had stopped.
How do you teach watch the road.
Around St Louis in the last two years there have been a car load of people losing their life to big rigs & in a case last year school busses. Last year a women driving a school bus in a construction zone ran over a car. The women in the following bus ran into the first, pushing it onto and crushing the car and driver which were stopped for the construction.
Also out by Six flags traffic was stopped, a van with Amish being driven home from a funeral in Kentucky was run over by a big rig killing 3-5 persons inside it. The drive said he was reaching for his cell phone and didn't know traffic had stopped.
How do you teach watch the road.