American Trucking Associations pushed HOS regs on

[Tennesseahawk]

RE: American Trucking Associations pushed HOS regs

Chuckwagon wrote:

>If you want the same as the guy at Burger King - then go
>work at Burger King!

Try reading my post, instead of putting words in my mouth. I want the pay increase with inflation increase... the same as the guy at Burger King. I didn't say I wanted to flip burgers, smart guy.

>If you want to improve your situation in this industry -
>then get out of the same ole' but do nothing about it
>attitude some many of the 'old time veterans' have on this
>site.

You've been here since 9-6-06 and you think you know everything that goes on? Damm you're good!

>Listen, I agree the ATA and the feds shake hands everyday,
>and one of the missions of the ATA is to line the pockets of
>their membership companies. While we might not like what the
>ATA does, if the OOIDA was able to do the same for us
>expeditors, we wouldn't be sitting around bitching about it
>though.

So which bandwagon are you on now? Join OOIDA or back to the Start a Union speech? It's getting a little old.

>Sure we want a fair shake - but we have been sitting here in
>this expediting world we live in for many years stuck in the
>same mindset that nothing will change, we're always going to
>get screwed, everyone is out to put us out of business, etc.

The expediting world is a small part of the trucking world. In order to get what changes we want, things have to change in trucking. Good luck with that!

>Now, we can either continue this long standing tradition of
>ignorance or we can take a new approach and build our own
>organization - our own force - to address OUR needs and
>concerns. Or we can just sit back and await our slow and
>painful death of our own segment of the trucking industry,
>allowing the ATA to force us out of the business in the
>political bullsh** methods they use.

The ATA isn't worried about expediting as much as they are O/O carriers (other than their own). I believe O/O otr and ltl carriers are expediting's closest allies. They have to be on board of any changes we want to make.

>And Hawk, if you want to block a highway, a ramp, a loading
>dock, or whatever, to prove that the expediting driver needs
>to be heard, that we are a vital segment of working America
>- let me know and we can 'organize' one hell of a showing!

Again... I'm not worried about expediting. Take care of trucking in general, and expediting will fall in line soon afterwards. There's plenty of talk about this or that to get things to change, but you can't get truckers to agree. Even if you did, their $2000/mo truck payments demands they get out and run... regardless of what the long term effect of a short term sitdown may cause. Sorry... but some of these truckers are dumb as dirt. They'll want nothing more than to take advantage of a trucking slowdown and let everyone else do the dirty work to fix the trucking situation.

Chuck... your heart may be in the right place, but you need to do some research before you spout out solutions. You're all over the place on this matter.

"If I claim to be a wise man, it surely means that I don't know." - Kansas

 

[Crazynuff]

RE: American Trucking Associations pushed HOS regs

>from what ive read,the canadians voted against the black
>boxes,as they felt would cause many traffic jams,1 truck
>trying to pass another,doing 1 mph faster than the one he
>was passing
I know Ontario passed a provincial law requiring speed limiters on trucks be set at 100 kpm .

 

[Broompilot]

RE: American Trucking Associations pushed HOS regs

Go ahead let this pass, than we can all cough up hundreds if not a couple thousand dollars to install. Oh sure we can get a tax deduction but probably no tax credit, are we gona demand more $ for the runs to compensate us?

It all comes back to our pocket books, while the rich can put their kids thur college we will have to borrow even further into debt or retire on less etc...

But the real issue taking place will be like others stated LARGER TRAILERS, or MORE TRUCKS which is more of threat to saftey?

 

[davekc]

RE: American Trucking Associations pushed HOS regs

The black boxes will of course lead to computer logs. In any instance that your current paper logs are out of synch with the black box, it would raise a flag. Welcome the paperless logs as I believe they are coming. Mandatory speed limiters I believe will be part of this as well. Last I heard on the limiters is 68 mph. ATA and the large truckload carriers are really pushing for this.
Might be the trade off for a change on the HOS?







Davekc
owner
22 years
PantherII
EO moderator

 

[chuckwagon]

RE: American Trucking Associations pushed HOS regs

Hawk -

Once again, you are wrong, I do not have the all the answers, or if I did I would be the head of the Teamsters or another powerful organization. (Gee, we could only all hope)

But, what I am saying is, we must stop this same every day, year after year, stand around and spout off about everything and then turn around and do nothing attitude.

(Of course then as you have said, we are just a bunch of stupid truck drivers.)

It makes me sick to my stomach to think you can look your fellow truckers in the face and call them stupid and then consider them your industry commrades.

My fellow truckers are not stupid, they are hard dedicated people, worried about how they will pay their bills and feed their families. They search to scratch out a living with carriers who screw them over and could care less about the safety, health and prosperity.

I see my fellow truckers looking for change in an industry that is unwilling to change where they to can make a decent living. I see my fellow truckers as people who want to move away from the crusted patterns of failures previous generations have embedded into their industry. I see my fellow trucker as business people who seek change, but hesitate, because change represents challenge, fear, uncertain results.

Your fellow truckers must be just like you - to blind to see there are two sides to the coin, two sides to the highway, and two ways to get results. The old way - which wow that is working out nicely for us all now isn't it? And the new way - which gives us hope and a new direction for the years ahead.

You asked am I OOIDA or union - and all I will say is what has the OOIDA done for me - what have they done for MY fellow truckers lately?

Nothing!

I never see them here - on one of the biggest trucker forums on the internet to discuss issues with us.
Where are they?

Would the union be here - you're ##### right they would be here.

We both have agreed that the expedite segment is just a small segmet of the trucking industry.

And you said what ever comes around for the trucking industry will sooner or later come around to the expedite segmet.

I disagree. While the larger trucking company drivers are mostly union with the high paying spots - the veterans and ill informed in the expedite community push the unions away like the plague.

That is why - we are on are own.

 

[RichM]

RE: American Trucking Associations pushed HOS regs

Chuck time for some honest answers. How long have you been driving a truck. Are you a truck owner or do you drive for a fleet owner?
You have been a member of EO for about 3 months and most of your posts are putting all of us down because we are not organized into some type of organization that will ( your words) fight for us. What are you fighting for? Many of us have been in this business more then 3 months and have made a very decent living from it without anyone telling us we must conform to Chucks rules. Get real, T Hawk has been in this business a long time. When you have paid your dues and have some real time experience then come back and critcize
members.

 

[davekc]

RE: American Trucking Associations pushed HOS regs

Once time is spent in the business as Rich mentions, one will figure out that it is a supply and demand business. When demand gets ahead of the supply, the rates will go up. If it doesn't, then you are where we are at today.
Simple as that.
A union will do little to address that. A union will breed competition that will in turn bring lower rates. Just look at the auto industry. The US just about priced themselves out of the market by foreign competitors. Same issue with trucking.

As for large carriers, not all are union. JB, Schnieder, Swift, Werner, you get the picture.








Davekc
owner
22 years
PantherII
EO moderator

 

[chuckwagon]

RE: American Trucking Associations pushed HOS regs

To Rich M and davekc -

It does not suprise me at all, everytime I have not agreed with you, the old time veterans, you come on here and DEMAND answers about my background.
"How long have you been driving, are you a truck owner, do you just drive for some fleet owner, etc, etc."
I will say I have over 15-years of BUSINESS EXPERIENCE, and we all know we are business owners first and DRIVERS SECOND.
You claim that I am putting all the members down for not being organized into some type of organization that will fight for us. That is nothing more than a constructive comment while one of your own veteran members THawk calls fellow drivers 'just stupid drivers.' So do not sit here and say I am the one insulting the membership.
You state I have no right to criticize members because I do not have the experience that you have. If this experience is so important, vital and critical - why is it that it is the veterans of this industry who are leaving the business at record numbers and it is the newer breed that is trying to revive it?
Yes this business, like most is about supply and demand, however, when demand gets ahead of the supply, this does not automatically result in an increase in rates.
Thus, we must protect ourselfs against stagnet rates, work to increase other aspects of our compensation and work to improve the overall work enviroment.
You claim a union will do little to address our problems, yet, my question to you self-proclaimed experts is - what have you done to correct the industry problems?
Having experience in years does not make you more of an expert than someone else with less. Having experience in years does not make you smarter and give you better ideals - we can all provide ideals, thoughts and comments - I wish you could understand that even people with less experience could - that is could - have a little bit better of a game plan than what you do.
And for union carriers - UPS, FedEx, Yellow/Roadway/USF just to name a few!
None of us are any smarter than the rest!
DEAL WITH IT - THE NEW BREED IS HERE TO STAY!
(so go ahead and censor my post - again!)

 

[highway star]

RE: American Trucking Associations pushed HOS regs

You seem to enjoy changing the context of some of the things Thawk has said to you. He was clearly not making a blanket statement about drivers when he commented on some of them being dumb. Some of them are. This is true in any business or walk of life. If you haven't yet met any of them it's because you haven't been trucking long.

From time to time, we've seen people who view themselves as experts after only a few months in the business. These types are nothing more than the punch line to a mediocre joke. You seem offended that someone would want to know more about you. Have you no concept of what credibility is? Your experience is what determines the amount of credibility you have.

Lastly, you have gotten virtually zero support. I'm not sure what you see that will change that.

 

[davekc]

RE: American Trucking Associations pushed HOS regs

Chuckwagon

I think this topic was addressed several times and I see little that would change most peoples opinions over the last several weeks.
With regards to your background, I'm not sure I ever asked?
Whether your a seasoned veteran or someone new, my opinion with regards to unionizing expedite companies would still be the same.
The dynamics of the industry doesn't make it a viable solution for the problems or issues you are trying to address.
If you are seeking the union company structures, that is where you should be seeking employment.
You have provided your own sources to start with.








Davekc
owner
22 years
PantherII
EO moderator

 

[Tennesseahawk]

RE: American Trucking Associations pushed HOS regs

I don't care if you criticize me, but have some substance to back it up. Again, you put words in my mouth. I wasn't singling out any individual, I was saying that truckers, AS A COLLECTIVE, are stupid. Let me try to explain what I meant in a different way. Every company is set up like a government. Most are dictatorships, some are socialistic. The ATA is set up like an oligarchy. They have several heads of companies voting and calling the shots for their collective. Our collective of o/o companies, in expediting as well as other branches of trucking are an anarchy. That means we don't have our heads on straight, as far as communicating and getting done what we want. We have no set structure. In other words, we are stupid and disorganised and are only looking out for ourselves. Some of us want things to change, but it's near impossible to get others motivated to act. Therefore, a lot of us put our voices in with OOIDA.

A union would be fine to mediate and negotiate and lobby. But personally, I won't be micromanaged. It's not what this industry needs. We already have qualcomm and the feds for that.

Experience is a good thing in this business. Not only for knowing where to park, or which loads to turn down; experience gives us a more realistic view of why things are the way they are. It also gives us a more knowledgable prediction of what's to come so we can try to prepare for it. I'm not claiming to be all-knowing; but I know truckers are all talk, for the most part. We're more interested in making money than making a difference. And with rates this low, I'd think you'd agree. There will be no two week shut down of America because truckers, AS A COLLECTIVE, are too stupid to donate some of their time to make it better for everyone. Part of doing something is knowing what to do to motivate truckers across the country. Apparently, everyone is ignorant as to a solution, as it's NEVER HAPPENED.

"If I claim to be a wise man, it surely means that I don't know." - Kansas

 

[wallytrucker1]

RE: American Trucking Associations pushed HOS regs

Another possible union company to drive for would be "CF". Oh wait ,never mind.....

 

[chuckwagon]

RE: American Trucking Associations pushed HOS regs

THawk -

Let me take this time to say, I have respect for you, not just as a trucker, but as what seems to be a good moral person. Afterall, you were the one that tipped me off to a company that would rip me off and never pay me, you warned me of this guy and you had the decency to do it in private emails to me, not to plaster the scum all over this site and give him some free exposure.

I do not mean to offend anyone on this site and it seems to me that maybe I have and I would like to say I am sorry to anyone I have offended or for that matter showed disrespect towards.

I do believe though you guys tend to over-sell the importance of experience in this business as being the key factor in success in this field.

I believe, based upon years of experience in private investigations and law enforcement, it is not experience that is the key factor in success in any field but the knowledge you obtain prior to any experience and the knowledge you obtain along the way.

Along with this acquired knowledge another key factor to success is the drive of positive action which leds to the success. Take a look around this site and we see plenty of negative action and comments which is leading to nothing but discontent, unhappiness in our work, complaints about our companies/dispatchers, etc.

If you want to believe that it is experience that is the key main factor - so be it, that is your choice. I am simply saying that I believe you are wrong.

And as far as the union goes - I do believe they could play a positive role in our segment of the industry - that is just my belief and yes very few here agree with that and that is fine.

 

[RichM]

RE: American Trucking Associations pushed HOS regs

Actualy as highway Star pointed out nobody agrees with you. You claim to have 15 years business experience,so what. I could have 15 years experience as a NFL player or an Astronaut, or a Neuro Surgeon but that doesn't mean I know trucking and expediting. What it means is that I am new and don't know squat.
Read up on the word independent,your scenario would eliminate that word from an individuals contract and lifestyle because we would all have to get in line and follow the so called Union rules that were negotiated on our behalf. Do you actually think Companies would agree to a collective bargining assocation that you start. They would tell you to go away and pound sand and you would never get the members required to force a election.

 

[fastrod]

RE: American Trucking Associations pushed HOS regs

Independent free from the influence or control of others. Not depending on another, esp. for financial support. Not connected with others; separate. Now you all have to get in line and follow your carriers rules.

 

[chuckwagon]

RE: American Trucking Associations pushed HOS regs

Ok!

I am done wasting my time with you idiots!

I was unaware the only people with any thoughts that matter were people with experience in this business.

My 15-years of business experience mean nothing?
WOW - that is funny enough which really tells me that THawk must be right - truckers are stupid!

So I will now focus on one thing only - ME!
Only one thought counts to me from here on in - MINE!

THE VETERANS WITH ALL THE KNOWLEDGE WIN - ALL THE EXPERIENCE WIN - I AM DONE POSTING AND WASTING MY TIME ON THIS SITE!

YOU HAVE ALL THE ANSWERS - FINE!
GOOD LUCK IN YOUR CONTINUE BITCHING AND MOANING SESSIONS!

 

[RichM]

RE: American Trucking Associations pushed HOS regs

There is an old Irish Proverb,don't let the door hit you in your --- on the way out. I guess I and many others are all members of the Idiots Association. Could be worse.

 

[davekc]

RE: American Trucking Associations pushed HOS regs

I do believe though you guys tend to over-sell the importance of experience in this business as being the key factor in success in this field.

I believe, based upon years of experience in private investigations and law enforcement, it is not experience that is the key factor in success in any field but the knowledge you obtain prior to any experience and the knowledge you obtain along the way.
======================================================
I don't recall ayone saying experience is the KEY factor for success. It is one of many things. If as you say, "the knowledge you obtain along the way" .........that is experience that you yourself refer to.
It is the same reason insurance and finance companies look at experience in transportation. Statistically the experienced are much less risk. It doesn't mean there isn't an exception.
Pretty much the same reason a pilot has to fly so many hours to qualify, or a doctor has to have so many clinical hours prior to performing proceedures. It doesn't mean the inexperienced can't do the tasks, it is a matter of percentages of getting it done correctly.
I feel like I have typed this before? Ummm????











Davekc
owner
22 years
PantherII
EO moderator

 

[Turtle]

RE: American Trucking Associations pushed HOS regs

It should be noted that people with 15 years of trucking experience are usually clueless about the expedite trucking industry niche. It should come as no surprise when people scoff at 15 years of business experience, whatever that business might be, when someone tries to apply that to something as unique as expediting and think they know it all on Day One (or even Day Ninety). In the expediting segment of trucking, there is no substitute for actual expediting experience, regardless of how badly one wishes or believes otherwise.

This strikes me as one who knows not, and knows not that he knows not. Ignorance is bliss. Truly.

Incidentally, I looooved the "I See My Fellow Truckers" speech. I played the Battle Hymn of the Republic in the background as I read it. It gave me chills. Made the "I Have a Dream" speech pale in comparison.

I see my fellow truckers walking hand in hand, being judged not by the content of their character nor of the color of their skin, but by the fact that they're holding hands with another trucker.

His truth is marching on...
Glory, Glory, Hallelujah!

 

[cheri1122]

RE: American Trucking Associations pushed HOS regs

I like your dream, Turtle - we female truckers would be in big demand, lol.
Since many of us are not exactly spring chickens, it would probably be a half fast march, though