Will You Miss The Bush Tax Cuts???

bobwg

Expert Expediter
Me run for office NO WAY lets see just because I disagree with Obama policies so that makes me a racist, I think marriage is for man and a woman that makes me a bigot, I belive in a military that is the best and strongest in the world that makes me a extreme hawk, I belive in low taxes for everyone even the rich that means I hate the poor, we should enforce current laws including immigration oops racist again oh well round up all illegals white, black, asian , what ever color, religion, or country they are from and send them home if they are here illegally oops got off topic
 

witness23

Veteran Expediter
DieselDiva's link at the begining of the thread is a great place to get the facts. Don't rely on the news media, politicians, radio talk show hosts, pundits, tell you what you want to hear. Do some research on your own.
 

greg334

Veteran Expediter
OVM,
The IRS doesn't write the tax code, the congress does and that is where the problem is.
 

dieseldiva

Veteran Expediter
In answer to the "Truth-O-Meter".....

Fact-checking the Fact-checkers on the $3.8 Trillion Obama Tax Hike
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Today at 11:02am

Yesterday, PolitiFact.com fact-checked my statement about the coming $3.8 trillion Obama tax hike – the largest tax increase in history. They did such a bad job of it, however, that I feel compelled to fact-check the fact-checkers.

First of all, they claim that there are Democrat proposals which would “keep the tax cuts for individuals who make less than $200,000 and couples who make less than $250,000.”

Unfortunately for PolitiFact, no such proposal exists. They admit as much, by the way, when they state that “There are no formal congressional proposals yet to keep the Bush tax cuts in place, so we don’t have precise estimates from official sources like the nonpartisan Congressional Budget Office.” That doesn’t stop them, though, from claiming I “confuse the issue” by “using numbers that assume all the tax cuts are going away. That is not the Democratic plan nor is it President Obama’s plan.”

Plan? What plan? There is no plan. All we have is smoke and mirrors based on an old Obama campaign pledge that if elected, he would exempt families making less than $250,000 a year from “any form of tax increases.” But this pledge was already watered down before he was even elected. First vice-presidential candidate Joe Biden lowered it to $150,000. Then campaign surrogate Gov. Bill Richardson lowered it even further to $120,000.

A few months after the inauguration, even that last promise disappeared in a puff of smoke. When asked to reaffirm the White House’s commitment to the campaign promise of no tax increases for families earning less than $250,000, Obama’s spin doctor David Axelrod declared the President had “no interest in drawing lines in the sand.”

The truth is that as of today, Democrats haven’t taken any action to extend any part of the 2001 and 2003 tax cuts for any income group – and in this case doing nothing equals hitting American taxpayers with a massive $3.8 trillion tax increase.

What we do know for certain is that the White House is more than willing to raise taxes on families with incomes of less than $250,000. Democrat Senator Max Baucus admitted as much during the debate about Obamacare when he stated that “One other point that I think it’s very important to make is that it is true that in certain cases, the taxes will go up for some Americans who might be making less than $200,000.”

PolitiFact doesn’t dispute the $3.8 trillion estimate of the cost of repeal of the 2001 and 2003 tax cuts. It admits that “Palin’s estimate of $3.8 trillion over 10 years is within a reasonable range, if you’re talking about all taxpayers.” And yet somehow it continues to argue that I’m wrong, based on a proposal it admits doesn’t exist which in turn is based on a phantom campaign pledge which Democrats have already broken anyway. I call that a “Pants on Fire” statement.

To prevent PolitiFact from making similar mistakes in future, it would be helpful if the White House and the Democratic Congressional leadership finally mustered the courage to table their plans to let the 2001 and 2003 tax cuts expire. Mr. President, publish your proposals, and we’ll duke it out. You can argue in favor of a multi-trillion dollar tax hike in an age of economic uncertainty and mass unemployment, and we’ll argue for fiscal sanity combined with serious spending cuts. I for one look forward to such a debate.

In the meantime I suggest the St. Petersburg Times hires a few extra staff to fact-check its fact-checkers. It might help it prevent being caught with its “pants on fire” again in the future.

- Sarah Palin
 

bobwg

Expert Expediter
Yes where is this tax plan the Dems claim to have to just let the rich tax cuts expire anyone see any thing in writing? official government papers saying they only plan to let the rich part of the Bush cuts expire?
 

witness23

Veteran Expediter
If Congress doesn't propose anything and let the tax cuts expire I will be the first to say you were right.

These are "proposals" brought up by the Democrats and they have yet put pen to paper to make the changes that they "propose". You are right if they do not follow through with their proposals the things Palin and Neugebauer bring up are true but we have to wait and see. It still doesn't excuse Palin and others that are distorting the facts. If they want to argue that the Democrats haven't acted on the proposals that's a different story.

From the Palin story on Politifact:
But that's not what Democrats are proposing; they want to leave tax rates untouched for people who make less. We've looked for a Democrat who supports letting all the Bush tax cuts expire, and we haven't been able to find one. (And in fact, the most notable person we've found who advocates letting them all expire is Alan Greenspan, the head of the Federal Reserve from 1987 to 2006. He said it would help bring down the deficit.) In fact, a handful of Democrats in Congress have supported keeping tax rates for the wealthy lower, too.
 

dieseldiva

Veteran Expediter
hmmm...after all deductions my tax because of expenses my AGI or taxable income is almost nil....I would imagine any other business would do the same thing....now the gross BEFORE expenses is a different ballgame...

This is part of the problem as I see it, Ken. I can't find anything that says this 250K figure is after deductions..taxable income. If you listen to what he (prez) has said, it's always "if you make"...nothing about taxable income or any other phrase that would mean the same, i.e. net income, etc. It's not really something that is debatable right now as the dems have nothing in writing. Guess it's like everything else, we have to wait til after they pass it to see what's in it! (Pelousy on the healthcare bill)
 

dieseldiva

Veteran Expediter
If Congress doesn't propose anything and let the tax cuts expire I will be the first to say you were right.

These are "proposals" brought up by the Democrats and they have yet put pen to paper to make the changes that they "propose". You are right if they do not follow through with their proposals the things Palin and Neugebauer bring up are true but we have to wait and see. It still doesn't excuse Palin and others that are distorting the facts. If they want to argue that the Democrats haven't acted on the proposals that's a different story.

From the Palin story on Politifact:

Not trying to be right or wrong, just throwing this stuff out there for discussion, as you can tell from my posts. There's lots of confusion, lots of stories out there, just depends on who you trust to give it to you straight as to what you're going to believe.

Last I heard there were something like 4 dems that were speaking out in favor of not letting all of these tax cuts expire but to date, no proposals.
 

bobwg

Expert Expediter
Yes Witness the Dems will wait til the last minute if they do anything at all and say here is our plan sorry no time for the public, the press, or all of the members of Congress to read it
 

greg334

Veteran Expediter
Well it is amazing. We sit here and know that most of the small and medium businesses are holding off on purchases, hiring and even selling in some cases because of the ambiguity of the tax question all the while our congress is hard at work pushing a jobs bill through to help public sector jobs that in a few cases are not needed. Makes you wonder if we will see anything of a proposed extension before we sink further.
 

dieseldiva

Veteran Expediter
Yes Witness the Dems will wait til the last minute if they do anything at all and say here is our plan sorry no time for the public, the press, or all of the members of Congress to read it

Maybe they'll wait for the recommendations of the Task Force.. Deadline of Dec. 4 and many people believe this is when the VAT tax will come into play.
 

witness23

Veteran Expediter
In answer to the "Truth-O-Meter".....

Why didn't she say that in the interview? If she wants to call out the Democrats for not having a "plan" for the expiring tax cuts, then call them to the carpet on that issue.

The question was not, "do the Democrats have a plan"? Wallace asked the specific question about the "top 2% of all households" letting those expire and she went into her talking points about the highest tax hike in history (which it isn't). That's why she didn't give an answer to his question, she didn't want to answer the question she just wanted to get out the talking points about this issue to scare conservatives and Palin fans......
Its like all you hear is Obama + Taxes + Liberal Zing +Spend......
ahhhhhhh.....dang Socialist Obama......ahhhhhh

And the whole writing notes on the hand thing....what is that all about? Reading notes from hand = good, reading notes from teleprompter = bad.
 

witness23

Veteran Expediter
This just in: PolitiFact | Sarah Palin said Democrats have no plan to extend some of the Bush tax cuts.

I highly suggest reading the whole article but I am including Politifacts conclusion here.

But Palin was distorting the facts when she said, "All we have is smoke and mirrors based on an old Obama campaign pledge." There is much more than that in the public record from both President Obama and Democrats in Congress. Frankly, we anticipated criticism when we published our report on Palin, but we were not anticipating the criticism that the Democrats are hiding their intentions on tax rates for people of lower incomes, or the claim that Obama has not published fairly detailed outlines of what he intends for the tax code. There is a plan, and you can see it on pages 39 and 164-165 of the budget. We rate Palin's statement False.
 

layoutshooter

Veteran Expediter
Retired Expediter
It matters NOT what Palin says. Taxes need to be cut drastically, across the board. Spending needs to be cut MORE than taxes. Cut spending by AT LEAST 30%, real numbers. Get rid of entire programs. Get rid of "CZARS". Then get rid of the income tax. Go to a national sales tax, NOT a VAT, then EVERYBODY would be paying taxes. This idea that 30 or 40% pay NOTHING is silly. We can argue about what to exempt, like perscriptions etc, just get it done. Take power out of the hands of the government. NO DOUBLE TAXES.
 

bobwg

Expert Expediter
Witness sounds like a democrat again so they have a plan wow but still nothing in writing ie law legislation, a bill to vote on
 

layoutshooter

Veteran Expediter
Retired Expediter
Witness sounds like a democrat again so they have a plan wow but still nothing in writing ie law legislation, a bill to vote on


Shoot, those no good bums could not even pass a budget. They just "deemed" one passed. What a bunch of crooks. I would LOVE to hear someone back up that move.
 

bobwg

Expert Expediter
I get sick and tire hearing people say the rich dont pay enough taxes especially the rich democrats like George Soros , the Hollywood left, Warren Buffett , etc if they dont think rich pay enough they should also lead by example and when they pay taxes each year write another check for the extra amount they think rich should be paying
 
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