Who is supposed to pay the liability and cargo insurance?

[Chris@Doms]

Very informative, thank you. And yes if I bid less then a going rate I usually include a reason why I'm giving a below par rate... Driver wanting to go home after being the road awhile, I'm about to double load the truck, I can't make money sitting in Laredo, lol, etc...

The biggest thing I see brokers post is they want "options". I see two vehicles from the same company being bid are those options. Maybe one is close and is a sprinter and the farther one is a cargo van. Now if the broker wants a cheaper rate he'll have to wait a little longer for pickup. Is your customers time worth the money? That's his choice and I give him that option.

Don't feel it is a disorganized situation at all.

 

[CharlesD]

Very informative, thank you. And yes if I bid less then a going rate I usually include a reason why I'm giving a below par rate... Driver wanting to go home after being the road awhile, I'm about to double load the truck, I can't make money sitting in Laredo, lol, etc...

The biggest thing I see brokers post is they want "options". I see two vehicles from the same company being bid are those options. Maybe one is close and is a sprinter and the farther one is a cargo van. Now if the broker wants a cheaper rate he'll have to wait a little longer for pickup. Is your customers time worth the money? That's his choice and I give him that option.

Don't feel it is a disorganized situation at all.

Here's how I would handle that. One guy from your office contacts the broker and tells them about both trucks and what the price and time frame would be for both. I wouldn't have two different people just shooting bids over. To the broker, seeing two bids from one company for one load sends the appearance of disorganization, whether or not you are actually disorganized.

As for the reasons for a low bid. You won't believe the things I see on bids. After a while it seems like every low bid has some sob story attached to it and I wonder which ones are legit and which ones aren't.

 

[xiggi]

Kinda like the panhandlers at the truck stop. They all have a story few are legit.

Sent from my Fisher Price - ABC123

 

[mjmsprt40]

I've been in situations before-- when I was working for a courier-- when dispatch would send two vehicles to pick the same load. First guy gets the freight, second guy gets to go on the list in that location. Reading this stuff reminded me of that- and reminded me that I made up my mind back then that if I find myself in such a situation again, I'm going to stop for coffee and--. It's pointless to get in a race like that, and I refuse on the general principle of the thing.

On the subject of who should pay for liability and cargo insurance-- the outfit I drive for is paying that at this time, though I do get $60.00 deducted weekly for cargo insurance. Understandably, if I started doing multi-carrier he wouldn't be best pleased if I use his insurance to cover when I'm doing somebody else's freight--- I'd either have to get my own or only drive for outfits that provide that coverage one way or another. I don't do multi-carrier because I saw no real profit during the short time I did-- in fact, I seemed to be hurting myself doing that, so-- nope, no more.

 

[jelliott]

Some carriers are moving to make the owner operator get their own MC and insurance. What a great system????? They put all the compliance, filings and insurance expense and exposure on the owner operator. If you are pulling for a motor carrier exclusively they should be the ones providing the liability and cargo as they are the motor carrier. They are basically a broker at that point and have NO skin in the game. If a truck doesn't turn a paid mile they have NO expense or concern other than lost profit. Heck, too bad they can't find owner operators that will pay the carriers rent or utilities. CRAZY!!!!! Wake up people!!!!

Ok, now as far as the cutting the rate and bidding against each other.....

Really, the bottom line no matter which way you slice it is the owner operator LOSES! If they lose it is not long term healthy for them and in turn the carriers business. It is a model that will by design fail. I read this whole thread and honestly....my head hurts.

 

[rollincoal]

First, get a good salesman and try to get access to more freight that you don't have to bid competitively for. Even some good 3PLs that aren't on Sylectus is a good start. The freight listed there are the lowest priced loads you'll haul. Nail down a few customers, either direct shippers or some 3PLs that aren't on Sylectus. You'll see your rates improve.

This is good advice right here spot on.

 

[jelliott]

This is good advice right here spot on.

Agreed. Sylectus has tried to market itself as a load board vs what it really is a transportation management software. I think the previous owners were behind that push and it was clearly sales driven. You are not going to find enough freight at the right places and price to run a company on there no matter what the sales pitch is. It is good for some backhauls and some filler. Getting out and selling your own direct shippers is the key.

 

[OntarioVanMan]

Agreed. Sylectus has tried to market itself as a load board vs what it really is a transportation management software. I think the previous owners were behind that push and it was clearly sales driven. You are not going to find enough freight at the right places and price to run a company on there no matter what the sales pitch is. It is good for some backhauls and some filler. Getting out and selling your own direct shippers is the key.

and Yet a popular fellow runs all his vans almost exclusively off that board....and the vans seem to be making money......how is this?

 

[jelliott]

and Yet a popular fellow runs all his vans almost exclusively off that board....and the vans seem to be making money......how is this?

You might be able to run a few and your aren't going to do it exclusively off there. But a lot of that is relationship. If it wasn't for relationship that carrier would not even meet the requirements to be a carrier for us. Like anything it may work for some people and some trucks. Guess you don't know till you try.

 

[OntarioVanMan]

You might be able to run a few and your aren't going to do it exclusively off there. But a lot of that is relationship. If it wasn't for relationship that carrier would not even meet the requirements to be a carrier for us. Like anything it may work for some people and some trucks. Guess you don't know till you try.

IF your CPM is LOW....running for between .90 to $1.00 is not that bad in this market right now...just saying...on an individual basis....not everyone could go that route...

 

[xiggi]

Cutting hotdogs in half isn't for everyone.

Sent from my Fisher Price - ABC123

 

[jelliott]

Well without having to bank for a replacement vehicle it does change ones operating costs. But it is only a small percentage that are in that situation. Let me rephrase that.... I think many do not allocate to bank for the replacement vehicle as they do not always understand their own true cost structure over time.

 

[OntarioVanMan]

Well without having to bank for a replacement vehicle it does change ones operating costs. But it is only a small percentage that are in that situation. Let me rephrase that.... I think many do not allocate to bank for the replacement vehicle as they do not always understand their own true cost structure over time.

Well put.....and back to topic:

 

[PreacherRich]

Cargo and Liability insurance.... It is ALWAYS the carriers responsibility to make sure every one of their trucks is properly insured. Allowing drivers to carry their own insurance increases risk to EVERYONE and needs to be eliminated in this industry. We used to operate that way. Unless you frequently audit every drivers policy, you have no control to make sure you and your customers are properly covered. Drivers can change or cancel their policies at any time. Carriers can demand however to be notified of any change but is it worth the risk? Nope...

So, it is the carriers responsibility to make sure the insurance is in place. Who pays for it is up for negotiation. I think you will find in most situations owner operators will have the cost of insurance deducted on their settlements.

Everyone who runs a load for us is on our insurance, no exceptions. Hopefully soon, the industry will no longer put themselves and their customers freight at risk by allowing drivers to carry their own insurance.

I remember when I was a young man, I dreamed of the day when I would make a six figure income. Today, I have a six figure insurance policy...

 

[jelliott]

Rich you are dead on! The other little factor that many of these so called "carriers"

1) If you make your units have their own MC number and insurance they are then in reality the carrier.

2) You in turn are then a broker and brokering the freight to them???

2a) Do you have brokerage authority and a bond?

2b) Your contracts with shippers, 3pls and other carriers most likely prohibit this as it would be brokering or in most cases double brokering?????

If you are constantly looking for a way to game the system or beat the system, regulations and laws.....do us all a favor and find a new industry. All you do is hurt owner operators, proper carriers, shippers and even insurance companies. So in the end many pay for the games of a few.

 

[Dynamite 1]

You sir, are exactly rite !!!!!!!!!!!

 

[CharlesD]

I remember when I was a young man, I dreamed of the day when I would make a six figure income. Today, I have a six figure insurance policy...

I hear you. Insurance topped six figures a while ago.

The funny thing is when I first started driving I thought the people in the office had it easy.

 

[Murraycroexp]

Correct. Those sound like shady "carriers", and calling them "carriers" is a mistake, IMHO.

For the record. In case anyone is confused. Although it doesn't matter much as we're only a few away from our max fleet size that we're comfortable with.

1) Our wonderful EXCLUSIVE O/Os run on our MC. Their insurance, with us as additional insured (and notified immediately of any changes).

2) N/A, as they operate for us on our MC.

2a) Not anymore. Not needed. Or at least for now. The 2 customers we have that we needed it for stopped shipping airplane wings and high volumes of parts to western NC.

2b) They probably do, but not an issue for us since we don't and won't do this.
I wish MORE brokers would be MORE strict with the carriers they contract.
I'm thinking it might flush out the carriers that are helping to keep the average rate per mile too low.
That would be good for all carriers, big & small.

 

[Murraycroexp]

The funny thing is when I first started driving I thought the people in the office had it easy.

YES, you did!!! Of course one can't call Rush an Expediting carrier. But it was hard to relate the stresses of 135 drivers and hundreds of deliveries a day.
But glad it's starting to fall into place for you!! The pics of your office look nice!
Nice "bosses" desk.
I prefer those old steel circa-WWII office desks with the plasticized tops. That way I don't have to worry about scratching them. LOL!!

 

[guido4475]

Some carriers are moving to make the owner operator get their own MC and insurance. What a great system????? They put all the compliance, filings and insurance expense and exposure on the owner operator. If you are pulling for a motor carrier exclusively they should be the ones providing the liability and cargo as they are the motor carrier. They are basically a broker at that point and have NO skin in the game. If a truck doesn't turn a paid mile they have NO expense or concern other than lost profit. Heck, too bad they can't find owner operators that will pay the carriers rent or utilities. CRAZY!!!!! Wake up people!!!!

Ok, now as far as the cutting the rate and bidding against each other.....

Really, the bottom line no matter which way you slice it is the owner operator LOSES! If they lose it is not long term healthy for them and in turn the carriers business. It is a model that will by design fail. I read this whole thread and honestly....my head hurts.

I read this whole thread and thank God above that I am leased to a carrier who has my back as much as I have yours. Thank you for doing things right.

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