when i 1st wrote this i was a little unclear. when i started talking to this owner it was a pretty common 60/40 split but when it came time to sign the contract there was an clause to this contract. which states if we as a team do not run 3000 miles a week we drop from 60% to 55% and that is for any miles ran from 1500 to 2999 we ran evrything they threw at us last week and didn't rufuse anything and only got 22 almost 2300 so we lost about 150 bucks on the miles we did run i find to be wrong even tho i signed the contract its almost like he stole a 150 bucks from us which i guess its our fault i mean we did sign it but we had already went threw class so it was easier thsn trying to find another owner and i was hoping we might get the 3000 so u live and learn
what is bull crap
- Thread starter TS462
- Start date
I think it's all in the wording and what you're told up front.
I have seen contracts that were X % for up to 2000 miles, etc.. then a 5% bonus for miles OVER 2000 etc...
Never seen one that you LOST % for NOT running something.. but it sounds like you had the same deal but just wern't told up front perhaps?
ie.. 55% up to 3000 then... 60% for all miles over... just perspective.. IMO.
If you had been offered the contract at 55% then 5% bonus for miles over 3000, would you have taken it?
Dale
I have seen contracts that were X % for up to 2000 miles, etc.. then a 5% bonus for miles OVER 2000 etc...
Never seen one that you LOST % for NOT running something.. but it sounds like you had the same deal but just wern't told up front perhaps?
ie.. 55% up to 3000 then... 60% for all miles over... just perspective.. IMO.
If you had been offered the contract at 55% then 5% bonus for miles over 3000, would you have taken it?
Dale
DougTravels
Not a Member
You signed it and you should honor it. That doesn't mean you can't try a little re-negotiating. I would tell that owner that due to the 5%, I will be looking for another owner to drive for when contract is up(If it has a length to it). If you want to keep me we should talk about the 5%.
You may find a compromise if no loads are turned down. Be sure not to come off like an ultimatum, more a business decision. Remember good drivers are hard to find, but so are good owners.
Best of luck to you!
You may find a compromise if no loads are turned down. Be sure not to come off like an ultimatum, more a business decision. Remember good drivers are hard to find, but so are good owners.
Best of luck to you!
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Yesteryear
Expert Expediter
You absolutely are being 'stolen' from. What kind of contract did you sign? Is it for a length of time? If not, then you should start looking for a different truck immediately! There are some truck owners that are out only for themselves and to heck with the driver. They could care less if you make it or not, your just a body to fill the seat. They will try to take every penny from you they can to line their own fat pockets. Sounds like that is the kind your driving for. If your paying the fuel you should be getting 100 percent of the fuel surcharge and 60 percent of the long haul.
I drive for Judd Transportation. Brian is a very honest person that looks out for his teams. Provides the most comfortable trucks possible and is always on time to the dime when it comes to pay. Took three times to get a really good truck owner but we finally found one. You can too, just keep trying until you get it right. First truck owner we drove for was dishonest, still owes us a lot of money, sure we will never see it. Drove for that owner for a year. Second, was honest but had horrible trucks, we drove one of those big red Kenworths for 16 months. Sure all of you know who that is. Very nice, honest people, but the trucks s@#k! Always breaking down. Lost 2 out of the last 4 loads we ran with them because of the truck breaking down. Now we are very happy. You can be too! Don't get taken advantage of! You let'em, they'll do it!
I drive for Judd Transportation. Brian is a very honest person that looks out for his teams. Provides the most comfortable trucks possible and is always on time to the dime when it comes to pay. Took three times to get a really good truck owner but we finally found one. You can too, just keep trying until you get it right. First truck owner we drove for was dishonest, still owes us a lot of money, sure we will never see it. Drove for that owner for a year. Second, was honest but had horrible trucks, we drove one of those big red Kenworths for 16 months. Sure all of you know who that is. Very nice, honest people, but the trucks s@#k! Always breaking down. Lost 2 out of the last 4 loads we ran with them because of the truck breaking down. Now we are very happy. You can be too! Don't get taken advantage of! You let'em, they'll do it!
flattop40
Expert Expediter
I am with Dreamer on this one. It is all a matter of perception. If you had been told that from 0-1500 it was 50% and from 1501-3000 55% and anything over 3001 was 60% and you knew this upfront you would not have a problem.
NO you are not being stole from. YOU signed the contract. Did you not read it? Boy this sounds alot like all these people with ARM's. Did they not read their contract?
There used to be something called "BUYER BEWARE" now I guess its called "I want what you got, I don't want to read the fine print, I don't care if I didn't do my home work, I want it, I want it, I want it, wah wah wah, its not FAIR"
I'm just SICK AND TIRED of everyone complaining that they have been wronged in some way shape or form.
NO you are not being stole from. YOU signed the contract. Did you not read it? Boy this sounds alot like all these people with ARM's. Did they not read their contract?
There used to be something called "BUYER BEWARE" now I guess its called "I want what you got, I don't want to read the fine print, I don't care if I didn't do my home work, I want it, I want it, I want it, wah wah wah, its not FAIR"
I'm just SICK AND TIRED of everyone complaining that they have been wronged in some way shape or form.
Yesteryear
Expert Expediter
I have to disagree with Dreamer and Flattop40! If you read the post he specifically says the truck owner told him 60/40 however when it comes time to sign the contract (for those of you that have never signed a contract with a truck owner, I have signed 3 as of this date, the contract is usually presented to the driver on the last day of orientation at the carrier the truck is leased on to), the contract says 55% if under 3000. Why didn't the truck owner present this up-front to the driver (s)? Why! I will tell you why! By the end of orientation the driver has (a) quit his/her previous job (b) taken the time and money to go to wherever the orientation is being held (c) taken the medical and drug testing (d) been put in a position of feeling caught. This is a trick on the truck owners part to 'rope' the driver in. It is totally dishonest and the poster should not 'honor' a bogus contract that they were roped into signing! They should find an honest owner that wants to work togeather to do the best for both of them so they both benefit equally.
Doggie Daddy
Veteran Expediter
I have to disagree with Dreamer and Flattop40! If you read the post he specifically says the truck owner told him 60/40 however when it comes time to sign the contract (for those of you that have never signed a contract with a truck owner, I have signed 3 as of this date, the contract is usually presented to the driver on the last day of orientation at the carrier the truck is leased on to), the contract says 55% if under 3000. Why didn't the truck owner present this up-front to the driver (s)? Why! I will tell you why! By the end of orientation the driver has (a) quit his/her previous job (b) taken the time and money to go to wherever the orientation is being held (c) taken the medical and drug testing (d) been put in a position of feeling caught. This is a trick on the truck owners part to 'rope' the driver in. It is totally dishonest and the poster should not 'honor' a bogus contract that they were roped into signing! They should find an honest owner that wants to work togeather to do the best for both of them so they both benefit equally.
Would it not make better sense to get a copy of the contract BEFORE you quit a previous job,and BEFORE orientation? I'm just sayin'.
I had to laugh at your comments, flattop, as I am a former mortgage broker from your state.
When our state's financial status started taking a dive, the NBC affiliate in Grand Rapids was interviewing a financial planner that had taken out a pay option ARM. The dingbat was crying about the balance of her loan going up and she had no idea it would.
EVERY single ARM loan has a rider with very large bold print on top stating that plainly that it was an adjustable rate loan. And to think this woman had a license to sell financial products or babysit someone's money...............
This is an interesting thread. My wife and I have been 'on' with our current gig for almost 3 full weeks. We did not sign a contract; nor were we offered one to sign. Our owners own 4 trucks, We took theirs, and they came off the road. They are all nice 2007 Sterlings with 96" sleepers, and we basically have a handshake agreement on our split. After chatting with other drivers, I believe we made out real well. Today was our first 'payday'. Everything was there, to the penny. I have spoken to other drivers that run for our owners, and they have said nothing but praise. I knew we were getting into a good thing.
To the OP, I do concur that he/she had been bait & switched. 3000 miles is tough these days, and it looks like the owner is punishing the driver for market forces beyond the drivers' control. Sleazy way to pay their bills, IMHO.
When our state's financial status started taking a dive, the NBC affiliate in Grand Rapids was interviewing a financial planner that had taken out a pay option ARM. The dingbat was crying about the balance of her loan going up and she had no idea it would.
EVERY single ARM loan has a rider with very large bold print on top stating that plainly that it was an adjustable rate loan. And to think this woman had a license to sell financial products or babysit someone's money...............
This is an interesting thread. My wife and I have been 'on' with our current gig for almost 3 full weeks. We did not sign a contract; nor were we offered one to sign. Our owners own 4 trucks, We took theirs, and they came off the road. They are all nice 2007 Sterlings with 96" sleepers, and we basically have a handshake agreement on our split. After chatting with other drivers, I believe we made out real well. Today was our first 'payday'. Everything was there, to the penny. I have spoken to other drivers that run for our owners, and they have said nothing but praise. I knew we were getting into a good thing.
To the OP, I do concur that he/she had been bait & switched. 3000 miles is tough these days, and it looks like the owner is punishing the driver for market forces beyond the drivers' control. Sleazy way to pay their bills, IMHO.
You hit on something that I believe this person failed to do. He never talked to current and previous drivers.
I do advocate the use of a contract to make sure there are no misunderstandings, but certainly a major part of research was skipped in this case.
I do advocate the use of a contract to make sure there are no misunderstandings, but certainly a major part of research was skipped in this case.
Yesteryear
Expert Expediter
Yes, I do agree with you Doggie Daddy. However, there are those of us that are naive enough to believe what we are told by the truck owner when we speak with them on the phone IS actually what will be in the contract we will be signing at the orientation. A lot of truck owners (fleet) leave their contract with the carrier as they have a lot of driver turn over. Drivers don't actually meet the truck owner they are driving for. I have not physically 'meet' two of the three fleet owners I have driven for.
Remember, this is a nation wide enterprise, a person can live in California and drive for a truck owner in Florida. It is not always possible to meet in person and get to know the owner.
As far as asking other drivers and investigating before taking the position, new drivers do not know to do this. There are very unscrupulous fleet owners who prey on new drivers because they know these drivers don't know the in's and out's of the business. Most new drivers have never heard of Expediters Online and have no clue truck owners can and will 'rip' them off'.
Some are lucky and hook up with a wonderful honest truck owner right away, others are not so lucky and end up getting rooked.
I just say this, "Just because you happen to be one of the unfortunate ones that don't get a good and honest truck owner the first time, don't let it put you off. If you feel your being 'stolen' from, more then likely you are. Once your out here expediting you are now in a position to hook up with other drivers and find that good truck owner to drive for. Don't let a dishonest owner trap you or sour you on the industry. It's a great occupation. Yes, it is slow right now but you can and will make good money out here if your willing to put in the effort and you find a truck owner that is working with you as a partner. That is what this is, a partnership."
Truck owners work with your drivers, you'll make more in the long haul when it is a satisfying partnership on both sides.
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That's wonderful that you made out so well with your 'owner' right off the bat. We tend to be like you, content to do a handshake deal, and have faith and trust that all will turn out well. Afterall, why cause any waves if things are going well and your intuition is not sending any red flags? To me, that would show a lack of trust to ask for something in writing.
That said, I have learned the hard way that you really should press for at least something in writing. We have been burned because of our failure to do so. Dealing with it after the fact is a lot harder than if we had just insisted on a written agreement in the first place. Anyone in business should not take any kind of offence at being asked to back up his offerings with his signature.
Things can be great as long as there is nothing to dispute, but once something happens, if it ever does, things can get ugly pretty quick. At least they can if one of the parties turns out to not be as honorable as first thought. Have you ever heard that saying, 'you have to work with someone before you really know them; or 'you don't really know someone until you've gone through a divorce from them'? Something like that anyway!
Please CYA and get something in writing, even if it's really short and simple. With your past work history, and even the little story you posted about the financial advisor, it should be easy for you to see why this is necessary. You are very fortunate to have found a 'good one', but you are also newer. I would hate at some point to see you work for x number of weeks, and not be paid, for whatever reason. And the amount that could potentially be in question could be rather large. Without that little contract, you may not have a leg to stand on to collect what's owed.
Best wishes for success in your new career and I hope you will never need to dig up that contract to get what's rightfully yours.
Wingnut
Seasoned Expediter
I am one of those owners who make sure the drivers get a copy of my contract long BEFORE they go to orientation or quit their current job. I tell them all to read it carefully, feel free to call & talk to me about anything in the contract before they sign it, and feel free to take it to a lawyer. I believe in doing everything above board & honestly.
Yesteryear
Expert Expediter
Good for you Wingnut! I think there are a lot of great truck owners that do try to be fair. Unfortunately we hear little of the good ones. When someone goes online to post about an owner it is because they have been damaged by that particular owner. Most don't think to let everyone know about the good owner their driving for. I think I will start a new thread so we can hear about the good truck and fleet owners. We hear to much bad so lets hear some good!
Wingnut
Seasoned Expediter
Not all drivers that post negative stuff about their owner was actually burned by the owner. Quite often it is the driver who wronged the owner & tries to cover his tracks by slamming the owner. Had a driver do that to me not too long ago. He wronged me, NOT the other way around. Funny thing about a lie...it always catches up with you at some time & point. In the case of my driver, it not only caught up with him, but it came back to bite a huge chunk out of him. His lies & wrong doings got him forever canned from the carrier and is now in the middle of several other legal troubles. There's always more than one side to a story.
Yesteryear
Expert Expediter
Again, wingnut you are 100% right!
There are bad drivers and bad owners. I have ran into both on the road. I have heard the complaints from drivers that complain they are not making any money only to find from talking with them it is their own fault. If they are dropping out to go home every week or two it is going to be hard for them to get ahead. Then you have drivers turning down perfectly good loads simply because they don't want to go to the east coast or the west coast and so on and so on. Then you hear a driver say how they 'dumped' an owners truck or just left it in a parking lot somewhere. You hear of a truck that has been destroyed by the driver and drivers that don't take care of the truck causing thousands of dollars of damage to the engine. There is bad on both sides. My suggestion to the owners is the same as to the drivers "don't let one or two bad experiences jade you. There are good drivers and owners out there, you just have to keep trying until you find them, and when you do treat each other with the same respect you want to be treated with." Note to drivers, take care of that truck as if it were your own. As if you were making that massive payment every month. Remember if the owner is damaged you will be as well.
I agree with you 100%, pjjjj, my Canuck friend. I should not be so cavalier in my business dealings. Maybe I'm just a slow learner.
That being said, I have at least two things working in my favor: The verbal contract is the weakest link. I have spreadsheets showing runs, total dollars per run, and per centage for the driver.....all e-mailed to me, and my first payday commensurate with said spreadsheets. Both the owner and I are residents of Michigan (as is his business registration). The compensation represents legal consideration consummating the verbal contract, which the spreadsheets provide further evidence of. I have spent loads of time in Michigan courtrooms defending my own contracts, and know the legal elements required to make one enforceable.
That said, however, I have no inclination to spend my time and needless effort trying to enforce my party to a verbal contract as fiercely as I would Old Glory or your beloved Maple Leaf.
Much easier to get it in writing. Again, I agree with your stance.
I'm sending the e-mail right now.
I thank you.
That being said, I have at least two things working in my favor: The verbal contract is the weakest link. I have spreadsheets showing runs, total dollars per run, and per centage for the driver.....all e-mailed to me, and my first payday commensurate with said spreadsheets. Both the owner and I are residents of Michigan (as is his business registration). The compensation represents legal consideration consummating the verbal contract, which the spreadsheets provide further evidence of. I have spent loads of time in Michigan courtrooms defending my own contracts, and know the legal elements required to make one enforceable.
That said, however, I have no inclination to spend my time and needless effort trying to enforce my party to a verbal contract as fiercely as I would Old Glory or your beloved Maple Leaf.
Much easier to get it in writing. Again, I agree with your stance.
I'm sending the e-mail right now.
I thank you.