To Expedite Or Not To Expedite?

[british380]

I've been on this site for months researching the up's and downs of expediting. I feel like I'm going around in circles with all the diffrent answers I've been getting. My job that I have been employed for 10 years is coming to an end in the next several months(down sizing). I need to know if I should continue investing my time with this or not.
My info:
CDL class B with hazmat for 14 years.
perfect driving record
perfect credit
have enough money to buy a cargo van cash or put a down payment on a straight truck.

What I'm looking to do:
Owner/operator
Either start off as a o/o cargo van expediter
or straight truck team with wife o/o.
What I need to know:
How much can I SERIOUSLY average for a week as a
solo cargo van o/o?
and how much for a straight truck(team) O/O?
Average miles for both?
Average home time for both?

My 2 best choices:
FEDEX custom critical
Panther
Do these companies have the loads to keep me rolling? I've got diffrent answers across the board on that question.

Sorry to be so blunt but I running out of time to make a decision. I love driving and was a delivery driver for 10 years driving around 4-500 miles a day so I know its something that I would like to do. Just have to make sure everything elso falls into place to make it worthwhile. Any help or advice will be appreciated. Thank You All

P.S. If you feel more comfortable writing a PM to me.My email is [email protected]. Thanks

 

[mrgoodtude]

Yes sir it's very doable.
Figures are going to vary off the chart depending who you ask.
I highly recommend the team scenario wit the Mrs but NOT jumping in feet first with a vehicle purchase..
There is a lot to learn and the adjustment is stressful enough without the worry of a truck payment, insurance ,taxes etc.
Run for someone for a year, you will learn enough about the business to be profitable and establish a track record with a carrier.
Have you lived in a closet with your significant other and a porta potty for a period of no less than 30 days yet?
It is a big adjustment but very rewarding if you can adapt...
Mike

 

[terryandrene]

I totaly agree with MrGoodtude. You sound like a younger fella, perhaps mid 30's, that needs to be established in a profitable business rather than a meager existence operating a cargo van. Not to belittle cargo van O/O's, I've been one over 18 years, but the days of profitablity for a newcomer in a van are behind us. The market is glutted with vans, but most carriers are eager to keep the straight truck inventory busy.

To answer acouple of your questions, you and the Mrs ought to be able to get in a typical straight truck and average about $1.20+, to the truck, for about 120,000 total miles per year. A specialized truck hauling reefer or A&E would do much better.

Plan on bringing the Mrs to the Expediter Experience at the Mid-America Trucking Show in Louisville 26-28 March and talk to dozens of O/O's and drivers; It'll be time and money well spent.

 

[british380]

Thanks for answering some of my questions everyone I was leaning towards the team driving upto a few days ago when I talked to a lady who just sold her new truck because fedex promised her tons of loads and couldnt deliver so she sold the truck and got out of the business. Then I talked to someone else and they're doing great and making 70k a year profit after expenses thats why I feel I keep going around in circles.
terryandrene thanks for the info I need all I can gather. We will definatly be attending the truck show in March. Do you still drive a cargo van now?

 

[terryandrene]

Yes still in the van. Keep in mind that any recruiter vying for your attention will tell you they can keep you busy. However, define busy! There were any one or more of a dozen reasons why the lady with the truck leased to FedEx failed in her business. We don't know the reasons, but likely she will contend it was all FedEx's fault, and none of hers.

For the record, there are thousands of expediters that earn a substantial living in this business, Some are with FedEx Custom Critical and others are with the hundreds of other carriers that call themselves expediters. With the proper preparation, initiative and wherewithall, you too can succeed

 

[highway star]

I talked to a lady who just sold her new truck because fedex promised her tons of loads and couldnt deliver so she sold the truck and got out of the business. Then I talked to someone else and they're doing great and making 70k a year profit after expenses

You can see that it's not a question that's as simple as it sounds. 2 people sit next to each other at orientation, 1 goes bankrupt while the other laughs all the way to the bank. Although, I've never actually seen anyone laughing all the way to the bank. It really depends on the person. You've received good advice. I would only add, as I sit here on day 2 of waiting for my first run of '08, wait until after the 1st quarter to make the move.

 

[Tennesseahawk]

You can see that it's not a question that's as simple as it sounds. 2 people sit next to each other at orientation, 1 goes bankrupt while the other laughs all the way to the bank. Although, I've never actually seen anyone laughing all the way to the bank. It really depends on the person. You've received good advice. I would only add, as I sit here on day 2 of waiting for my first run of '08, wait until after the 1st quarter to make the move.

I have to agree. As long as you have a steady income, stay with it. Save as much as you can before diving into expediting. I wouldn't go as far as staying with an owner for a year; but if you're making excellent money with a fleet owner who has pull with his company, sure... stay put and make money. Right now, trucks are being repoed. In another 6 months or so, you should have pick of the litter if you want to buy. If you still want to buy after a few months of driving, start looking around. But I advise you not to purchase anything after August (preferably April or May), because having a truck on the road less than 4 months before a new year (slow period) can be suicide, unless you have substantial reserves.

Let us know how things are going.

 

[british380]

Hello again everyone.......
Thanks for the input so far. It all helps From the answers I'm getting it raises a few more questions for me.
What is the peak times for an expediter? When does the season really take off and when does it slow down?
Also can you make more money with a reefer? If so how much more? What kind of maintence costs are there running a reefer?
Thanks

 

[TeamCaffee]

If you are looking at FedEx Custom Critical you will make more with a Reefer in White Glove but check with a recruiter on how long it typically takes a new O/O to get into White Glove. We bought our truck jumped in feet first to expediting and learned by talking to as many drivers as possible, reading every thing we could, attending the truck shows, and then sorting out the facts from the crap. Every person out here has a different pain tolerance and how quickly they learn their carriers way of doing business it is up to you to make it work. We do have a back ground in big trucks so we knew what life on the road would be like. Getting used to the small area of a sleeper and where no secrets can be hidden takes some getting used to.If you buy a truck right off the bat find out you or your better half cannot handle this life you are going to be in a bind. You will spec a truck usually different then you would for only one person and as a result of this if you decide to stay and run solo you will have a difficult time making the payments. You will also find that many people that are not making it blame the company and not the person they look at in the mirror. As with most businesses your income is not going to be handed to you on a silver platter you have to make a huge effort to be in the right place at the right time and it is not just luck.

 

[highway star]

Generally... The 1st quarter is slow, 2nd is good. July to mid-August is slow. From there it's pretty good for the rest of the year, although it can trail off a bit after Thanksgiving.

I do stress that I'm speaking in VERY general terms. I've had very good Januarys and Julys. Some will do well while others are gathering dust. And, while the Team is correct in saying that you shouldn't depend on luck, you will see it rear it's head in good and bad ways. You should also be very wary and suspicious of anyone that says there is no such thing as luck.

 

[cheri1122]

If there's no such thing as luck, how do lotteries and casinos manage to make such gobs of money?
If there's no such thing as luck, some of those megamillion dollar lottery winners must be really smart, huh? (But once they've won, it's amazing how quickly they get really stupid)
To the OP: the reason you're getting info that's all over the map is that you're getting it from so many sources. Some are honest, but some are not. Same for experienced, lnowledgeable, ethical, etc. You just have to gather as much info as possible, (the Louisville truck show is good, as are EO's seminars & archives) and then sort the wheat from the chaff. If you want assurances, or guarantees of loaded miles available, it isn't going to happen, and I'd run from anyone who tells you otherwise. Good luck, and do keep us posted on your progress.

 

[british380]

Here's a crazy question especially since its 3:35 a.m.
Most everyone I've talked to is pushing me away from a van or sprinter to drive straight truck as a team.
My question is the van o/o people tell me theyre making 6-800 a week take home after expenses on the average..
Say your running a straight truck o/o with a monthly payment(lets say 100k truck) plus insurance and other misc what are you actually putting into your pocket a week??? It seems from some that I talk to your close to what a van o/o makes in the end but the van o/o doesnt have the big payments and such??????? If I am totally out in left field remeber I'm new and learning Thanks

 

[Crazynuff]

Here's a crazy question especially since its 3:35 a.m.
Most everyone I've talked to is pushing me away from a van or sprinter to drive straight truck as a team.
My question is the van o/o people tell me theyre making 6-800 a week take home after expenses on the average..
Say your running a straight truck o/o with a monthly payment(lets say 100k truck) plus insurance and other misc what are you actually putting into your pocket a week??? It seems from some that I talk to your close to what a van o/o makes in the end but the van o/o doesnt have the big payments and such??????? If I am totally out in left field remeber I'm new and learning Thanks

I think the van o/o's are slightly overstating their income http://www.expeditersonline.com/forum/newbies-paradise-forum/24556-fed-ex.html .
Also consider van o/o's enjoy not being required to log . They can (and do ) take less than 10 hour breaks , drive more than 11 hours a day , and work more than 70 hours in 8 days .

 

[terryandrene]

Crazynuff mentioned some of the advantages of operating a cargo van and his link to a FedEx annual average cost sheet is an indicater of average gross revenues enjoyed by FedEx Custom Critical Surface Expedite owner/operators of years past. You have no argument from me on that info.

You seem to be leaning toward a desire to operate a cargo van, so let me leave you with this thought. Owner/operator expediting is a business, not a job. The amount of time, effort and money you put into this business will determine the return on your investment; The more you put in, the more you take out.

You've already mentioned you have the available credit and money to purchase a truck and you now seek advice on a potential source of income, cargo van or straight truck. Our members might be better able to recommend an appropriate route for you if we knew your requirements. How much money per month do you honestly need to average to maintain your desired standard of living? How many days per month are you willing to invest in travel away from home to meet your monetary goal?

We don't take your request for info lightly. There are many folks on here that will try to help you succeed before and after you've made your choice of truck and carrier.

 

[british380]

Thanks again....I can thank everyone enough for their help. I'm really starting to get the information I need to make my decision.
To terryandrene to be completly honest with you my wife and I take home around 4k(net) a month to live on. Which we could easily live on less if we had to...go to one car etc etc...to help cut back expenses...I also sell classic cars on the side as a hobby which helps every now and again..We make good money doing what we're doing now but our company is downsizing and we could both be losing our jobs as early as 3 months from now all the way up til the end of the year(2008) depending where they cut first. Thats why we're looking for another avenue. It seems driving a C unit o/o or D unit o/o as a team would bring us closer to our goals?? maybe even a CR white glove o/o would probably be even better?? any thoughts??? Thanks

 

[greg334]

Thanks again....I can thank everyone enough for their help. I'm really starting to get the information I need to make my decision.
To terryandrene to be completly honest with you my wife and I take home around 4k(net) a month to live on. Which we could easily live on less if we had to...go to one car etc etc...to help cut back expenses...I also sell classic cars on the side as a hobby which helps every now and again..We make good money doing what we're doing now but our company is downsizing and we could both be losing our jobs as early as 3 months from now all the way up til the end of the year(2008) depending where they cut first. Thats why we're looking for another avenue. It seems driving a C unit o/o or D unit o/o as a team would bring us closer to our goals?? maybe even a CR white glove o/o would probably be even better?? any thoughts??? Thanks

My advice for what it is worth is as follows;

I would explore a possible lateral move to another job first (unless you live in my state Michigan where we are celebrating anyone who gets a job at McDonalds as gainful employment). I would look at how to leverage your experience in and try to land something 9 to 5 for a while so you are not rushed and have choices instead of ending up working for a payment. 3 months flies by and then you have to make decisions and rush into things – not always good.

I would realistically think on the planning part by getting two things, a lawyer and an accountant. Unless you were in business for yourself before (like retail or some service industry like plumbing), they will properly guide you in how to set everything up and are there to protect you. I don’t make any bones about it, I have been very consistent with this advice and I have plenty of great reasons – especially for a newbie who has never been a 1099 before. Even if you only thinking about coming here to this niche market, there are real valid reasons to start the relationship now instead of on the eve of a decision.

I would think about pairing down the expenses as much as you can, like when you speak about having one car, what would you need a second one for anyway? I own two but I also own two – no payments no nothing so if I don’t need one, it gets parked and costs 0 dollars. Can you live without your cable or what ever else? I would serious set the goal of cutting the expenses in half.

Speaking about expenses, even if you have a million to spend on credit – take this advice get as much money saved or accumulated somehow to buy a truck without credit. If you know what I know, you know that you would be so far ahead of the game if you do this.

Don’t count on the high value freight stuff (don’t plan on the White glove stuff or the elite fleet stuff for your entry), target stuff more common but keep in mind of the flexibility that you may need for the company. If you follow the “yellow brick road to expediting millions”™plan, you may fail quickly. I weigh on the cautious side and say build up the career, learn the ropes the right way and don’t fall for the ‘I did it this way, so can you’ cr*p because each person is different and each person has different goals. It is good to start at the bottom and work upwards, you learn more and more aware of things. Yea you can say this may include running for an owner for a year or two to learn.

Now with a reefer, I would stay away from them unless you know how to maintain them and how to leverage them to make money. There is absolutely no guarantee that the company you are with will actually give you enough work to justify the cost of buying, maintaining and certifying the thing. I spent $1800 on mine this past year in repairs and maintenance. After PM servicing, the fuel pump and then the injector pump went out while I was going to Indy. I made up the cost later on I the year but that hit was unexpected, even though I have had the system checked out and it never gave me any problems before they died. I by the way saved the parts and now have a fresh rebuilt injection pump and rebuilt the fuel pump myself (10 bucks worth the parts). Right now I have to replace the alternator (no biggie) and go through the system as part of my winter schedule. If the unit did not come with the truck I would not have gotten in retrospect for a truck like this (class7).

As for information gathering, I would take a lot of things with a grain of salt. Many people will not admit to defeat or problems while others are brutally honest. It may be very true that the lady you talked to was telling the truth, many will defend the company without really knowing the circumstances of that person. FedEx, Panther and others are there to make money and one of the most puzzling things for me until very recently is why they didn’t keep all the trucks rolling. I can argue with some here on the reasoning of the company but they don’t know what goes on above the group, this goes for both the companies you mention. But with that said, I would very seriously look around and choose five, 5, companies to talk to, talk to them and then take a week and go to a few truck stops and meet some of the drivers/owners of these 5 companies, I mean go introduce yourself to them and offer to buy them a cup or two and ask them what is going on.

Oh yea, one last thing with this winded posts – you will never find answers to some of these questions because like I said everyone is different and everyone has a different standard and point of view.

 

[x06col]

Also, you may want to expand your horizons a bit and take a look at organizations that don't use the terms DR unit, CR unit, surface, White Glove.

Might be wise!!

 

[Turtle]

I think the van o/o's are slightly overstating their income http://www.expeditersonline.com/forum/newbies-paradise-forum/24556-fed-ex.html .
Also consider van o/o's enjoy not being required to log . They can (and do ) take less than 10 hour breaks , drive more than 11 hours a day , and work more than 70 hours in 8 days .

Buuuut, it's very rare that a solo in a cargo van is gonna get enough miles in a week to actually work more than 70 hours in 8 days. While we can (and do) take less than 10 hour breaks, we also can (and do) take breaks of 50 hour or more. We sometimes drive more than 11 hours, but we also drive a lot of 6 hour runs with a day or two off in between.

I drive a Sprinter and am out 2-3 months at a time. I average about 3.8 loads per week, and I average a little more than 1900 miles per week over a 52-week year (some weeks are considerably more than 1900 miles, some are dramatically less), but I also know that more typical for most van drivers is 1300 miles per week, and if you like to go home every weekend, it's closer to 1000 miles a week, usually less than that.

You can make $600-$800 in a cargo van, but the $600 will happen far more often than the $800 will. In fact, $500 will happen more often than $800 will. A cargo van driver , as an owner/operator, will make between $25,000 and $30,000 per year in yer pocket. To expect more than that is fantasy. Anyone who tells you they are averaging $800 a week ($40,000 a year) in a cargo van is lying.

Well, sort of. In one sense, yeah, I do make $800 or so after expenses, that is if I don't put anything back to cover unexpected expenses like mechanical breakdowns. Just a couple of weeks before Christmas I had a mechanical problem and between the tow, the motel bill and the repairs, it was nearly a grand. I had the cash to cover it, but that's because I don't pay myself $800 a week. I pay myself $0.32 per loaded mile, plus some of the accessorials like hand unloads, detention. Everything else goes to the van.

A solo straight truck driver will have a few more loads, and thus more revenue, but also more expenses. And because of Hours of Service restrictions, a straight truck solo sits nearly as much as a van driver. It's about a wash between solo van and straight truck drivers. IMHO, every bit of revenue that a solo straight truck makes in excess of a van driver is eaten up in wasted time and extra efforts in dealing with parking headaches, logging headaches, scale headaches, etc.

Cargo vans are a dime a dozen, whereas a straight truck team is royalty to a carrier, and they will flat out dispatch around a sitting cargo van and put a single skid on a straight truck to keep the truck running and happy. Team straight trucks will get considerably more loads, more miles, and more gross and net revenue. That one simple fact should weigh heavily in your decision-making process.


Good luck.

 

[RichM]

The Turtle speaks the truth.

 

[Tennesseahawk]

I agree with Turtle, for the most part. I wouldn't say logging, scaling, and parking issues for staights even things out with vans. Most of the time those things don't even come into play. The once or twice a year I get pulled into a scale only takes up an hour or so total. Parking... not as easy as for a van, but using a bit of ingenuity gets it done. And logging is only as tough as you want to make it. I, for one, would never give up the revenue gained in a straight for the convenience of a van.