This should blow your minds

roadeyes

Veteran Expediter
Charter Member
Of course it's wrong. Which religion and which time period are irrelevent.

My original post was actually attacking the OP not the post itself, as it seems that every time I read one of his posts, I get the feeling I am being "preached to" and was getting a little sick of it and decided he needed a few rocks thrown through his glass house.:D
 
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greg334

Veteran Expediter
Yep you are right, every word of it.

It may be a bad thing to mention that not just in the past but present that one religion is just as bad as another.

Let's see ...

So far in my life time there has been more killing on one side of the same God worshipers than the other. Counting the terrorist attacks, the killing of innocent people and so on, Muslims are still far behind the leading group.

I shouldn't add that the biggest issue of killing was no where near a Muslim group, with overall 44 million killed within 10 years and between 5 and 7 million of one religion - all from another religion.

Just that one massacre in Bosnia, there were over 8000 Muslims killed by Orthodox Chrisitans. Kind of odd that it popped up in this misinformation email (which is my point) - and that happened within 15 years.

Regardless if you are tired of hearing it, the knee jerk reaction of mis-information is just amazing. If people would put half the effort into actually learning the truth (like there are more honor killings among non-Muslim groups in this country than anything else) maybe you can see what's really the matter.

Beheading?

Where?

there are no Christians planting bombs in public places
You sure about that?


  • Ted Kaczynski
  • Damon Strange
  • Andrew Kehoe (killed a school house full of children)
  • Sam Melville (8 bombings)
  • Eric Rudolph (4 bombs)
  • Karl Armstrong, Dwight Armstrong, Leo Burt, David Fine (Sterling Hall Bombing - with 2000 lbs of explosives)
  • Cliff Draper
  • George Metesky (33 bombs)
I will give you that a few of them are not the 'religious' type but nevertheless, they were all Christian at one time.

Oh and I didn't touch on the Klan's operation of religious war with church bombings.

To say it is ok not to speak up is because you are in the community is a poor excuse just like the inner city excuse for not snitching is a poor excuse. Wrong is wrong regardless of who is committing the wrong.
SO you would want to apply that to a real threat?

Let's do that.

There is more of an issue within the Hispanic communities throughout the US NOT speaking up when crimes are committed even with their own elderly than there is with any Muslim community.

The public demands Muslims to discredit those in their smaller communities who 'threaten' us and those who scream the loudest seem to be the first to stay absolutely silent and help silent others over the mere fact that there is not a peep out of the victims of real crimes in Hispanic communities. The focus is not on the "poor and innocent" Hispanics because of their ties to the country but rather those weird Muslims who invaded our country and demand we change our lifestyle to fit their needs.

Kind of a twisted way to think about the real fact, actually covering it up with BS. We have accommodated the Spanish speaking people in a lot of bad ways and because there is a hatred of people of another religion, we tend to justify our inactions and accommodations because of our focus on those we hate that actually prevents us from protecting the country of those who are committing a lot of the crime.

I have yet to hear the Muslim gangs roaming around in turf wars, doing drivebys and killing children here. Maybe in Iraq or in Israel but here?

AH yes beheading, that's where it is ... along the border with Mexico on their side. It has been slow crossing but I expect it to happen.

Let's forget about the honor killings within these communities, the peaceful gang riddled Hispanic communities where if a daughter, wife or girlfriend acts out of sorts, they sometimes get killed if not beaten pretty bad.

DO you know I keep hearing we have the kidnap capital of the world on our soil but its sad that again the ignorant and the idiots keep justifying the news as no big deal because it is happening between the Mexicans and not involving any of us.

Yep Leo you are sooooo right, a lot of people just don't get it.
 

Turtle

Administrator
Staff member
Retired Expediter
Wrong is wrong regardless of who is committing the wrong.
Absolutely, but the problem comes when we say they're wrong and we're right, when we are, in fact, doing the same things they are, except we use different methods, and because we're doing it, it's OK for use to do it.

People don't want to hear about the bad stuff we do, because, of course, it's not bad stuff. People don't want to hear about the past, but how far back is too far? Last week, a month ago, six months ago, a year or two? We don't behead people to invoke terror, but dead is dead whether they're beheaded or have their head blown off. We don't use suicide bombers because we can afford unmanned drones. We don't do a lot of the named stuff IN THIS COUNTRY, but we sure do a snotload of it IN OTHER COUNTRIES. And I don't hear the whole Christian community, or even a small subset of it, outraged and speaking out against it.

I'm not saying that what radical Islam is doing is right by any stretch of the imagination, but what I am doing is pointing out the gross hypocrisy of far too many Christians that either turn a blind eye or even condone what some Christians are doing, or worse, think it's right because 'we fight the good fight' and therefor whatever we do is perfectly fine. We have Christians killing civilian Mulsims, right now, today, and then cutting off body parts for souvenirs. And it happens a lot more than people hear about. Yet few are outraged, because, of course, it's Muslims that are being killed, and that's OK.


Oh, yeah, and...
My original post was actually attacking the OP not the post itself, as it seems that every time I read one of his posts, I get the feeling I am being "preached to" and was getting a little sick of it and decided he needed a few rocks thrown through his glass house.:D
That right there is one of the biggest problems with EO in general, and the Soapbox specifically - too may people pay far more attention to who posted something, rather than to what they posted.
 

AutonomyRex

Seasoned Expediter
It hasn't been posted here before because nobody has been stupid enough to post it!

I guess you get to have that dubious distinction!

Why do you care? Your god will protect you won't it???:rolleyes:


And for anybody who cares, more blood has been spilt by christians from their various causes and crusades throughout the course of history than any other religion ever.

Oh, but that's ok because their cause is just, right???:cool:

Not to mention the grave injustices done to the native Americans and Canadians in modern history by those christian groups who tried to impose their will and ways on the so called "heathens". All in the name of "saving their souls"!:rolleyes:

More wrongs have been committed in the name of religion of all stripes (with the exception of maybe buddhism, and no, I'm not a buddhist) than any other reason.

I know this is the soapbox forum and no, if I don't like it I don't have to read it, but I really wish EO would make religious discussions a no-no on here.

Politics is bad enough!



Hey Roadeyes,

I know what history states was done to the American Indians/Native Indians, and I know the victor writes history as well, so it was probably much worse than I ever learned...
But I am racking my brain as to what "Grave injustices" were done to Canadians in modern history. Any help/ Anybody???

Also, I am neutral on your post and this thread...though I do find it interesting and varied, and informative. Though what I am against is one thing you alluded too, and that is censorship.

EO provides an open forum where all can voice their opinions, beliefs, and ideas.

"I may disagree with what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it"

(Voltaire is most often credited with the saying, but many believe that this is a widespread mistake, and that the quote was originally said by Ewelyn Beatrice Hall. There is no definite answer to this question. From Answers.com / Wiki Answers )
 
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OntarioVanMan

Retired Expediter
Owner/Operator
Hey Roadeyes,

I know what history states was done to the American Indians/Native Indians, and I know the victor writes history as well, so it was probably much worse than I ever learned...
But I am racking my brain as to what "Grave injustices" were done to Canadians in modern history. Any help/ Anybody???

Also, I am neutral on your post and this thread...though I do find it interesting and varied, and informative. Though what I am against is one thing you alluded too, and that is sensorship.

EO provides an open forum where all can voice their opinions, beliefs, and ideas.

"I may disagree with what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it"

(Voltaire is most often credited with the saying, but many believe that this is a widespread mistake, and that the quote was originally said by Ewelyn Beatrice Hall. There is no definite answer to this question. From Answers.com / Wiki Answers )

I must have missed those grave injustices as well...:confused:

Only thing I can think off is trying to import that crap called beer from down here....
 

OntarioVanMan

Retired Expediter
Owner/Operator
World would be a lot simpler if Man would just believe in him/herself...and scrap all this religion crap....
 

roadeyes

Veteran Expediter
Charter Member
That right there is one of the biggest problems with EO in general, and the Soapbox specifically - too may people pay far more attention to who posted something, rather than to what they posted.


True, but hey, at least I freely admitted it.:D

For the record, I don't know the OP personally, so I have no beef with him or any hidden agenda. It's nothing personal, it's the soapbox!
 

roadeyes

Veteran Expediter
Charter Member
Hey Roadeyes,

Also, I am neutral on your post and this thread...though I do find it interesting and varied, and informative. Though what I am against is one thing you alluded too, and that is sensorship.

EO provides an open forum where all can voice their opinions, beliefs, and ideas.

Well, truth be told, it's only as open as the people who run it want to make it. That is why I was making a wish to EO as it has been my experience that because all religions are based on blind faith, none of their followers therefore can be tolerant of other religions because in order to be tolerant, you would have to admit the possibility that you could be wrong, and if the possibility exists that you could be wrong, then the religion itself fails. That is why you will never have any rational thinking when it comes to discussing religion, and therefore I consider it a waste of bandwidth.

"Religion is a magical device for turning unanswerable questions into unquestionable answers. -Art Gecko

As far as censorship goes, in no way is that censorship as you are free to put up your own forum on your own site to allow whatever discussions you wish.
 
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AutonomyRex

Seasoned Expediter
Canadian Indian residential school system - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia




The only American beer that's any good is the Budweiser that's brewed in Canada!:D
(and not that bud light lime horse pi$$)


Hey Roadeyes,

Thanks for the link, I see your point now. I thought you meant Canadians of today...not Canadian indians. My Bad...

As for censorship....let's agree to disagree on the finer points. I just see it as "The Soapbox" was set up to be an "Open" forum, for any and all to express views and opinions regarding anything. To exclude even one minor arena of thought, to me would be censorship.

As for Beer....well we do have common ground there!!. And I thought OVM had made a good point re: "grave injustices to Canadians", as Meaning us Yanks sending our sewage lite up north....glad Canada likes to share their LaBatts and Molson ;-)

And lets not forget the Kitchener-Waterloo Oktoberfest, I think it is going on now??? Sorry to miss it this year.

Run Safe out there
A-Rex
 
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OntarioVanMan

Retired Expediter
Owner/Operator

OntarioVanMan

Retired Expediter
Owner/Operator
Hey Roadeyes,

Thanks for the link, I see your point now. I thought you meant Canadians of today...not Canadian indians. My Bad...

As for censorship....let's agree to disagree on the finer points. I just see it as "The Soapbox" was set up to be an "Open" forum, for any and all to express views and opinions regarding anything. To exclude even one minor arena of thought, to me would be censorship.

As for Beer....well we do have common ground there!!. And I thought OVM had made a good point re: "grave injustices to Canadians", as Meaning us Yanks sending our sewage lite up north....glad Canada likes to share their LaBatts and Molson ;-)

And lets not forget the Kitchener-Waterloo Oktoberfest, I think it is going on now??? Sorry to miss it this year.

Run Safe out there
A-Rex


Uh hummm...NO such thing as a Canadian Indian....as there is no American Indian....Only citizens of North America...
 

xiggi

Veteran Expediter
Owner/Operator
Well, truth be told, it's only as open as the people who run it want to make it. That is why I was making a wish to EO as it has been my experience that because all religions are based on blind faith, none of their followers therefore can be tolerant of other religions because in order to be tolerant, you would have to admit the possibility that you could be wrong, and if the possibility exists that you could be wrong, then the religion itself fails. That is why you will never have any rational thinking when it comes to discussing religion, and therefore I consider it a waste of bandwidth.

"Religion is a magical device for turning unanswerable questions into unquestionable answers. -Art Gecko

As far as censorship goes, in no way is that censorship as you are free to put up your own forum on your own site to allow whatever discussions you wish.

Truth be told there are plenty of religions that are tolerant of other religions. Sure there are plenty that are not but to say none are shows a lack of understanding of religion today.

From the opening post I never considered this a religious argument only posts that followed turned it into such.
 

Moot

Veteran Expediter
Owner/Operator
Some get it some don't.

A Christian is a follower of Jesus Christ. Jesus Christ is the son of God. Jesus teaches love, tolerance and forgiveness.

Father forgive them, for they know not what they do.

But I tell you, do not resist an evil person. If someone strikes you on the right cheek, turn to him the other also. And if someone wants to sue you and take your tunic, let him have your cloak as well. If someone forces you to go one mile, go with him two miles.

But I tell you who hear me: Love your enemies, do good to those who hate you, bless those who curse you, pray for those who mistreat you.

Therefore all things whatsoever ye would that men should do to you, do ye even so to them.

They will beat their swords into plowshares and their nuclear weapons into Homeland Security X-ray machines and glow in the dark watch dials.

It is easier for a van full of mustard seeds to pass through a jersey barrier than for a rich man to enter the kingdom of God.


 

OntarioVanMan

Retired Expediter
Owner/Operator
Oh... is that what they're called TODAY?

NO..that is what they've always been...

Both governments issue ID cards....for border crossings and tax exemptions and hunting privileges...

It has their citizentry....North American

I once got stuck behind an Indian trucker....the DHS border service demanded that he declare what citizen he was...he stood firm..North American with supporting ID ..the idiot in the booth was irate...until a supervisor showed up...and after some discussion...the driver was on his way....
 
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roadeyes

Veteran Expediter
Charter Member
Truth be told there are plenty of religions that are tolerant of other religions. Sure there are plenty that are not but to say none are shows a lack of understanding of religion today.



All religions will put on a public face of tolerance, love and understanding as they have to in order to win public support and increase their flock, but when it gets right down to it, not only are they not tolerant of other religions views, many of them are not even tolerant of sub sects within their own religon.

I.E - Suni muslims vs. Shiites
Catholic vs. Protestant in N. Ireland

I'm sure I could find 100's of examples if I researched it.


Again, as I said earlier, only buddhism appears to be truly tolerant of not only others views but respect for life in general. I said appears because I only have superficial knowledge of them, and maybe if I researched a little I could dig up some dirt on them as well?

Anyways, I seem to be getting drawn into a debate that I said I wished EO would not allow, so at this point I will exit the conversation and wish everyone the best of luck and a happy Canadian Thanksgiving!
 
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