The Vice President
- Thread starter skyraider
- Start date
Why?
If he stays he's condoning and accepting the kneeling, if he leaves he's exercising his right to not support that type of protest.
Come on ... it was a stunt. Trying to promote exactly what Trump said to do. Like Pence is going to start some mass exodus from NFL games.
Pence lost my respect when he sold out to be on the ticket.
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Pence lost my respect when he sold out to be on the ticket.
Sent from my VS987 using EO Forums mobile app
Ok ladies and gents, let us have some more post.
There has got to be at least 200 of you with phones or Ipads. I know - you have the right to be silent. So, here you go:::
This is the forum with no topic! Want to just chit-chat? Talk about anything and everything? Shout out to someone?
This is it! Nothing is off topic! *** Note, I just read something again for the 100th time, it says--"this is the forum with no topic"-------now isn't that interesting, " we don't need a topic, wow."
There has got to be at least 200 of you with phones or Ipads. I know - you have the right to be silent. So, here you go:::
This is the forum with no topic! Want to just chit-chat? Talk about anything and everything? Shout out to someone?
This is it! Nothing is off topic! *** Note, I just read something again for the 100th time, it says--"this is the forum with no topic"-------now isn't that interesting, " we don't need a topic, wow."
Kneeling for the national anthem is a stunt. Trying to promote exactly what Kaepernick said to do.
See? It works both ways. Stunt, protest, tomato, tomahto.
That wasn't the goal. His statement on the matter made that very clear.
Setting aside for a moment my shock and surprise (and some significant doubt) that Pence had ever garnered your respect before he was on the ticket, please elaborate what, specifically, Pence sold out to be on the ticket? Or is "<insert name here> lost my respect when he sold out to be on the ticket," just a canned catch-all for whomever the Vice President under Trump might be?
I don't know if it was the right decision; it was his decision and more power to him for having the balls to follow through with it.
Well, first of all, no, not really. Trump and Pence have both taken a very public stance on the issue which, along with most Americans, is that of kneeling during the national anthem is the exact opposite of petty nonsense and is not acceptable behavior. By staying, he wouldn't be showing he's above the petty nonsense, he would very publicly be reversing his position.
Second, the players doing the keeling don't think it's petty (trivial, trifling, minor, small, unimportant, insignificant, inconsequential, negligible, or paltry). Nor do those who show their support them in the players kneeling. As well, neither do those who are in opposition against the keeling. Those who are in opposition to the kneeling do see it as nonsense, though (foolish or unacceptable behavior), so you're half right.
I think he's one of those people who go to the games, and then leave early to beat the traffic.
It does work both ways. Both actions by Kaepernick & Pence were stunts. It's just that one is befitting of a jock & one is not befitting of the Vice President of the United States. Are the two actions really equatable?
Trump tweeted that he asked Pence to leave if players kneeled. Exactly what Trump stated people should do to force the owners to put an end to this. No direct correlation there? Really?
Turtle, your assessment of my political beliefs is inaccurate. Pence lost me after the Access Hollywood tape came out. Pence kept beating his religious right drum & then still turned a blind eye to that BUFFOON that we now have in the White House. The second part of that question is open ended. Tell me who else Trump would have had on the ticket with him & I'll give you my opinion.
Why are Trumpsters sooooo defensive? Pence's move was cheap. Don't try to stand up for it. Take it for what it was & move on ....
Trump tweeted that he asked Pence to leave if players kneeled. Exactly what Trump stated people should do to force the owners to put an end to this. No direct correlation there? Really?
Turtle, your assessment of my political beliefs is inaccurate. Pence lost me after the Access Hollywood tape came out. Pence kept beating his religious right drum & then still turned a blind eye to that BUFFOON that we now have in the White House. The second part of that question is open ended. Tell me who else Trump would have had on the ticket with him & I'll give you my opinion.
Why are Trumpsters sooooo defensive? Pence's move was cheap. Don't try to stand up for it. Take it for what it was & move on ....
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Remember, he doesn't like those that follow rules.
I don't know if the two actions are equatable, other than both are protests, or stunts, take yer pick. I'm not so sure that kneeling in political protest during the national anthem is in some way befitting of a jock, particularly a jock who is being paid millions of dollars by virtue of living in the country who's national anthem, flag and country they are disrespecting by kneeling. On the other hand, I think it is very much befitting of the Vice President to take pride in the country and demonstrate disdain for those who engage in such protests, and the corporations who support those protesting against the anthem and flag and everything the anthem and flag stands for.
No, no direct correlation. You can certainly connect enough dots to get from one to the other, but Pence's statement made very clear what the goal was in his leaving.
I've made no assessment of your political beliefs. The only assessment I've made is on your words regarding Pence selling out to be on the ticket. And knowing Pence's record and position on certain things, I was just wondering what he sold out.
Ah, OK, that explains it. For some reason you think that those who beat the religious right drum are somehow moral and virtuous, and are not, instead, at their core, unabashedly hypocritical. Well, they are. Like, totally. Every one of them. The dogma and moralistic positions of the religious right set things up so that there is no way they can avoid being hypocritical and still remain living, breathing human beings. They have created humanly unattainable standards for themselves, and everyone who doesn't attain those standards are hypocritical when they attempt to apply those standards to themselves or to others.
It was intentionally open-ended. That's why I asked if your statement was a canned catch-all.
I dunno. I don't even have a MAGA hat.
Anti Trumpers see it as a cheap, transparent political stunt, because that's the best way to frame it in the most disparaging way, and they cannot let an opportunity to disparage Trump in some manner pass them by.
The Trumpsters see it as an uber-patriotic, uber-statement in support of the flag, the military, the nation, and all that is good in the world.
The Identity Politickers see it as yet another shining example of systemic oppression of the black man, where a man with power comes to the game, tweets a couple of things, and leaves the game in an attempt to thwart the efforts of those poor, poor black men and their allies taking a knee for equality and justice for all.
Players kneeling is a cheap stunt. Kaepernick's original kneeling was a cheap stunt, as was his pig police socks. Players huddling up in the locker room before the game to get a consensus on how to handle the national anthem is no different than Pence and Trump huddling up deciding on how to handle the protests of the anthem.
I see it as a political statement, pure political theater, calling out those on the left who can dish it out but can't take it, to belittle those who think they can do and say whatever they want and be free of consequences, and those who think unless you agree with them you're wrong.
I do not see it as cheap in any fashion. He flew Air Force Two from Las Vegas to Indianapolis to witness the thoroughly expected spectacle of the 49ers players kneeling during the national anthem, then immediately flew Air Force 2 to Los Angeles to make a 6:30 PM (9:30 PM Eastern Time) fundraiser. Vegas to Indy and back to LA is about 5 hours flight time on Air Force Two, which costs about $45,000 an hour to fly. Add in Secret Service and the logistics of the backup plane and getting the vehicle convoy in place in Indy and LA, the added security measures at the stadium, plus the cost of hotel rooms in Indy Saturday night for Pence and his roughly 50 person entourage, and you're looking at very likely something in the $400,000 range. Cheap stunt? No.
Don't try and criticize it. Take it for what it was & move on....
See how that works?
But the Media (and the Left) will get several days, maybe even a week out of this. It probably won't get as much air time as "the storm" will. Trump says in a room filled with top military brass, "Maybe it's the calm before the storm. Could be, the calm. The calm before the storm." The media immediately changes the meaning of "maybe" and "could be" to "is absolutely for certain," and craps themselves speculating what storm he's talking about.
Thank you for your intelligent, well-reasoned and not-at-all emotional addition to the conversation. It's comments like yours that foster spirited debate and intelligent discourse of exactly the kind The Soapbox thrives upon. Kudos to you on a brilliant comment!
I wonder if comments like this are Internet specific.
Our society thrives on positional differences. But for crying out loud, be respectful of your opposition.