tax reform

[bobwg]

Two choices I see go to a flat 15% for everyone rich,middle class, poor with NO deductions or loop holes NONE. or the one I think is best is a National retail sales tax of say 6% but only if they dump all taxes related to income personal and business

 

[greg334]

6% will not cover the revenue, there is a serious downfall with a national sales tax and nothing else.

I don't want any flat tax, I pay enough now and this will increase my tax burden enough. Flat tax would work only if it is actually applied fairly which it would not be.

Look at the Fair Tax which is a consumption tax that seems to be better than a national sales tax. It applies across the board 24% tax that replaces the income tax, social security related taxes and corporate taxes and if it is done, the price adjustment to lower the initial prices by the 24% will be more of a competitive move to attract sales than any other reason. Beside in this business, my legit business expenses would not have that 24% tacked on.

 

[dieseldiva]

I like the Fair Tax as well because EVERYONE consumes.....even illegals......even the 40% of the country that does not currently pay taxes at all......everyone has to pay = FAIR!

 

[RLENT]

6% will not cover the revenue, there is a serious downfall with a national sales tax .....

Then why are the Fair Tax folks proposing one ?

Look at the Fair Tax which is a consumption tax that seems to be better than a national sales tax.

Uhhh .... ok .................... really ?

At what point would this tax (the Fair Tax) be applied and collected ?

From the Fair Tax website:

"What is the FairTax plan?

The FairTax plan is a comprehensive proposal that replaces all federal income and payroll based taxes with an integrated approach including a progressive national retail sales tax .....

It abolishes all federal personal and corporate income taxes, gift, estate, capital gains, alternative minimum, Social Security, Medicare, and self-employment taxes and replaces them with one simple, visible, federal retail sales tax administered primarily by existing state sales tax authorities."

Part of the art of Public Relations and Sales is having a consistent message ...... and avoiding giving ones own self footbullets with what one says .....

 

[RLENT]

or the one I think is best is a National retail sales tax of say 6% but only if they dump all taxes related to income personal and business

And you don't wanna cut military spending ?

How is that gonna work exactly ?

 

[greg334]

Rlent,
I know I know... There isn't much of a difference. But the national sales tax that is talked about is also being spun as the vat tax in some parts of the media (Fox).

Diva,
A couple years ago I went through and kept super records of everything I bought or had done.

Using the fair tax ideas, adjusting some of the prices for the additional 24% and then taking my business expenses out of the mix, I ended up with a bigger net while paying just under what I paid the year before in income taxes and this was without the pre-bates added in.

The advantage for me is;

I don't have to worry about paying to get a tax return done. My cost will go from $450 a year for tax services to zero - I can buy that 32 LED TV now

I don't have to keep receipts on ever little thing or have to deal with the 10 1099s I get in January.

I don't have to pay the tax on my business items (fuel, tires, parts, supplies, etc..). This alone is a simple show my business license at the time of purchase.

My wife and I actually see the money we both earn.

I only pay for new items and services. Used stuff doesn't have the tax applied.

The disadvantages to me are;

I pay the tax on medical expenses which isn't really a big deal.

I pay more for gas for the cars.

For us, it works out rather well. For my father, it would be a big help and for everyone else it would put more money to work quickly.

AND for those who think this will spur a black market type thing, think again. A national sales tax will do more to get a black market growing than anything else.

 

[bobwg]

6% will not cover the revenue, there is a serious downfall with a national sales tax and nothing else.

I don't want any flat tax, I pay enough now and this will increase my tax burden enough. Flat tax would work only if it is actually applied fairly which it would not be.

Look at the Fair Tax which is a consumption tax that seems to be better than a national sales tax. It applies across the board 24% tax that replaces the income tax, social security related taxes and corporate taxes and if it is done, the price adjustment to lower the initial prices by the 24% will be more of a competitive move to attract sales than any other reason. Beside in this business, my legit business expenses would not have that 24% tacked on.

ok I stand corrected the correct term is fair tax which is like a sales tax on goods and services yes lets got with the fair tax

 

[dieseldiva]

If my understanding of the VAT tax is correct, we don't want anything to do with that one......isn't it a tax all through the process therefore making it very easy for add ons with no way for us to know what is what?? (probably not worded well)

 

[RLENT]

I know I know... there isn't much of a difference.

There isn't any difference whatsoever .... beyond any peripheral issues (Social Security, etc) that those writing the actual bills choose to address in the proposed law ....

The Fair Tax is, in fact, a National Retail Sales Retail Tax ... and that is a fact .... to say otherwise is just a misrepresentation of fact ......

And it isn't something anyone should shy away from .... and apparently the fair tax folks aren't ...... ('bout time they wised up ...)

The idea of national retail sales tax was a very popular thing ..... long before the Fair Tax was ever twinkle in Leo Linbeck's eyes ......

But the national sales tax that is talked about is also being spun as the vat tax in some parts of the media (Fox).

Yeah ..... the media has a way of trying to spin things as other than they actually are ..... it's their modus operandi ....

Media "spin" is not the same thing as reality .....

 

[dieseldiva]

For added info...... but it's STILL just opinion...

 

[RLENT]

If my understanding of the VAT tax is correct, we don't want anything to do with that one ......

Yup - absolutely true

isn't it a tax all through the process therefore making it very easy for add ons with no way for us to know what is what?? (probably not worded well)

That's more or less correct - however just understand that just because someone (in the media) says something is, or would be, a VAT tax doesn't necessarily mean that it is ......

Various bills for a national retail sales tax have been put forth by a variety of Congressmen (Rep. Dan Schaefer, Rep. Bill Archer, Sen. Richard Lugar, Rep. Billy Tauzin, Rep. Jim DeMint, and others) for a long time ..... none of them - that I'm aware of - were VAT taxes .....

 

[bobwg]

And you don't wanna cut military spending ?

How is that gonna work exactly ?

maybe I am to low with the 6% maybe the 24 % is what we need but I would close and dump all Federal agencies except the Military ,CIA, and FBI and INS turn highways,education , welfare etc over to the states with maybe a 1 time federal funding of say a years worth of money after the year the states come up with the money for their own state programs

 

[witness23]

That's more or less correct - however just understand that just because someone (in the media) says something is, or would be, a VAT tax doesn't necessarily mean that it is ...

You put that in a much nicer way than I ever could. Bravo. Your patience is commended.