Sprinter running rough after injector change.

Charles Savoie · Dec 20, 2015

Hello,
I own an 05 sprinter with the 2.7 liter 5 cylinder motor. It has 180000 thousand miles on it and recently had 4 injectors replaced due to leakage. Nothing too bad only one had allot of "coke" around it. Still ran well just some smell in the cabin that alerted me to the problem. I took it into the local Mercedes dealer who replaced 4 injectors claimed the 5th was still good. When I picked up the van it was running very differently. Didn't smoothly zip through the gears like normal but seemed to be "chugging" more at about 2200 rpm on up there is now a very different vibration and sound from the motor. No longer the smooth motor I love and live with. It also has more black soot coming out at idle. When I told the tech that worked on it about this he said the other injector probably needs to be changed. That doesn't make any sense to me. It seems like something is wrong with the work he did since it was running well before the replacements. Any help sure would be appreciated!

Turtle · Dec 20, 2015

The ONE with "coke" around it is the ONE that was leaking and would have been the ONLY injector that needed to be changed so changing out 4 of them doesn't make sense to me.

Take the plastic cover off the top of the engine, and with the engine running, see if there are any little puffs of smoke coming from any of the injectors. If there is, ones not seated properly. Also, use a straight edge and make sure all 5 injectors are the same depth as each other. One or more could be too deep or not enough.

It can also take 10-50 miles of driving to get any air out of the system (although I recently had all 5 injector seals replaced, including replacing two of the injectors with used injectors, and it took zero miles to get the air out).

I'd just take it back and talk to the service manager, tell him it was running smooth when you brought it in and now it's not. Tell him you want it fixed, and you'd prefer it not be done by the trial and error method of vehicle repair,since that method has already cost you about $1500 more than it should have.

Might want to ask, just out of curiosity, why 4 injectors were replaced, instead of reusing them, for one leaking seal. Sometimes when you pull an injector it doesn't come out clean, so it has to be disassembled to get it out and can't be reused,, and that could happen with all 4 of them, but then, why 4 for one leaking seal?

OntarioVanMan · Dec 21, 2015

Turtle said:
The ONE with "coke" around it is the ONE that was leaking and would have been the ONLY injector that needed to be changed so changing out 4 of them doesn't make sense to me.

Take the plastic cover off the top of the engine, and with the engine running, see if there are any little puffs of smoke coming from any of the injectors. If there is, ones not seated properly. Also, use a straight edge and make sure all 5 injectors are the same depth as each other. One or more could be too deep or not enough.

It can also take 10-50 miles of driving to get any air out of the system (although I recently had all 5 injector seals replaced, including replacing two of the injectors with used injectors, and it took zero miles to get the air out).

I'd just take it back and talk to the service manager, tell him it was running smooth when you brought it in and now it's not. Tell him you want it fixed, and you'd prefer it not be done by the trial and error method of vehicle repair,since that method has already cost you about $1500 more than it should have.

Might want to ask, just out of curiosity, why 4 injectors were replaced, instead of reusing them, for one leaking seal. Sometimes when you pull an injector it doesn't come out clean, so it has to be disassembled to get it out and can't be reused,, and that could happen with all 4 of them, but then, why 4 for one leaking seal?

I was going to say I once had an injector ring go....and caught it in time....but only in about 2,000 miles it already had coking or soot around it......99 cents for O ring $45.00 labor...sometimes coking or soot it MAY not be the injector itself.....watch for the rip job...

Turtle · Dec 21, 2015

Sometimes injectors fail and they just don't work anymore, even when there's no Black Death present. The inline 5's will still run pretty good on 4 cylinders. In my case, the two injectors that were replaced with used one, one was no longer working (no idea for how long) and the other couldn't be saved when it was removed to replace the seal. A small percentage of Sprinter injectors get stuck in there really good, due to moisture down in there when they assembled the engine. Rainy day or something. High humidity. Of my five, two couldn't be saved because they were stuck and had to be taken apart to get out. One was this most recent time, and the other was several years ago.

Charles Savoie · Dec 21, 2015

Thanks for the responce guys! I am going to bring it back for sure! The tech mensioned timing the injectors to the ecm and that each injector has its own code is that true and could that be the issue/

OntarioVanMan · Dec 21, 2015

Charles Savoie said:
Thanks for the responce guys! I am going to bring it back for sure! The tech mensioned timing the injectors to the ecm and that each injector has its own code is that true and could that be the issue/

my question would be: IF he mentioned that.....WHY didn't he set it up right to begin with instead of shooing you out the door?.....Good luck Ken aka OVM

Turtle · Dec 21, 2015

Charles Savoie said:
Thanks for the responce guys! I am going to bring it back for sure! The tech mensioned timing the injectors to the ecm and that each injector has its own code is that true and could that be the issue/

Uhm, well, yeah, each injector has it's own code. From front to back the codes are 1, 2, 3, 4, 5.

The electrical connector on the injector has two pins. One pin is connected to the battery through the ignition relay and the other pin goes to the ECM. The ECM sends a pulsing ground to the injector, which closes the circuit, providing the injector's solenoid with current. The magnet on top of the plunger is attracted to the solenoid's magnetic field, opening the valve. Since there is high pressure in the rail, opening the valve sends fuel at a high velocity through the injector's spray tip. The duration that the valve is open- and consequently the amount of fuel sent into the cylinder- depends on the pulse width (i.e. how long the ECM sends the ground signal to the injector).

The ECM determines that information (the timing) based on the ridiculous cornucopia of sensors like the Mass Airflow Sensor (MAF), the accelerator pedal position sensor, the Manifold Absolute Pressure sensor (MAP), air intake temp sensor, O2 sensor, and probably a fart sensor.

If you install 5 injectors and suddenly decide you want to swap out 1 and 4, the ECM won't know the difference. The codes from front to back will still be 1, 2, 3, 4, 5.

Back several years ago when one of my injector seals went, we replaced that one seal (and the injector because it couldn't be saved). Didn't touch any of the others. A few weeks ago when I had another one go (actually, it went more than a year ago, but I didn't get it replaced until a few weeks ago), I had him go ahead and replace all 5 seals since I've got 644,000 miles on the engine. One of them couldn't be saved and was replaced, and one wasn't functioning at all, so it was replaced. But in reality, only the one seal needed to be replaced, and the failed injector, of course. The chances of 2 injectors going bad at the same time is about the same as winning the lottery. Four of them going bad and the engine still running? Newp. I think you had 3 injectors and seals replaced that didn't need to be replaced, and I'm betting the one he didn't replace was #5, the one in the way-back-there that's a PITA to get to.

There's nothing wrong with having 4 new injectors and seals. It's just that you probably didn't need the other 3 replaced just yet. It could be they were a little clogged and rather than clean them he figured might as well replace them. They could have waited a while, or maybe never. But with 4 brand new injectors, that thing should be running smooth.

OntarioVanMan · Dec 21, 2015

Turtle said:
Uhm, well, yeah, each injector has it's own code. From front to back the codes are 1, 2, 3, 4, 5.

The electrical connector on the injector has two pins. One pin is connected to the battery through the ignition relay and the other pin goes to the ECM. The ECM sends a pulsing ground to the injector, which closes the circuit, providing the injector's solenoid with current. The magnet on top of the plunger is attracted to the solenoid's magnetic field, opening the valve. Since there is high pressure in the rail, opening the valve sends fuel at a high velocity through the injector's spray tip. The duration that the valve is open- and consequently the amount of fuel sent into the cylinder- depends on the pulse width (i.e. how long the ECM sends the ground signal to the injector).

The ECM determines that information (the timing) based on the ridiculous cornucopia of sensors like the Mass Airflow Sensor (MAF), the accelerator pedal position sensor, the Manifold Absolute Pressure sensor (MAP), air intake temp sensor, O2 sensor, and probably a fart sensor.

If you install 5 injectors and suddenly decide you want to swap out 1 and 4, the ECM won't know the difference. The codes from front to back will still be 1, 2, 3, 4, 5.

Back several years ago when one of my injector seals went, we replaced that one seal (and the injector because it couldn't be saved). Didn't touch any of the others. A few weeks ago when I had another one go (actually, it went more than a year ago, but I didn't get it replaced until a few weeks ago), I had him go ahead and replace all 5 seals since I've got 644,000 miles on the engine. One of them couldn't be saved and was replaced, and one wasn't functioning at all, so it was replaced. But in reality, only the one seal needed to be replaced, and the failed injector, of course. The chances of 2 injectors going bad at the same time is about the same as winning the lottery. Four of them going bad and the engine still running? Newp. I think you had 3 injectors and seals replaced that didn't need to be replaced, and I'm betting the one he didn't replace was #5, the one in the way-back-there that's a PITA to get to.

There's nothing wrong with having 4 new injectors and seals. It's just that you probably didn't need the other 3 replaced just yet. It could be they were a little clogged and rather than clean them he figured might as well replace them. They could have waited a while, or maybe never. But with 4 brand new injectors, that thing should be running smooth.

that was my thinking...in 696,000 mile I never had an injector fail....just that 1 seal replaced....
but I don't idle as much as Turtle does which might be a factor in the difference...

Turtle · Dec 21, 2015

I idle to recharge batteries, 'cause I don't have a generator. The last 2 or 3 months I've idled a lot. A lot. The battery bank has been on it's last leg for a while. Just turning on the inverter and computer would cause the voltage to drop to well below even 12.0 volts.

Went to Staab Battery in Hazelwood last Monday and replaced the 4 batteries. All is right with the world again.

Charles Savoie · Dec 21, 2015

You guys are great! Any of you put an air ride seat in? I did that mod about 5 years back and love it! Put a national brand seat with compressor in and what a diffrence can put a 14 hour day in no problem now! Also repainted mine. Whats up with the crap paint job? What year did they start preping the metal well?

xiggi · Dec 21, 2015

I installed an air ride a couple months ago. A bergstrom sprint ride.

greasytshirt · Dec 22, 2015

Charles Savoie said:
Whats up with the crap paint job? What year did they start preping the metal well?

The quality of the metal appeared to be an issue. We've fixed large areas of rust on several.

ysracer · Dec 23, 2015

Turtle said:
Uhm, well, yeah, each injector has it's own code. From front to back the codes are 1, 2, 3, 4, 5.

The electrical connector on the injector has two pins. One pin is connected to the battery through the ignition relay and the other pin goes to the ECM. The ECM sends a pulsing ground to the injector, which closes the circuit, providing the injector's solenoid with current. The magnet on top of the plunger is attracted to the solenoid's magnetic field, opening the valve. Since there is high pressure in the rail, opening the valve sends fuel at a high velocity through the injector's spray tip. The duration that the valve is open- and consequently the amount of fuel sent into the cylinder- depends on the pulse width (i.e. how long the ECM sends the ground signal to the injector).

The ECM determines that information (the timing) based on the ridiculous cornucopia of sensors like the Mass Airflow Sensor (MAF), the accelerator pedal position sensor, the Manifold Absolute Pressure sensor (MAP), air intake temp sensor, O2 sensor, and probably a fart sensor.

If you install 5 injectors and suddenly decide you want to swap out 1 and 4, the ECM won't know the difference. The codes from front to back will still be 1, 2, 3, 4, 5.

Back several years ago when one of my injector seals went, we replaced that one seal (and the injector because it couldn't be saved). Didn't touch any of the others. A few weeks ago when I had another one go (actually, it went more than a year ago, but I didn't get it replaced until a few weeks ago), I had him go ahead and replace all 5 seals since I've got 644,000 miles on the engine. One of them couldn't be saved and was replaced, and one wasn't functioning at all, so it was replaced. But in reality, only the one seal needed to be replaced, and the failed injector, of course. The chances of 2 injectors going bad at the same time is about the same as winning the lottery. Four of them going bad and the engine still running? Newp. I think you had 3 injectors and seals replaced that didn't need to be replaced, and I'm betting the one he didn't replace was #5, the one in the way-back-there that's a PITA to get to.

There's nothing wrong with having 4 new injectors and seals. It's just that you probably didn't need the other 3 replaced just yet. It could be they were a little clogged and rather than clean them he figured might as well replace them. They could have waited a while, or maybe never. But with 4 brand new injectors, that thing should be running smooth.

Not true, the '05 does have coded injectors. Each has a unique # sequence that should be provided to the ecm via DRB lll or DAD unit. These numbers are based on injector flow and the ecm uses this info to fine tune fuel trim, unique to each cylinder. This optimizes power and efficiency.

That said, it's not going to fix the problem. It's a very minor adjustment.