Skirts

TeamCaffee

Administrator
Staff member
Owner/Operator
Kicking around the idea of adding skirts to our truck from the steps to the back and would like some input.

One way is to use the same sheeting and cover the belly boxes and lift panels to get into the belly boxes.... This brings up a problem of how to hold down the skirts tight so they do not flap. I thought of a pin and cotter pin configuration.

Another is to skirt in between the belly boxes clear to the back of the truck. This seems ragged to me but it might be the best solution.

Any thoughts you guys might have?
 

aquitted

Veteran Expediter
Retired Expediter
Sorry cant't help you on the mounting but what kind of M.P.G. gain could you get? I would rather have belly box's going down each side of the box more room for souvnears and stuff. how much gain do the semi's get with those skirts?
 

scottm4211

Veteran Expediter
Owner/Operator
I've heard on a ST it may cause a problem with cooling of rear brakes. No clue but worth checking.
 

ATeam

Senior Member
Retired Expediter
In the Expediters section of Hank's Truck Pictures Forum, you can see this photo of a straight truck with sleeper that has skirts. I've seen these trucks running in New York. The skirts serve their purpose, I would think, but do not blend well with the rest of the truck.
 

Dynamite 1

Moderator
Staff member
Fleet Owner
if i was going to do them, i would do them from the boxes back to the axle. then maybe finish in back of the axle with another set of boxes.

as far as mounting them. i would go with aircraft grade aluminum angle configured in a " u " shape with an angle brace for rigidity. i would then use correct length studs on the brackets and flush cap head nuts to hold on the skirts.

we thought of this a few years ago. had my local shop mock up some plans, but in our case the extra weight, which wasnt alot, wasnt rite for us since we are heavy to begin with. plus the extra cost of painting the darn things added to the decision not to also. for you though, paint and the weight wouldnt be an issue. is it really worth doing though. that is the ?.
 

TeamCaffee

Administrator
Staff member
Owner/Operator
if i was going to do them, i would do them from the boxes back to the axle. then maybe finish in back of the axle with another set of boxes.

as far as mounting them. i would go with aircraft grade aluminum angle configured in a " u " shape with an angle brace for rigidity. i would then use correct length studs on the brackets and flush cap head nuts to hold on the skirts.

we thought of this a few years ago. had my local shop mock up some plans, but in our case the extra weight, which wasnt alot, wasnt rite for us since we are heavy to begin with. plus the extra cost of painting the darn things added to the decision not to also. for you though, paint and the weight wouldnt be an issue. is it really worth doing though. that is the ?.

Tom the skirts have to open due to the belly boxes which is what caused the dilemma. We have boxes behind the axle.

One of the issues is to figure out what they need to be built out of and as always how will they look.

The lift gate seems as if it is a huge parachute under the truck.

Until we can figure out what we want and how it will be build we do not know if it is worth it. The T/T people who own their own trailer and have added skirts have seen an significant gain in fuel mileage.
 

OntarioVanMan

Retired Expediter
Owner/Operator
Tom the skirts have to open due to the belly boxes which is what caused the dilemma. We have boxes behind the axle.

One of the issues is to figure out what they need to be built out of and as always how will they look.

The lift gate seems as if it is a huge parachute under the truck.

Until we can figure out what we want and how it will be build we do not know if it is worth it. The T/T people who own their own trailer and have added skirts have seen an significant gain in fuel mileage.

Linda...could an underbody air deflector attached to the box...of some design work for the tailgate issue? Under mounted air tabs maybe?
 

BigCat

Expert Expediter
Schneider said they gained 3% increase and this was in the testing phase.

I don't see a use honestly. 3% for the kind of trouble to keep the clean and damage free.
 

ATeam

Senior Member
Retired Expediter
The T/T people who own their own trailer and have added skirts have seen an significant gain in fuel mileage.

What people exactly, and what do you mean by "significant?" I have seen some real-world driver reports of a modest improvement but those are not universal.
 
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OntarioVanMan

Retired Expediter
Owner/Operator
What people exactly, and what do you mean by "significant?" I have seen some reports of a modest improvement but those are not universal.
I don't think a city/local would see much at all of an improvement...now a highway trailer yes...and couple that with the single wide tire....I see some of the OTR carriers dabbling in single wide even the Feds are using them...
 

TeamCaffee

Administrator
Staff member
Owner/Operator
If we can save 3% a year on a fuel bill of $56,000 that would be a savings of $1680 dollars I can see that being worth the time to investigate the savings.

The O/O that I know who own their own their trailer with skirts take very good care of them and they look as good as new.

That is a consideration with the skirts is how low do you go before causing a problem getting into some docks?
 
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ATeam

Senior Member
Retired Expediter
If we can save 3% a year on a fuel bill of $56,000 that would be a savings of $1680 dollars I can see that being worth the time to investigate the savings.

That is true, of course. And if you could save 5% a year, the money saved would be even more and if you could save even 2% a year, you would save money. All true by definition.

But the real question is, CAN you save 3% a year? Do you know of anyone out there in the real world who has actually done so by doing nothing more than adding trailer skirts on a tractor-trailer rig? I know of none. It would be big news, would it not, if 3% fuel savings were really possible? Word would spread through the truck stops and drivers would be lining up to realize that kind of benefit.

What I see happening instead is our good friends in California succeeding in pushing yet another mandate through, and that is the reason trailer skirts are appearing. A modest improvement in fuel economy may be realized, which is all that matters to the regulators, regardless of the time and money required to install, deal with and maintain trailer skirts. So what if it places a burden on owner-operators? The environment is all that matters.
 

BigCat

Expert Expediter
I have a friend that drives for Mesilla Valley Transport and they were one of the first to use the trailer tail and skirts, he said they went over numbers with each product installed and they gained a pretty nice amount when the added the skirts with the trailer tails. They also had to get drivers to adjust driving habits and they gained about .2 of a mpg per truck. It doesnt seem like alot but when you have a thousand trucks or more it is a good bit.
 

Turtle

Administrator
Staff member
Retired Expediter
Fleets who do not operate at all in California are getting trailer skirts. They certainly aren't doing so because of CARB. Some are doing it, along with low rolling resistance tires, nitrogen and/or pressure monitoring systems, and other improvements to be EPA Smartway Certified. Others are doing it simply to realize the 3-7% increase in fuel economy that results.

The initial cost, plus the cost of repair and maintaining the skirts is a serious consideration, as they are right there down in it, so to speak, and are subject to a lot of wear and tear from road hazards to drop-down docks.

The CARB regulations are nearly verbatim of the EPA's Smartway program, which exempts trailers shorter than 53-feet, straight trucks, trailers that travel less than 50,000 miles per year, those who stay with 100 miles of their terminal, and several other exemptions. The exemptions are due largely to not seeing as much of an improvement in aerodynamic resistance, and in the cost-benefit analysis of skirting exempt vehicles. To skirt a straight truck, the initial cost and the maintenance and downtime for repair must be considered. A 3% increase is awesome, but not so much if you lose 5% due to downtime and repair costs. Missing a single $5000 load while down for repair can negate all the benefits of a skirted straight truck, so any skirting will have to be up front, and durable enough to require very little maintenance, I would think.

Frankly, you're likely to see a better return on a straight truck with Air Tabs than you will ever see with skirting.
 

ATeam

Senior Member
Retired Expediter
Fleets who do not operate at all in California are getting trailer skirts. They certainly aren't doing so because of CARB. Some are doing it, along with low rolling resistance tires, nitrogen and/or pressure monitoring systems, and other improvements to be EPA Smartway Certified. Others are doing it simply to realize the 3-7% increase in fuel economy that results.

The initial cost, plus the cost of repair and maintaining the skirts is a serious consideration, as they are right there down in it, so to speak, and are subject to a lot of wear and tear from road hazards to drop-down docks.

The CARB regulations are nearly verbatim of the EPA's Smartway program, which exempts trailers shorter than 53-feet, straight trucks, trailers that travel less than 50,000 miles per year, those who stay with 100 miles of their terminal, and several other exemptions. The exemptions are due largely to not seeing as much of an improvement in aerodynamic resistance, and in the cost-benefit analysis of skirting exempt vehicles. To skirt a straight truck, the initial cost and the maintenance and downtime for repair must be considered. A 3% increase is awesome, but not so much if you lose 5% due to downtime and repair costs. Missing a single $5000 load while down for repair can negate all the benefits of a skirted straight truck, so any skirting will have to be up front, and durable enough to require very little maintenance, I would think.

Frankly, you're likely to see a better return on a straight truck with Air Tabs than you will ever see with skirting.

I have seen the 3% to 7% figures widely cited by skirt manufacturers, regulators with a self-justification agenda and fleets that have a desire to look good in the eyes of the EPA and CARB. But what about real-world sources? Who is out there actually driving skirted trailers that rave about the same 3% to 7%?

Until I see a convincing number of real-world reports from the people who actually drive skirted trailers, I will remain skeptical of the 3% to 7% figure.

By the way, Linda, the lift gate parachute effect you describe can be solved by going to a rail mounted lift gate that folds up behind the door instead of under the truck body. It has its own set of trade-offs but depending on how much squeezing out every possible drop of fuel savings matters to you, it may be an option to consider.

As a practical matter, Turtle states well the cost/benefit considerations of any fuel-economy add-on.
 
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Turtle

Administrator
Staff member
Retired Expediter
I have seen the 3% to 7% figures widely cited by skirt manufacturers, regulators with a self-justification agenda and fleets that have a desire to look good in the eyes of the EPA and CARB. But what about real-world sources? Who is out there actually driving skirted trailers that rave about the same 3% to 7%?

Until I see a convincing number of real-world reports from the people who actually drive skirted trailers, I will remain skeptical of the 3% to 7% figure.
Well, just a basic knowledge of aerodynamics should tell you that there will be an improvement. A Gap Fairing alone or Air Tabs on the side of the tractor can add 2% to your fuel economy. The same knowledge should tell you that ridiculous claims of 10-20% would be unlikely. The most notable exemption of tractor-trailers traveling less than 50,000 miles a year should tell you that significant time spent at lower speeds and shorter distances doesn't get you much benefit, and that longer distance and higher speeds is where you will see the most benefits, which is perfectly in line with the aerodynamics. The question is, how much?

Testing by several third parties, including NASA in their wind tunnels, and testing at the Lawrence Livermore Laboratory show a consistent increase in aerodynamics of skirted trailers across the board of five percent. That five percent increase in aerodynamics translates to between 3-7% increase in fuel economy depending on speeds and distances traveled. So this is an aerodynamic benefit, like Air Tabs, which will yield very small results, if any, at low wind resistance speeds and distances. It's much like the benefits of nitrogen or low rolling resistance tires, where the benefits are minimal over time at short distances, but are greatly increased with distance.

Clearly, the trailers driving closer to 50,000 miles a year are going to be closer to the 3% figure, while those traveling 125,000 or more will see a higher percentage, and team trailers will see an even greater number. Schneider reports 3%, but they report an overall change in the fleet, not in the individual trailers with skirts, so that's likely to be on the low end. Walmart reports 6%. Con-Way reports 5% on their trailers with skirts, so does C.R. England, US Xpress, and Fremont Contract Carriers. But even using the most conservative figure of 3%, that can mean tens of thousands of dollars over the live of a trailer, in many cases literally paying for the trailer itself.

Con-Way, Pepsico and a few others are also also experimenting with a base system that includes side skirting and something called an "under-tray" that is a fairing under the trailer. The under-tray system minimizes drag caused by the low-pressure wake behind the trailer and its suspension system, primarily by injecting high-energy airflow into the trailer wake, not unlike the "vortex" caused by Air tabs. The under-tray system was developed by a company called SmartTruck, in cooperation with NASA, the EPA's Oak Ridge National Laboratory facility (mainly through use of their Cray supercomputers). In the past 2 years, Con-way Truckload has installed under-tray equipment on more than 2000 trailers. They're happy so far. Con-Way Truckload has a fleetwide average MPG of 6.5, and the trailers with the combination of side and under-tray has yielded an average of 7% in fuel economy. A combination of the under-tray and side fairings, on the back edge and roof of the trailer (Air Tabs or similar), delivers a 10% improvement in MPG for Con-Way and Pepsico. Using super-singles adds another .75-1.0% on top of that.

The aerodynamics are real, and so are the benefits. But there are the downsides, like difficulty of maintenance, and whether or not a driver will actually crawl under the skirting to do a pre-trip inspection.

But again, these are tractors with 53' trailers, who travel long distances at highway speeds, and the achieved benefits simply are not going to translate in the same way to shorter trailers, those who don't drive as far, and to straight trucks. Knowing basic (and some advanced) aerodynamics tells me that an expedite straight truck that travels long distances will see an improvement in fuel economy with improved aerodynamics, but also knowing the aerodynamics, I would be shocked if it is even as high as 3%, which is the low end of a trailer. The math suggests that it's much closer to one percent, or slightly lower.

Then there's the cost-benefit analysis which doesn't bode well for skirted straight trucks, not only for the small increase in economy versus the repair and maintenance costs, plus down time, but the increased wear and tear from heat since side skirts and other aerodynamic technologies also block the proper flow of cool air over temperature-sensitive tires and brake systems. Side skirts are quite likely THE point of diminishing returns on a straight truck where the benefits of improved aerodynamics will cost you more in repair and maintenance of the skirt, tires and brakes, than you'll ever save in fuel.

I'm not skeptical at all about the 3-7% benefit with a trailer, but like Phil, I'd want to see some at least real-world anecdotal evidence on a straight trucks, and I'd want to see it over time to see just how well the rear tires and brakes handle such a dramatic decrease in airflow, considering they are designed specifically for a certain, proper airflow. There's no question that reducing wind resistance on any vehicle will increase fuel economy, but the cost-benefit must be strongly considered. In that context Air Tabs are certainly worth it, as is slowing down and other driver considerations, along with tires with low rolling resistance, and as much as Phil resists the notion, nitrogen. But skirts on a straight truck? I dunno about that. One new set of brakes or tires just six months earlier cancels the benefits of skirts. So does missing a good load while maintaining or repairing the skirts. Much like taking a brand new medication just approved by the FDA, this isn't one that I'd be wanting to jump into and be a part of the large scale clinical trials. I'd want to wait and see.
 

moose

Veteran Expediter
If we can save 3% a year on a fuel bill of $56,000

Love's your #'s very much, but will still questions them.
for a wild example, lets say that my gross money i spend on fuel is 75,000$ (150,000/8x4)
do i REALLY spent that money ???
is a fuel millage saving of 3% will really result in money in the bank ??
this is NOT a philosophical question, i truly wonder.
(as you probably noticed, to date i NEVER spent money on fuel saving devices).

another non philosophical question is how much gadgets investment real cost us .
foe example, lets say that an owner have a 12% loan of any kind, (or a Credit Card with 24%!)and have the option whether to spend 1,000$ on "fuel saving devices", vs closing that loan. how much those 1,000$ actually cost ?
 

The Enemy

Veteran Expediter
Linda, check out hte underside of new Landstar trailers. the have a blue plastic air deflector mounted on the belly of the trailer. Its supposed to push the Air around the rear axles. This might work with your tuck away lift gate, with a slight modification to let the driveshaft pass thru.

Also, has Henry seen any gain with the air deflectors he has mounted on the rear sides of his trailer?
 
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