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Semi/Amblance Crash 5 Dead

Doggie Daddy

Doggie Daddy

Veteran Expediter
You question whether or not the truck driver could hear the siren,as if implying that he had the right of way and that the ambulance was coming through a stop sign or stop light.

I could not tell from the story in the posted link who had the right of way,but I do know that just because an emergency vehicle has lights and siren operating does not give them the right to blast through intersections with or without having the right of way.

All to often the press is quick to try and blame the truck drivers in accidents like this (in fairness the Toledo blade article did not do this)and not look at the complete picture.DD.
 
redytrk

redytrk

Veteran Expediter
Charter Member
>You question whether or not the truck driver could hear the
>siren,as if implying that he had the right of way and that
>the ambulance was coming through a stop sign or stop light.
>
I imply no such thing.Clearly the ambulance has the right of way.My question is about the noise levels a driver is exposed to by the diesel engine. I don`t think truck mfg care about sound reduction for the driver.
 
Doggie Daddy

Doggie Daddy

Veteran Expediter
>I imply no such thing.Clearly the ambulance has the right of
>way.My question is about the noise levels a driver is
>exposed to by the diesel engine. I don`t think truck mfg
>care about sound reduction for the drive.

I don't want to argue with you rdytrk,but nowhere in the article does it say who had the right of way but you say that the ambulance "clearly" has the right of way.

Speaking as a former firefighter in Ohio for 12 years,I know that operating a emergency vehicle with lights and siren does not give you the right of way.The function of lights and sirens is to warn of approaching emergency vehicles and ASKING for the right of way.

A driver of an emergency vehicle should never expect that everyone has seen or heard his aproach to the intersection,and should be prepared for that situation.DD.
 
Tennesseahawk

Tennesseahawk

Veteran Expediter
>A driver of an emergency vehicle should never EXPECT that
>everyone has seen or heard his aproach to the
>intersection,and should be prepared for that situation.DD.

I think the right word in this case is ASSUME.

-Vampire Super Slooth Trucker!!!
 
pelicn

pelicn

Veteran Expediter
In a former life, hubby and I were with a fire dept in SC. In our case, DD is correct in saying that just because an emergency vehicle is running lights and or sirens, does not automatically give "right of way". This is a tragic situation for all concerned, and it's refreshing to see that the Toledo Blade reported the details without placing automatic blame on the semi driver.
 
F

flatbedin

Seasoned Expediter
The corner in question has corn on all four corners.. Anyone coming down a rural country road where corn is planted on all corners knows that it doesn't matter if you loudest horn in the world, it's hard for the sound to transfer around 10 ft. high corn.. The truck driver had the right away,,, and with and emergency vehicle approaching a major intersection like this in rural country... They should have yeilded..

This is an prime example of why accidents happen.. It is just that, and accident.. How would you like to be the truck driver that has to live the rest of his life knowing that all he was doing is his job, and he killed five people??

Funny thing is the article doesn't say anything about the "whole" story.. Which would be a young kid that his liscence was suspended and was drinking orginally hit the couple that was being transported in the ambulance.. And the kid that was drinking was not hurt at all, and never even went to the hospital.. Talk about ruining a lot of peoples day????
 
spudhead911

spudhead911

Seasoned Expediter
>You question whether or not the truck driver could hear the
>siren,as if implying that he had the right of way and that
>the ambulance was coming through a stop sign or stop light.
>
>I could not tell from the story in the posted link who had
>the right of way,but I do know that just because an
>emergency vehicle has lights and siren operating does not
>give them the right to blast through intersections with or
>without having the right of way.
>
>All to often the press is quick to try and blame the truck
>drivers in accidents like this (in fairness the Toledo blade
>article did not do this)and not look at the complete
>picture.DD.

Spudhead911
I know from being a Firefighter for 25 yrs. and a lieutenant for 8 years, that acccordeing to DOT an emergency vehicle must be going at a speed allowing them to be able to come to a full stop at intersections and traffic signals. Emergency vehicle operators and the cities and townships they belong to can be held lieble (spelling) for damages and deaths/injuries they cause by not following the DOT rules.
 
greg334

greg334

Veteran Expediter
OK, I don't think that you can hear a siren approaching from the rear in my truck with the radio up half way - already been caught off guard with one that came up on me - me bad.

But with that said, at an angle (perpendicular) it is a different case and with the noise in the cab it is hard to determine if someone can actually hear the siren.

In addition to this, there is another mitigating factor, the siren itself. Many emergency vehicles don't use a traditional siren (caged fan style) but a speaker system and they are sometimes mounted pointing toward the sides or ground (I saw one that was actually in the grill pointing up into the hood). This has a great effect on how the sound travels and where it travels at the speed that emergency vehicles sometimes travel at.

As for how is at fault for this accident, I do put most of the blame on the driver of the ambulance, it is his job to ensure he operates safely at all times in all types of traffic. Also after reading a bunch of articles on this, I do not see anywhere why they were running the stop sign or why the signals were used because there is a mention that both the passengers were patients.

I was witness to an accident with an ambulance in 2003 while going to PA. The driver was whizzing down US30 with everything on, passing me at 85. An old man pulled out on the other side of the hill which the ambulance hit square in the rear after he crested the hill. I later found out that they were transporting some kid from a hospital somewhere near Gettysburg to some place near St Thomas - no need for the sirens or lights or speeding but because they were an "Ambulance" they wanted to get there in a hurry.
 
M

markafd

Expert Expediter
As a career firefighter in Ohio for almost 20yrs I must ad my thoughts. A emergency vehicles may proceed throught red light or stop sign after assuring it is o.k. to do so while operating both there emergency lights and siren. The flip side to this is even if they check or not before proceeding through if you are the poor chump who hits them 9 out of 10 times you will be cited for failure to yield to an emergency vehicle. This is not always the correct thing to happen but it does, I have seen a lot of emergency vehicle operators and truck drivers who get tunnel vision and see and hear only what they want to. Always scan ahead of you and check your mirrors be it in city traffic or lonly country roads. Everyone losses in this accident some worse than others. Drive Safely!
 
Tennesseahawk

Tennesseahawk

Veteran Expediter
Kinda off topic here, but...

Remember the helicopter crash killing 4, as they were following a police chase for a story? Using the mentality of charging the driver for the helicopter crash, they could do the same thing in this case. Charge the kid for causing the first accident, then charge him for this accident since he was the cause behind the victims being in the ambulance.

Sound rediculous? Thought so.

-Vampire Super Slooth Trucker!!!
 
D

dieseldoctor1

Expert Expediter
http://toledoblade.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20070724/NEWS01/70724001

The other part of the story. This piece states: The ambulance slammed into the truck driver’s door, near the back of the cab, breaking the fuel tank and spilling diesel fuel. The rig caught fire.

Little bit different from: Three emergency medical workers and two of their patients were killed last night when their ambulance was struck broadside by a tractor-trailer and burst into flames in northwestern Paulding County, the Ohio Highway Patrol said.

Wonder which is accurate?

Dieseldoctor
 
R

roadweazel

Expert Expediter
This happened in Fairfield, oh(north of Cincinnati) Aug. 06

http://cms.firehouse.com/web/online/News/Ohio-Firefighter-Charged-In-Fatal-Apparatus-Crash/46$51334

to quote the report
"The report said that a device designed to turn all intersection lights red as emergency vehicles approach failed to work."

"But police said the law requires public safety vehicle operators proceeding past a red signal to operate with due regard for the safety of all persons using the street."
 
B

BigBuzd1

Expert Expediter
I'm not sure how old you are to consider a 49 yo man a kid...but shhhh...you don't wanna show your age that much. :)

It was a 49 yr old man who had been convicted in '79 of DUI...last yr he refused to submit to a B.A.T. which automatically suspends his license..." He pleaded not guilty yesterday through his attorney in Paulding County Court on charges of operating a vehicle while under the influence of alcohol, failure to drive within assured clear distance, and driving with a suspended license in connection with the recent accident. " This not-guilty plea was in connection to his charges LAST year...not in conjunction with this recent crash.


The 15 yr old boy was the son of the elderly(now deceased)parents whom he was driving for...he had his learners permit and was rear-ended by the 49 yo male.

The big rig, in one story, had reportedly broadsided the ambulance causing the ambulance to burst into flames...NOT TRUE!! The T/T was in the midst of a right turn when the 64 yr old ambulance driver blew through a stop sign(which he should never have done), striking the rig on the drivers side fuel tank, rupturing the tank, which burst into flames.

Please guys and gals...I just had to clear this up because I saw several different versions of it right here in this thread.

My prayers go out to all involved in these 2 crashes.
 
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