Scary, VERY Scary

[layoutshooter]

IF all is as reported this is a VERY scary event in our Nation. Imagine, being arrested for refusing to remove or turn a T-shirt inside out. OH, excuse me, not for the shirt, it was for "disrupting an educational process and obstructing an officer". Wasting the police for this? So much for the First Amendment. So much for the Second Amendment, which it would seem the entire flap may have really been about. So much for freedom.

I was happy to read that when this kid went back to school he wore the same shirt again, along with several of his friends that wore similar shirts.

I will be following this one VERY closely.




[h=1]W.Va. teen arrested in T-shirt flap back in class[/h]
CHARLESTON, W.Va. (AP) — A West Virginia teenager returned to class Monday wearing the same National Rifle Association T-shirt that led to his suspension and arrest after he refused a teacher's order last week to remove it.


Other students across Logan County wore similar shirts, which display the NRA logo and a hunting rifle, to school in a show of support for 14-year-old Jared Marcum, said his lawyer Ben White.


White said school officials told him on Monday that Marcum's one-day suspension was appropriate because the Logan Middle School eighth-grader was being disruptive. White disputed that position, saying Marcum was exercising his free speech rights and did not disrupt anything.


"Their version is that the suspension was for disrupting the educational process, not the shirt," White said in a telephone interview.

"I don't see how he materially disrupted the educational process," he said.


Logan County Schools Superintendent Wilma Zigmond didn't immediately return a telephone message Monday


Marcum's stepfather, Allen Larieris, said Sunday that the teen was waiting in line in the school cafeteria last Thursday when a teacher ordered him to remove the T-shirt or turn it inside out.


White said Marcum was expressing his support for the 2nd Amendment right to bear arms by wearing the shirt, which he said did not violate the school's dress code.


"We at this point believe that Jared acted as mature as a 14-year-old child can act with the pressure that was put on him," White said.


Logan County Schools' dress code, which is posted on the school system's website, prohibits clothing and accessories that display profanity, violence, discriminatory messages or sexually suggestive phrases. Clothing displaying advertisements for any alcohol, tobacco, or drug product also is prohibited.

Logan police arrested Marcum, 14, after he was sent to the school office and again refused to remove the shirt. Marcum has said that he was arrested on charges of disrupting an educational process and obstructing an officer, though White said Monday that the Logan County prosecutor's office is reviewing the case to decide whether to proceed.


In West Virginia criminal cases involving juveniles, police file charges that they would want pursued. The prosecutor's office then decides whether to file a petition asking a judge or magistrate to allow the case to proceed, said Brian Lanham, deputy director of the West Virginia Prosecuting Attorneys Institute.


The Associated Press typically does not identify juveniles who face criminal charges, but Marcum and his family wanted his name and case known.










W.Va. teen arrested in T-shirt flap back in class

 

[Brisco]

TOTALLY DIFFERENT Version Here:

8th-Grader Arrested for Refusing to Take Off NRA T-Shirt | Fox News Insider

___________________________________________
Read the Story:

Is this a First Amendment violation, a Second Amendment violation, or a little bit of both?

Last week at a middle school in Logan, West Virginia, Jared Marcum was told by a teacher in the cafeteria to remove his NRA t-shirt or turn it inside out. When he refused, he was ordered to go to the principal's office, where he again refused, saying the shirt did not violate the school's dress code. He ended up getting arrested!

Here's more background from the Associated Press:

"When the police came, I was still talking and telling them that this was wrong, that they cannot do this, it's not against any school policy. The officer, he told me to sit down and be quiet. I said, 'No, I'm exercising my right to free speech.' I said it calmly," he said.

Police charged him with disrupting an educational process and obstructing an officer, he said.

"The only disturbance was caused by the teacher. He raised his voice," he said.

The Associated Press typically does not identify juveniles charged with crimes, but Marcum and his family wanted his name and case known.

A call to the Logan Police Department rang unanswered on Sunday and an automated message said the voice mail system was full.

Lardieri said Marcum wore the shirt during five class periods before he was ordered to remove it.

Logan County Schools' dress code, which is posted on the school system's website, prohibits clothing and accessories that display profanity, violence, discriminatory messages or sexually suggestive phrases. Clothing displaying advertisements for any alcohol, tobacco, or drug product also is prohibited.
___________________________________________________

The Kid was arrested for being a PUNK.....an Obnoxious Little S***.

I have NO Problem with the Shirt at all....and Believe he should have every right to wear the shirt to School.....BUT........I will NOT Tolerate little S***s like that who think they can talk to School Elders and Law Enforcement Officers the same way they do their 12-13-14 year old friends, and probably their parents too.

 

[xiggi]

TOTALLY DIFFERENT Version Here:

8th-Grader Arrested for Refusing to Take Off NRA T-Shirt | Fox News Insider

___________________________________________
Read the Story:

Is this a First Amendment violation, a Second Amendment violation, or a little bit of both?

Last week at a middle school in Logan, West Virginia, Jared Marcum was told by a teacher in the cafeteria to remove his NRA t-shirt or turn it inside out. When he refused, he was ordered to go to the principal's office, where he again refused, saying the shirt did not violate the school's dress code. He ended up getting arrested!

Here's more background from the Associated Press:

"When the police came, I was still talking and telling them that this was wrong, that they cannot do this, it's not against any school policy. The officer, he told me to sit down and be quiet. I said, 'No, I'm exercising my right to free speech.' I said it calmly," he said.

Police charged him with disrupting an educational process and obstructing an officer, he said.

"The only disturbance was caused by the teacher. He raised his voice," he said.

The Associated Press typically does not identify juveniles charged with crimes, but Marcum and his family wanted his name and case known.

A call to the Logan Police Department rang unanswered on Sunday and an automated message said the voice mail system was full.

Lardieri said Marcum wore the shirt during five class periods before he was ordered to remove it.

Logan County Schools' dress code, which is posted on the school system's website, prohibits clothing and accessories that display profanity, violence, discriminatory messages or sexually suggestive phrases. Clothing displaying advertisements for any alcohol, tobacco, or drug product also is prohibited.
___________________________________________________

The Kid was arrested for being a PUNK.....an Obnoxious Little S***.

I have NO Problem with the Shirt at all....and Believe he should have every right to wear the shirt to School.....BUT........I will NOT Tolerate little S***s like that who think they can talk to School Elders and Law Enforcement Officers the same way they do their 12-13-14 year old friends, and probably their parents too.

Where does it say anything even close to what you claim?

 

[scottm4211]

Get off Briscos lawn.

 

[layoutshooter]

I don't know what is true or not. There are many other sources for the story as well. I TRIED to pick the one that would be the least offensive.

I don't know what the teacher said or how the kid reacted. The kid may have been out of control, then again, so could have the teacher etc.

There are videos. With any luck it will all come out.

I did, however, teach my kids to stand up for their rights, regardless of who it was. They were taught to be polite, but firm. They also knew two other things, IF they were right, I would back them 110%. I don't care who they were up against. IF they were wrong, but polite, fine, we can help with their thinking. If they were wrong and impolite they would get their butts kicked.

Kids need to learn to stand up for their rights at a young age. There IS a proper way to do it. To not allow that is to slow down the rate at which they mature and teaches them to just knuckle under to demands, right or wrong. That is NOT a good lesson.

 

[RLENT]

Get off Briscos lawn.

...

...​

 

[LDB]

What punk? From the information given it sounds like a pretty mature student who was doing nothing wrong and who was targeted for his choice of attire. More information may bring about additional or different conclusions but that's what it sounds like so far.

 

[Moot]

What punk? From the information given it sounds like a pretty mature student who was doing nothing wrong and who was targeted for his choice of attire.

Sounds like a cause the ACLU might be interested in.

 

[Pilgrim]

What I find ironic about this incident is that it happened in Logan County, WV where the number of households owning firearms is probably near 100%. It will be interesting to see if that School Super. gets re-elected and if the teacher is driving one of the buses next year. Back in the 70s and 80s I used to travel to and through Logan quite often; it's not a part of the country to be bad-mouthing the NRA. The kid will probably be mayor of Logan someday.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Logan_County,_West_Virginia

 

[LDB]

You may be correct. The ACLU may wind up working with the school to railroad that student somehow.

 

[layoutshooter]

What I find ironic about this incident is that it happened in Logan County, WV where the number of households owning firearms is probably near 100%. It will be interesting to see if that School Super. gets re-elected and if the teacher is driving one of the buses next year. Back in the 70s and 80s I used to travel to and through Logan quite often; it's not a part of the country to be bad-mouthing the NRA. The kid will probably be mayor of Logan someday.

Logan County, West Virginia - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

One would like to think that a person that is willing to stand up for their rights would someday be mayor, or even higher. It is, however, not likely to happen. The climate in the country today assumes that this kid, and everyone like him who owns a firearm and believes in the Constitution, are criminals. They want us registered, fingerprinted and they want us investigated. I mean, heaven forbid, how awful to think that someone would want to avail themselves of a RIGHT. OH MY, how horrible can it get? Maybe it would be easier to have RIGHTS if instead of being born here he would have slithered across the border illegally. THEN he would stand a CHANCE of having rights!

 

[Tennesseahawk]

As much as I admire the kid's focus, he has no right to free speech in school. School is not a billboard sound off for your kid's agenda du joir. That is why so many schools have gone to uniform.

Having said that, if his shirt didn't break the dress code policy, then that is on the school. Also, I don't see how he was interrupting any educational process in the lunchroom, unless they now teach calculus, while the students eat their cheeseburger. But if that were my kid, he would've gotten punished for mouthing off to a cop, and possibly to a teacher, depending what was said. But arresting a kid for that? Methinks the cop forgot his Midol that morning.

 

[layoutshooter]

As much as I admire the kid's focus, he has no right to free speech in school. School is not a billboard sound off for your kid's agenda du joir. That is why so many schools have gone to uniform.

Having said that, if his shirt didn't break the dress code policy, then that is on the school. Also, I don't see how he was interrupting any educational process in the lunchroom, unless they now teach calculus, while the students eat their cheeseburger. But if that were my kid, he would've gotten punished for mouthing off to a cop, and possibly to a teacher, depending what was said. But arresting a kid for that? Methinks the cop forgot his Midol that morning.

I don't see, in any of the various articles that this kid mouthed off to anyone.

They would have likely not said a word if that had been a "ban the gun" shirt". Schools, teachers and cops should NEVER be "pushing an agenda". That would be FAR WORSE than a kid feeling a bit froggy.

Also, where else is one to learn about rights other than in school? By the time a kid is out of high school, it is too late. They are an adult and should be expected to function as one. That includes knowing and understanding ALL of their rights.

What about punishing a teacher, principle and the cop for "Mouthing off" assuming of course that the horrible shirt in question did not violate school policy?

I do believe that ALL schools should have a uniform policy, that would solve a LOT of problems, not just "agenda pushing". I also believe that most kids would benefit from not having boys and girls in the same classes. Go ahead, blast me for that, I can take it.

 

[Brisco]

Where does it say anything even close to what you claim?

I don't see, in any of the various articles that this kid mouthed off to anyone.

It's right here in the article itself..................

"When the police came, I was still talking and telling them that this was wrong, that they cannot do this, it's not against any school policy. The officer, he told me to sit down and be quiet. I said, 'No, I'm exercising my right to free speech.' I said it calmly," he said.

Kid is 14 years old.............he has NO right to "Free Speech" while at school. Teachers told him to do something..........whether he agreed with it or not............and he said NO. An Officer of the Law told him to do something...........whether he agreed with it or not............and he said NO. Therefore.......the PUNK was put in his place. And, IMO, deserved everything that came his way.............

Now.........what that CHILD should have done was abide by what he was TOLD to do by his Superiors........THE ADULTS that were in charge of him for that time period......with a "Yes Sir - - No Sir - Excuse Me Sir" mentality.......and let his parents take up the cause as to whether the shirt was appropriate attire or not.

 

[scottm4211]

You seem to have forgotten to bold and change the font size on the "I said it calmly" part. You sure you want to live in a free society?

 

[layoutshooter]

ONE, he CLAIMS he said it calmly, TWO the "adults" were DEAD WRONG in this case, assuming that the shirt did not violate dress codes.

NO one should be FORCED to "shut up" by someone who is wrong. THAT is wrong. Far too many today are professional victims due to that exact kind of "education".

Assuming the kid was right about the shirt. Assuming that he did speak calmly and politely, he did nothing wrong.

I can picture a teacher/principle/or cop up in this kids face, intimidating him into submission. I can also picture a kid mounting off. The tapes will tell the tale.

Where would you have this kid learn his rights? In the locker room? You can be SURE that, if they even teach government or civics in that school, that they are NOT taught what our freedoms are. Best he learns now that the "authorities" are opposed to the Right to own and carry a firearm in this country. Best he learns now that his rights are going to diminish unless EVERYONE starts standing up to the oppressors.

I can promise you one thing, I never kept my mouth shut. I was always polite but firm, BUT, IF I felt I was wronged, no matter WHO I felt wronged me, I spoke up. I still do and always will until some government shill shuts me up for good.

Glad to see the kid is not a coward.

 

[Brisco]

You seem to have forgotten to bold and change the font size on the "I said it calmly" part. You sure you want to live in a free society?

It doesn't matter if the CHILD said it Calmly or not...........Hell........He could've been Screaming It at the Top of his Lungs for all I care.

The CHILD was being told what to do by The Adults that were in Charge of Him during that Time.....and he was refusing to do what he was being told..........Again.........whether he agreed with it or not.

The CHILD is NOT the one in Charge during times / incidences like this................Period.

 

[Brisco]

ONE, he CLAIMS he said it calmly, TWO the "adults" were DEAD WRONG in this case, assuming that the shirt did not violate dress codes.

NO one should be FORCED to "shut up" by someone who is wrong. THAT is wrong. Far too many today are professional victims due to that exact kind of "education".

Assuming the kid was right about the shirt. Assuming that he did speak calmly and politely, he did nothing wrong.

I can picture a teacher/principle/or cop up in this kids face, intimidating him into submission. I can also picture a kid mounting off. The tapes will tell the tale.

Where would you have this kid learn his rights? In the locker room? You can be SURE that, if they even teach government or civics in that school, that they are NOT taught what our freedoms are. Best he learns now that the "authorities" are opposed to the Right to own and carry a firearm in this country. Best he learns now that his rights are going to diminish unless EVERYONE starts standing up to the oppressors.

I can promise you one thing, I never kept my mouth shut. I was always polite but firm, BUT, IF I felt I was wronged, no matter WHO I felt wronged me, I spoke up. I still do and always will until some government shill shuts me up for good.

Glad to see the kid is not a coward.

Again...............I will Repeat....................

It doesn't matter if the CHILD said it Calmly or not...........Hell........He could've been Screaming It at the Top of his Lungs for all I care.

The CHILD was being told what to do by The Adults that were in Charge of Him during that Time.....and he was refusing to do what he was being told..........Again.........whether he agreed with it or not.

The CHILD is NOT the one in Charge during times / incidences like this................Period.

 

[layoutshooter]

I want our boys to grow up to be MEN, not the emasculated little worms we have running around out there today.

 

[layoutshooter]

A little perspective. This is all, for arguments sake, assuming the story is as it seems and the kid broke no codes.

He is 14, not 3.

At 11 my one grandfather was working in a coal mine.

At 15 my other grandfather was married and had a kid.

At 15 my father was working in a coal mine.

At 12 I was earning adult wages on an adult job.

In, at the most, 4 years we may be asking this kid to lay his life on the line to defend these rights. We don't expect nor demand enough out of our children. We coddle them WAY to much and don't allow them to develop their own minds. We want to keep them "children" well past any normal age for that.

The "teacher" in this case "blew" a wonderful opportunity to "teach" this kid about rights etc, proving that he was not a "teacher" but a dictator.

The "principle" blew the same chance.

Calling in the police just proved to this kid that he is right, that the government IS trying to take away our rights.

The "teacher" SHOULD HAVE, assuming he thought the shirt was out of line. He COULD have done the following to make this a "learning experience" the kid.

"BillyJoeBob, your shirt is out of line with school dress codes" "But Mr. Goodeteacher, I don't believe it is! I believe I have a RIGHT to wear this shirt". "OK BillyJoeBob, let's work it out this way, for today, please turn around the shirt. Then I want to you research and write a paper that goes into the development of The Bill of Rights. Our freedom of speech, etc. IF you can convince me that you are wrong, I will wear the same shirt to school the next day". "This way I can get a MUCH better idea of how you are thinking on this subject, shoot, I may even be wrong."

NOW the ball is in BillJoeBob's court. Now he will learn HOW to defend his rights and why we have them.

Instead, all he learned was the feel of the jackboot on the back of his neck.

All this is assuming that there was a TEACHER in that position. It does seem that at least on the surface, there was not.