Saying "no" to cheap freight!!

Mailer · Feb 20, 2015

Re: Saying "no" to cheap freight!!

davekc: "Sins of the past are what drives much of what we see now..."
OVM: " checks and balances in the system.."

Excellent points and totally agree! Looking at a much larger picture, I believe those are pretty much sum up why it is what it is today!

coalminer · Feb 20, 2015

Overheard in the office today, a cargo van load picking up in Miami going somewhere in Louisiana 934 miles, someone bid $650 to do it.....

jjoerger · Feb 20, 2015

Why do the larger carriers keep brokering fright to the companies that are under bidding them. I understand the partner carrier concept but it seems this just helps keep the low ballers in business.

coalminer · Feb 20, 2015

jjoerger said:
Why do the larger carriers keep brokering fright to the companies that are under bidding them. I understand the partner carrier concept but it seems this just helps keep the low ballers in business.

Say they have a load they charged their customer $1000 to do, they could pay their O/O $800 to do that load or post it and get it done for $600, that's $200 more profit for them. The corporate world would say it's stupid not to do it that way.

davekc · Feb 20, 2015

That works the other way as well. I have countless times seen a carrier pay more to the outside carrier than they do their own fleet. Quite a few reasons they do this.

cheri1122 · Feb 20, 2015

coalminer said:
Say they have a load they charged their customer $1000 to do, they could pay their O/O $800 to do that load or post it and get it done for $600, that's $200 more profit for them. The corporate world would say it's stupid not to do it that way.

Those in the corporate world who value greater profit above loyalty and ethics are themselves stupid. [Affluent, but stupid.] If they don't keep their O/Os satisfied, they won't keep them at all. Maybe that works when they can find replacements easily enough, but it won't last forever, and even if it did, it's shortsighted to accept high turnover, at the cost of stability, IMO.

Murraycroexp · Feb 21, 2015

coalminer said:
Overheard in the office today, a cargo van load picking up in Miami going somewhere in Louisiana 934 miles, someone bid $650 to do it.....

Yep. We lose to bids like this every day. Not just out of tough spots like Miami. Many other cities. There seems to almost be no line anymore. Some carriers just seem to want to cover costs and maybe net a quarter a mile after hard truck expenses.

OntarioVanMan · Feb 21, 2015

Murraycroexp said:
Yep. We lose to bids like this every day. Not just out of tough spots like Miami. Many other cities. There seems to almost be no line anymore. Some carriers just seem to want to cover costs and maybe net a quarter a mile after hard truck expenses.

You see the sylectus list of carriers... There are hot shoters and regular trucking company's .... Some of them using expedite loads as back hauls ! They are happy as pie to get a paid load back home

OntarioVanMan · Feb 21, 2015

OntarioVanMan said:
You see the sylectus list of carriers... There are hot shoters and regular trucking company's .... Some of them using expedite loads as back hauls ! They are happy as pie to get a paid load back home

My meaning is....when you carriers see loads going for 50 - 60 cents....you see who they are sold to?...just the other week I was loading up besides a hot shotter from TX loading up his flat bed with 4 bins going to Laredo...and he was in 7th heaven...it he had legitimate decals of some logistics outfit specializing in the oil fields...
Guys...CEO's, it YOUR fault...YOUR Alliance at work. YOUR Sylectus..YOUR TEANNA .....to me.....just a free lunch outfit wearing ties.....YOU let them have access to the boards so YOU can sell that stuff and make a bigger profit....now down the road fast forward..it is biting you in the butt.....sorry if I don't feel sorry for you...suck it up!

just my penny in the pond....Have a great day.....Ken aka OVM

Murraycroexp · Feb 21, 2015

OntarioVanMan said:
My meaning is....when you carriers see loads going for 50 - 60 cents....you see who they are sold to?

No, it's basically a closed bid process. Except when the broker likes a carrier that isn't cheapest and offers a more favored carrier the opportunity to be the cheapest. I.e, see if they want to match. That's as open as it gets. But they don't share who is cheapest. Or they just go with a higher but more favored carrier. Which we are told is the case with many of the loads "we" run. Brokers don't like having to pry info out of carriers. You, and our other drivers, know brokers almost never have to "come to us" for load info. Hourly updates and immediate loaded and POD info is valuable to brokers.

jelliott · Feb 21, 2015

Saying "no" to cheap freight!!

Sylectus changed out of the desire to grow by the owners and venture capital companies not the original carriers. It used to be you had to have trucks, customers and a brokerage. So the idea being it all stayed in balance and carriers worked together. Today most new carriers have trucks and just want freight an being little to nothing to the table in return. That is what started supply and demand pricing issues in my humble opinion.

Teana is just a trade organization that promotes ethics, industry lobbying and education. They don't move freight.

Ragman · Feb 21, 2015

Re: Saying "no" to cheap freight!!

jelliott said:
Sylectus changed out of the desire to grow by the owners and venture capital companies not the original carriers. It used to be you had to have trucks, customers and a brokerage. So the idea being it all stayed in balance and carriers worked together. Today most new carriers have trucks and just want freight an being little to nothing to the table in return. That is what started supply and demand pricing issues in my humble opinion

Ah! There ya go. It's all about the all mighty dollar now, and not looking at the long term results.

jelliott · Feb 21, 2015

Saying "no" to cheap freight!!

Ragman said:
Ah! There ya go. It's all about the all mighty dollar now, and not looking at the long term results.

Well not having a long term sustainability plan for their companies and fleets had been an ongoing issue that we have seen in many threads on EO. Sylectus opening its doors to all didn't help but the owners of Sylectus made that call while most carrier owners fought it in vain. NLM did the same when the auto market demanded price over quality. The rise of the multi carrier model only accelerated this even more. Many companies and owner operators have failed over not understanding "sustainable" pricing and numbers. Not short term numbers but long term numbers. Their is a big difference for those who are in this for the long term.

Again this is all my opinion. I am sure their are smarter people then me and everyone brings a different perspective good or bad.

OntarioVanMan · Feb 21, 2015

Re: Saying "no" to cheap freight!!

jelliott said:
Well not having a long term sustainability plan for their companies and fleets had been an ongoing issue that we have seen in many threads on EO. Sylectus opening its doors to all didn't help but the owners of Sylectus made that call while most carrier owners fought it in vain. NLM did the same when the auto market demanded price over quality. The rise of the multi carrier model only accelerated this even more. Many companies and owner operators have failed over not understanding "sustainable" pricing and numbers. Not short term numbers but long term numbers. Their is a big difference for those who are in this for the long term.

Again this is all my opinion. I am sure their are smarter people then me and everyone brings a different perspective good or bad.

Nicely Put Mr Elliott!.....

ishipforexcellence · Feb 22, 2015

So what's the bottom line? As someone new to this as of November, am I going to be able to make a living at this as an owner operator for the next 20-30 years?

Dynamite 1 · Feb 22, 2015

ishipforexcellence said:
So what's the bottom line? As someone new to this as of November, am I going to be able to make a living at this as an owner operator for the next 20-30 years?

As long as you dont misplace your cheese !!!!!!!!

iceroadtrucker · Feb 22, 2015

Cheap freight is when the price of the freight drops in the base when fuel and tolls go up and the company looks around and says your getting the same price for the load whats up. I say time to take the garbage out and you can keep your freight and it can sit on the docks.

Moot · Feb 22, 2015

I've posted this before. These are rates that were in effect January 1, 1997. The truck got 58.5% of these rates. If we are hauling for less than the rate was 18 years ago then we are all hauling cheap freight!

OntarioVanMan · Feb 22, 2015

Moot said:
I've posted this before. These are rates that were in effect January 1, 1997. The truck got 58.5% of these rates. If we are hauling for less than the rate was 18 years ago then we are all hauling cheap freight!

58.5? hmmm seems there is not much difference using the 300+ of a CV.....95 - 97 cents a mile...

Moot · Feb 22, 2015

It should be noted that the national average price of gasoline for the year 1997 was $1.25 and diesel was $1.20. I'm certainly happy that the price of fuel is the only increased expense my business has incurred over the past 18 years. It would really be tough out here if the prices for parts, mechanical labor, insurance, vehicle replacement, wheel chocks, food, clothing etc. were to rise above 1997 prices.