Ron Paul wins Virgin Islands with 29%...

AMonger

Veteran Expediter
Why does Ron Paul promote himself as a member of the Republican Party? He left once before to run for US President on the Libertarian Party ticket. Ron Paul despises the GOP. He doesn't rally to help the party or individual GOP candidates seeking office. Ron Paul is a self-promoting, self-serving hypocrite, plain and simple. Ron Paul uses the GOP like a rented mule. It's way past time to call this loser out. He's a joke of a candidate and does real harm to the party he professes to be his own.

Should Ron Paul flirt with a third party run, thus throwing the election to Obama, his name will be Mudd forevermore. Those giving aid to a desperate third party run, particularly son Rand, will find themselves marginalized to the point of irrelevancy.

(personal attack omitted)

Ron PAUL didn't leave the GOP; the GOP left him.

Ronald Reagan once said of the Demon-crats, "The Democrats have gone so far left, they've left America." And boy, was he right. Now, the Demon-crats are even farther left, waaaay farther left, and the Republicans are where the Demon-crats of
Reagan's day were.

The rest of the Republicans moved, not Ron Paul. And after they committed election fraud both this cycle and the last to blatantly steal primary and caucus wins from Dr. Paul, they deserve whatever they get. Let's hear it for the demise of the Re-thug-lican Party!
--

You know the problem with bad cops? They make the other 5% look bad.
 

Pilgrim

Veteran Expediter
Retired Expediter
Should Ron Paul flirt with a third party run, thus throwing the election to Obama, his name will be Mudd forevermore. Those giving aid to a desperate third party run, particularly son Rand, will find themselves marginalized to the point of irrelevancy.
It's probably fair to wonder at this point if a third party run by Paul would matter at all. He would likely take as many votes from Obama as the GOP candidate considering his youth following, and a lot of his staunch supporters would likely support only a fringe candidate in any case. He'll probably have enough delegates to gain himself an early afternoon speaking slot at the convention, wielding about as much influence as he did four years ago.
 

Turtle

Administrator
Staff member
Retired Expediter
Paul has already had a great deal of influence on the GOP. Santorum, Romney and even Newt have all taken several of Paul's ideas and championed them as their own. The only difference is, when Paul says "smaller government and less spending", for example, he really means it. None of the others do. Paul's campaign is far more of a movement to change modes of thinking than it is a contest to see who wins the nomination.
 

davekc

Senior Moderator
Staff member
Fleet Owner
Paul has already had a great deal of influence on the GOP. Santorum, Romney and even Newt have all taken several of Paul's ideas and championed them as their own. The only difference is, when Paul says "smaller government and less spending", for example, he really means it. None of the others do. Paul's campaign is far more of a movement to change modes of thinking than it is a contest to see who wins the nomination.

I think that is a good way to sum him up.
 

RLENT

Veteran Expediter
Ooooo .... and here we have the "it's-driving-them-crazy" factor in full play ....

Why does Ron Paul promote himself as a member of the Republican Party?
Ahhh ... because he is one ?

(Now, please do propose some ill-considered ideological "purity test", which will undoubtedly reduce party membership at an even faster rate than it is currently declining at ...)

He left once before to run for US President on the Libertarian Party ticket.
So ?

Do you somehow think that membership in, or affiliation with, the GOP ought to rise to the level of mindless, brown-shirted goose-stepping ?

Do you believe in the premise of "party over principle" ?

Do you consider yourself an American and defender of the Constitution first .... or a "member of the party" ?

(Gee .... "member of the party" .... where have I heard that before .... Comrade ? :rolleyes:)

Ron Paul despises the GOP.
Nope .... he despises what it (or portions thereof) has become - just the same as many who call themselves "conservatives" do: .... to a large extent a cabal of unprincipled, corrupt, disingenuous hacks .... who stand for very little, other than the acquisition and maintenance of power ...

The difference is he has enough integrity to not support this sort of thing ... unlike others, who are simply willing "to go along, to get along" ....

Here's a video that gives a little insight to the problem:


Now, after having been treated by the "establishment" in the manner depicted in the video - whereby the GOP refuses to follow even their own rules (ensuring these delagates will contested) - how many of the 20+ people in the video, do you honestly think will rally to the party - and continue to support it, both financially and with their own hard work at the grassroots level ?

How many people do these folks have within their own sphere of influence ?

If you think that what is depicted in the video is the way to build a political party and ensure electoral success, I've got some real nice beachfront property I could sell ya in northwest Florida .... tends to be a bit wet some of the time (.... well ..... mebbe most of the time ....)

Such a belief would be highly naive at best .... and outright delusional at worst ....

Imagine if that scenario were repeated many times all over the United States - and then you'll understand why I (and others) simply laugh when some buffoon suggests that we ought to "support the party" .... over vote for "the lesser of two evils" .... the GOP is slitting it's own throat ...

But hey - there is a reason why it gets referred to as "the Party of Stupid" ....

Only folks who are so sufficiently shallow so as to have compromised and sacrificed having any real principles or ideals could possibly believe that "the party", and what it actually represents, could command any allegiance (or respect) under such circumstances. You have a "branding" problem ... a big one ....

Their thoughts in this regard are simply a reflection of their own lack of personal integrity - and what they would be willing do.

Newsflash: some folks do actually have ideals and principles they are willing stand up for ...

Personally, I'd rather lose in an honest and fair fight ... than "win" in a corrupted and dishonest one ...

He doesn't rally to help the party or individual GOP candidates seeking office.
Again: not true ....

Of course, you'd know that if half-way bothered to look ... but facts are troublesome things, so I do understand the propensity to not look ....

It is true that he will not support anyone just simply because they have an "R" after their name .... but then that is no different than many others .... including some who self-identify as "conservative" ....

Ron Paul is a self-promoting, self-serving hypocrite, plain and simple. Ron Paul uses the GOP like a rented mule. It's way past time to call this loser out. He's a joke of a candidate and does real harm to the party he professes to be his own.
ROTFLMAO ....

Who is successfully bringing significant numbers of new members into the party - ones who are committed and enthusiastic and willing to spend their shoe leather to work at the grassroots level to build the party and get constitutional conservatives elected ?

Gingrich ?

Santorum ?

Nope, I don't think so .... these two couldn't even manage to get on the ballots in all the states ... which tells you a little something about their "supporters" ...

Romney ?

Shyeah ... right ....

Doing "harm to the party" is a nice assertion on your part .... unfortunately it just doesn't wash .... since it is the exact opposite of what is actually occurring ....

And if you want to talk about what's causing real harm to the party then perhaps we ought to discuss the serial-adulterer (good branding there) .... or the other guy who can't seem to open his mouth without shooting himself in the foot with all manner of lunacy ....

Should Ron Paul flirt with a third party run, thus throwing the election to Obama, his name will be Mudd forevermore. Those giving aid to a desperate third party run, particularly son Rand, will find themselves marginalized to the point of irrelevancy.
Whether Paul wins or not running as a third-party will depend on whether or the ossified, corrupt, blue-haired portion of the GOP (and their rather mindless felow-travelers) support him or not .... if Obama wins under such a scenario, those are the people you can thank when it's all said and done ....

Remember: everyone has a choice when they pull the lever ..... choose wisely ... lest the self-fulfilling prophecies that some seem so eager to embrace actually come to pass ...

BTW - as far as the implied threats of future marginalization: Please .... save it for the local neocon sewing circles and koolaid-klatches .... or someone else who might actually be foolish enough believe it ....

Until those making such threats can deliver something approaching the following, they are unlikely to be considered as anything other than what they actually are: random, hysterical noise by the politically impotent, who have little real ability to make good on what they promise.

Elizabeth Cameron just wrote:

I just got to attend the good doctor's appearance at the University of Illinois. The 4,500-seat venue was packed with a very enthusiastic crowd of the young and not-so-young. Dr. Paul was as eloquent and gracious as ever. It was quite a treat, and heartening to see so many kids who may actually have an inkling what the Fed is and what it does.
Somewhere up the line, there will be a tipping point.

As Turtle correctly points out, it isn't really about the man - it never was - it's about changing minds .... and creating a movement ....
 
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aristotle

Veteran Expediter
How does one put Ron Paul and "integrity" in the same sentence while keeping a straight face? He has no allegiance to anything other than himself. He's been a Republican... then a Libertarian...then a Republican again. Maybe he will pop up as a Democrat next time around. Or a Libertarian again... or the Green Party.... who knows? Ron Paul is an old man in search of himself.

Ron Paul die-hards are generally idealists divorced from reality. Immune to reasoning. The die-hards belong to Ron Paul and are not transferrable to other candidates. The GOP has never counted on having their support since conservatism isn't what draws them to Paul. Paulies are political nomads infatuated with a man, not a movement. Winning 5% of the GOP primary vote in Alabama and Mississippi is anything but a movement. And this sore loser floats the idea of a 3rd party run?

Yes, Ron Paul is annoying and amusing. And to think some voters imagine Paul to be a GOP powerbroker. He is a fringe candidate appealing to fringe voters. That's his shtick.
 

AMonger

Veteran Expediter
How does one put Ron Paul and "integrity" in the same sentence while keeping a straight face? He has no allegiance to anything other than himself. He's been a Republican... then a Libertarian...then a Republican again. Maybe he will pop up as a Democrat next time around. Or a Libertarian again... or the Green Party.... who knows? Ron Paul is an old man in search of himself.

Ron Paul die-hards are generally idealists divorced from reality. Immune to reasoning. The die-hards belong to Ron Paul and are not transferrable to other candidates. The GOP has never counted on having their support since conservatism isn't what draws them to Paul. Paulies are political nomads infatuated with a man, not a movement. Winning 5% of the GOP primary vote in Alabama and Mississippi is anything but a movement. And this sore loser floats the idea of a 3rd party run?

Yes, Ron Paul is annoying and amusing. And to think some voters imagine Paul to be a GOP powerbroker. He is a fringe candidate appealing to fringe voters. That's his shtick.

There's so much falsehood here, I don't know where to start to refute it. I hope you're just mudslinging and that you don't actually believe what you typed. That would be a bigger problem.

--

You know the problem with bad cops? They make the other 5% look bad.
 

Pilgrim

Veteran Expediter
Retired Expediter
Paul has already had a great deal of influence on the GOP. Santorum, Romney and even Newt have all taken several of Paul's ideas and championed them as their own. The only difference is, when Paul says "smaller government and less spending", for example, he really means it. None of the others do. Paul's campaign is far more of a movement to change modes of thinking than it is a contest to see who wins the nomination.
Smaller government and less of its intrusion, reduction in spending because we're broke, cut out foreign aid and other fundamental conservative principles weren't invented by Ron Paul. If he truly "meant it" when he preaches his sermons and was really concerned about the direction of our government, one would think that during his 23 years in Congress he would have put forth the effort to gain positions of leadership in the House where he could have actually exerted some influence in passing legislation that would have implimented his policies. Instead, he has NEVER held so much as a committee chairmanship and introduced only ONE INSIGNIFICANT BILL that was passed into law - for the sale of a customs house in Galveston. His record indicates he doesn't have the political influence or leadership skills to work with his congressional comrades to pass legislation that would turn his theories into reality. Why would someone that ineffective deserve serious consideration for POTUS?
 

RLENT

Veteran Expediter
Comrade,

(.... pardon me for addressing you as such, but I feel duty-bound - given your inclination to raise "the party" to a level which approaches deification ...)

How does one put Ron Paul and "integrity" in the same sentence while keeping a straight face? He has no allegiance to anything other than himself.
A 30+ year voting record of consistently defending the Constitution in a snake-pit of immoral, self-serving silver-tongued vipers says otherwise ...

He's been a Republican... then a Libertarian...then a Republican again. Maybe he will pop up as a Democrat next time around. Or a Libertarian again... or the Green Party.... who knows?
Well, one thing that is absolutely for sure - no matter what party Dr. Paul might choose to associate himself with, his strict adherence to the Constitution would not be likely to change ....

I can only imagine the seething rage and jealousy that some must feel to have no real standard bearer of equivalent stature to rally behind ....

Of course, such folks - being "realists" - must have long ago come to terms to such pitiful compromises ....

Ron Paul is an old man in search of himself.
Whatever Dr. Paul is in search of, it sure ain't that ...

OTOH, I suspect that there many others who very much wish they were still in search of a candidate to back ...

Ron Paul die-hards are generally idealists divorced from reality. Immune to reasoning.
That's funny - because apparently those candidates whom you would consider "realists" are increasingly parroting his ideas ....

Funny that .... of course, it's not real likely that this will gain them much ... why bother with the cheap fake when you can actually have the real thing instead ?

BTW, at the point where you offer some something that at least approaches reality and reasoning we might have something to actually talk about .... until then, not so much ...

The die-hards belong to Ron Paul and are not transferrable to other candidates.
That's absolutely not true at all .... but the transference of that support would naturally require actually having a candidate who supports the Constitution with the same steadfastness and to the degree that Dr. Paul does ....

Unlike many others apparently, we don't march in lockstep, simply due to a label ... the wrapper on the package ain't what interests us - it's what's inside that matters ....

This is not really rocket science ... most anyone ought to be able to figure it out.

The GOP has never counted on having their support since conservatism isn't what draws them to Paul. Paulies are political nomads infatuated with a man, not a movement.
Well now, that right there is jus' absolutely hilarious .... considering that the sort of "conservatives" that you probably identify with have shown themselves to be highly inclined to flip-flopping in their support of various "flavor-of-the-moment"

... Erick Ericsson over at RedState and Mike "Game****" Devine at RedState/UP being two quick examples that come quickly to mind ....

These guys are all over the place, shuckin' and jivin' .... and it's a real hoot to watch their gibbering and flip-floppin' ... no real core ..... other than slobbering all over anything wearing a uniform and "Whee!-let's-go-kill-the-brown-people" .... (an endeavor which I'm sure that neither of them actually plan on personally participating in of course ....)

No, I think you are truly corn-fused about the difference between shallow, fleeting infatuation ..... and a deep, abiding respect for someone who has staunchly defended the Constitution throughout his entire political career ....

Winning 5% of the GOP primary vote in Alabama and Mississippi is anything but a movement.
But over 50% of GOP voters in Mississippi think Obama is a closet Muslim .... so what does that tell ya ?

And I'll bet that probably over 95% of the entire electorate in those two states think that the word "Allah" is something that is unique to Muslims and Islam .... and are totally unaware that that it is the Arabic word for "the God" .... and is used by Bahá'ís and other Arabic-speaking peoples such as Eastern Catholic Christians, Maltese Roman Catholics, Eastern Orthodox Christians, Mizrahi Jews and Sikhs to refer to God.

While it is possible to correct ignorance thru education and supplying actual data (provided the ignorant are so inclined), like Ron White says:

"You can't fix stupid ..."

And this sore loser floats the idea of a 3rd party run?
Actually, the concept of being a sore loser has implicit within it that there has been a fair contest ...

BTW, I suspect he's disinclined to run as 3rd party ... but he might well just do it .... if his supporters demand it ...

Yes, Ron Paul is annoying and amusing. And to think some voters imagine Paul to be a GOP powerbroker. He is a fringe candidate appealing to fringe voters. That's his shtick.
Well then, if that's how ya really feel, then let's see your plan on how you and the remainder of the GOP are gonna bring it home in November .... and defeat Obama in spite of those "fringe voters" ....

That would probably be a topic that would be entirely worthy of "reasoned discussion" ....

BTW, here a little tidbit for ya to snack on - just so you don't gnaw your arm or foot off .... or something ... it's from David_Keene - who, if you don't already know, is the President of NRA, and was the chairman of the American Conservative Union (1984-2011) and who has been called "one of the country’s most astute political observers":

KEENE: Ron Paul in the driver’s seat
 

RLENT

Veteran Expediter
It's probably fair to wonder at this point if a third party run by Paul would matter at all.
Well, if you were actually tracking the polling on it, then you would actually know .... and you wouldn't have to wonder ...

But then you defer to RCP (and Lord knows where else) for your analysis of delegate allocation .... rather than bothering to actually understand the process and how it really works, so I guess it's understandable ...

He would likely take as many votes from Obama as the GOP candidate considering his youth following, and a lot of his staunch supporters would likely support only a fringe candidate in any case.
What you should be really concerned about is how things will shake out in a multi-way race:

Republican
Democratic
Libertarian
Constitution
Greens
Justice Party
Americans Elect

Particularly in this year ... where a confluence of circumstances may act to render previous paradigms irrelevant ....

Personally, if I were you, I'd be very, very afraid ....

He'll probably have enough delegates to gain himself an early afternoon speaking slot at the convention, wielding about as much influence as he did four years ago.
Well, of course I defer to your sage and expert "analysis" of delegate allocation .... :rolleyes:
 

aristotle

Veteran Expediter
Would this be the same Ron Paul who spoke out to defend the scurrilous actions of Wikileaks founder Julian Assange? Would this be the same Ron Paul who called the cowardly and treasonous Private Bradley Manning a "true hero?" Would this be the same Ron Paul who would abandon our ally Israel? Would this be the same Ron Paul who made a fortune selling newsletters of a dubious nature? Would this be the same Ron Paul who seldom misses an opportunity to bad-mouth his country? The GOP would be wise not to grant him speaking privileges at the nominating convention. Ron Paul has a long record of poking his finger in American eyes.
 

RLENT

Veteran Expediter
Smaller government and less of its intrusion, reduction in spending because we're broke, cut out foreign aid and other fundamental conservative principles weren't invented by Ron Paul.
Certainly they weren't .... however there can be no argument with the fact that Dr. Paul has stood - often alone - for those very principles ..... while those around him willingly ... and in many cases, eagerly and repeatedly ... sold out the citizens of this nation, and their oaths ....

If you can point to any vote of Dr. Paul's that goes against those principles you enumerated, please feel free to do so now ... otherwise ...

If he truly "meant it" when he preaches his sermons and was really concerned about the direction of our government, one would think that during his 23 years in Congress he would have put forth the effort to gain positions of leadership in the House where he could have actually exerted some influence in passing legislation that would have implemented his policies.
Asserting such a premise is nearly tantamount to a complete admission that one has absolutely no clue about the nature of Congress , and how it actually "works" (particularly when populated by the corrupt)

It is extremely naive at best .... and, like much of what you post, it is based on logical fallacy ... and it indicates an apparent acceptance that compromising one's core principles - including strict adherence to the Constitution - in pursuit of political power, is something that ought to be done ... and is something that one should be willing to do ....

Good grief ... it's no wonder we are in the mess that we are in ...

I'd suggest that you devote some serious time to learn the various forms of logical fallacies, so that you might, in the future, present a more principled and persuasive argument ...

Instead, he has NEVER held so much as a committee chairmanship and introduced only ONE INSIGNIFICANT BILL that was passed into law - for the sale of a customs house in Galveston. His record indicates he doesn't have the political influence or leadership skills to work with his congressional comrades to pass legislation that would turn his theories into reality. Why would someone that ineffective deserve serious consideration for POTUS?
Butterball,

Dude, you really crack me up ....

Take a look at how those "congressional comrades" have allowed themselves to be compromised, how they have sold out their souls, their constituents, the Constitution and the good of the entire nation .... in order to gain and maintain political power .... and then what became of that ...

That's what your and others' "practical realism" have brought us ... a standing room only spot at the precipice ... on the brink of disaster ....

Your assertion above is about like condemning a nun ..... who, having spent a night in a house of ill-repute, managed to keep her knees together the entire time .....
 
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Turtle

Administrator
Staff member
Retired Expediter
If he truly "meant it" when he preaches his sermons and was really concerned about the direction of our government, one would think that during his 23 years in Congress he would have put forth the effort to gain positions of leadership in the House where he could have actually exerted some influence in passing legislation that would have implimented his policies.
I'm not really sure why one would think that, considering his job was to represent his Congressional District, to represent the people in that district. By all accounts, considering how many times he was reelected, he did a pretty good job.

Instead, he has NEVER held so much as a committee chairmanship and introduced only ONE INSIGNIFICANT BILL that was passed into law - for the sale of a customs house in Galveston. His record indicates he doesn't have the political influence or leadership skills to work with his congressional comrades to pass legislation that would turn his theories into reality. Why would someone that ineffective deserve serious consideration for POTUS?
Using your logic with that last question, Barack "Present" Obama certainly shouldn't deserve serious consideration for POTUS, and yet he is, and on the flip side, Nancy Pelosi and Harry Reed should deserve immense consideration for POTUS. Immense, I tell you, immense.

Committee chairmanship and political influence in the legislative body doesn't necessarily translate into effectiveness in the executive branch of government. Some of the best presidents in history weren't even in the Congress. Some of the worst one were, and the worst of the worst generally had strong political influence and chaired committees. So I dunno what the litmus test it supposed to be.

All I know for sure is that a Pelosi-Reed ticket would make me throw up.
 

Tennesseahawk

Veteran Expediter
Why does Ron Paul promote himself as a member of the Republican Party? He left once before to run for US President on the Libertarian Party ticket. Ron Paul despises the GOP. He doesn't rally to help the party or individual GOP candidates seeking office. Ron Paul is a self-promoting, self-serving hypocrite, plain and simple. Ron Paul uses the GOP like a rented mule. It's way past time to call this loser out. He's a joke of a candidate and does real harm to the party he professes to be his own.

Should Ron Paul flirt with a third party run, thus throwing the election to Obama, his name will be Mudd forevermore. Those giving aid to a desperate third party run, particularly son Rand, will find themselves marginalized to the point of irrelevancy.

That's where you're wrong. The RINOs stole the party, and are using it for their own devices. Ron Paul is trying to return it back to true conservative hands.
 

Pilgrim

Veteran Expediter
Retired Expediter
Would this be the same Ron Paul who spoke out to defend the scurrilous actions of Wikileaks founder Julian Assange? Would this be the same Ron Paul who called the cowardly and treasonous Private Bradley Manning a "true hero?" Would this be the same Ron Paul who would abandon our ally Israel? Would this be the same Ron Paul who made a fortune selling newsletters of a dubious nature? Would this be the same Ron Paul who seldom misses an opportunity to bad-mouth his country? The GOP would be wise not to grant him speaking privileges at the nominating convention. Ron Paul has a long record of poking his finger in American eyes.

Yep, and the same Ron Paul who thinks a nuclear-armed Iran would be just another good neighbor in the Middle East. There's just no escaping his record and his stated positions on foreign policy, and the vast majority of Americans recognize them for what they are. Consequently, it appears he'll be no more influential in this year's GOP convention than he was in 2008.

Current GOP delegate count:
Romney 496
Santorum 236
Gingrich 141
Paul 66

RealClearPolitics - Election 2012 - Republican Delegate Count
 

RLENT

Veteran Expediter
Would this be the same Ron Paul who spoke out to defend the scurrilous actions of Wikileaks founder Julian Assange? Would this be the same Ron Paul who called the cowardly and treasonous Private Bradley Manning a "true hero?"
You mean those two who risked life and liberty to expose the lies that we were being told by our government and military, in conclusion with a corrupt and feckless press ?

Of course, "everyone knows" real "heros" .... go out and slaughter innocent civilians - the elderly, women, and children - while they sleep in their beds ... and other similar brave deeds of daring-do ....

BTW, considering what the definition of scurrilous is, I consider your use of it above rather ironic ... and it prompts the following question:

If one publishes "truth", who or what would one have to be to find that scurrilous ?

Would this be the same Ron Paul who would abandon our ally Israel?
I doubt it - since he's not an isolationist .... I haven't heard of him advocating anything other than peace, commerce, and honest friendship to those would avail themselves of it (by doing likewise) ....

In fact, he's indicated that he would allow Israel off the leash - to do as she sees fit to protect herself ....

If you (and others) want to fund and subsidize Israel pass the hat and take up a collection .... just don't use the power of the state to steal out of my pocket to do it ....

Charity ought to be voluntary right ?

Or is that a little piece of "cognitive dissonance" you're still struggling with ?

Would this be the same Ron Paul who made a fortune selling newsletters of a dubious nature?
Fortune ?

Do you actually have any numbers to back that up ?

Or is it just another case of unprincipled and unsubstantiated Saul Alinsky "Rules-for-Radicals" type of attack that you and others claim the Left is the sole perpetrator of ? (please see rule no. 13)

Is this more of your (ahem, highly-principled :rolleyes:) "realism" ?

Would this be the same Ron Paul who seldom misses an opportunity to bad-mouth his country?
One cannot develop political consensus on how to fix what is wrong if one avoids the subject of what is actually wrong .... and spending endless hours navel-gazing on how very wunderbar everything is, is unlikely to produce the desired result ...

Similarly, neither is sticking one's head in the sand likely to be of much value in such an endeavor ...

The GOP would be wise not to grant him speaking privileges at the nominating convention.
Yeah ... jeez .... ya wanna talk about saying something with a straight face ?

.... the GOP and "wise" in the same sentence .... seriously ?

C'mon ... I just know you're wearing a big grin here on this one .... gotta be ...

Ron Paul has a long record of poking his finger in American eyes.
Yup .... and he's raising up a veritable army of those who are inclined to do likewise ....

Mebbe after the hurt stops and clarity of vision returns, many will be able to see a little more clearly ....
 
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RLENT

Veteran Expediter
Ron Paul is a Libertarian running under a false flag.
Please .... don't be so wordy ..... :rolleyes:

"If you analyze it I believe the very heart and soul of conservatism is libertarianism. I think conservatism is really a misnomer just as liberalism is a misnomer for the liberals–if we were back in the days of the Revolution, so-called conservatives today would be the Liberals and the liberals would be the Tories.

The basis of conservatism is a desire for less government interference or less centralized authority or more individual freedom and this is a pretty general description also of what libertarianism is.

Now, I can’t say that I will agree with all the things that the present group who call themselves Libertarians in the sense of a party say, because I think that like in any political movement there are shades, and there are libertarians who are almost over at the point of wanting no government at all or anarchy.

I believe there are legitimate government functions. There is a legitimate need in an orderly society for some government to maintain freedom or we will have tyranny by individuals. The strongest man on the block will run the neighborhood. We have government to insure that we don’t each one of us have to carry a club to defend ourselves. But again, I stand on my statement that I think that libertarianism and conservatism are travelling the same path." - Ronald Reagan, 1975, Reason Magazine

Inside Ronald Reagan: A Reason Interview
 

Pilgrim

Veteran Expediter
Retired Expediter
I'm not really sure why one would think that, considering his job was to represent his Congressional District, to represent the people in that district. By all accounts, considering how many times he was reelected, he did a pretty good job.
Indeed - he brought home the pork and got himself reelected.
Using your logic with that last question, Barack "Present" Obama certainly shouldn't deserve serious consideration for POTUS, and yet he is, and on the flip side, Nancy Pelosi and Harry Reed should deserve immense consideration for POTUS. Immense, I tell you, immense.
I thought about that as I was keying the response, and we see now what happens when we get someone in the Oval Office who is unqualified, inexperienced and has no leadership abilities; we don't need that again. For all practical purposes - the first two Obama years especially - Pelosi and Reed WERE running the country.
All I know for sure is that a Pelosi-Reed ticket would make me throw up.
Pass the Pepto :p
 
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