Reply To Mr.Gary Addis Article Decision 2000

ACE

Veteran Expediter
Charter Member
I watched all three debates and I came away with a different conclusion.
I believe Gov.Bush did very well in all three debates. He answered the questions given him by the moderator.
Gov.Bush is right to give tax breaks to ALL people who PAY TAXES.
Gov.Bush has shown that he can work with democrats and republicans to get things done.
The social security age for full benefits is already been raised from 65yrs. to 67yrs. this is being accomplished by with increment age adjustments, until 67 yrs.
I believe the male life expectency in the U.S. is 72 yrs.
The goverment does not create wealth, they tax it.
The corporations you talk about create jobs and wealth.
I disagree with you thinking that Gov.Bush is not smart,he has a MBA Degree, and has worked in the private sector. He is also not Known to exaggerate what he has done like V.P.Gore does. I think we need a change Clinton/Gore had 8yrs to fix medicare, to reduce the number of people who do not have health insurance. They failed.
 

garyaddis

Veteran Expediter
Charter Member
No question, Dubya did quite well in the debates. Gore did even better, however, because his stand on the issues was backed with fully researched facts.

The problem with the across the board tax cut proposed by Bush is that it goes too far. Forty percent of the proposed tax cut goes to that top 1%. It is a fact that Bush does not deny that his plan gives a larger tax break to the handful who earn $1,000,000 or more per year than he plans to spend on new military spending, healthcare and education COMBINED. The premise behind the American tax system is fairness--i.e., those who have much more than they need for basic necessities of life give more to make up for the little given by the millions who don't know where their next meal is coming from. Bush's plan is simply not fair.

About that "get things done." Bill Clinton and Al Gore twice shut down the Federal government rather than sign on to spending bills that showered pork upon key political districts. He accomplished the greatest economic turnaround in this or any other nation's history, and all the while fighting personal attacks and obstructionist behavior of the Republican controlled congress. Look it up, don't merely take Rush Limburger's word for it. Which brings out the question, what could Clinton have achieved if the REpugs had not been such a smug, stubborn roadblock. During Reagan's years, twice the REpublicans voted down a balanced budget agreement. Clinton and Gore passed this sensible legislation only because Al Gore, in his capacity as legislator, cast the tie breaking vote.

Know why the social security threshold age is being raised already? Because Ronnie REagan raided, with a presidential executive order, what until he came along had been an unbreakable trust fund. He did so to conceal some of the huge deficits he was running. $3,000,000,000,000 spent that he did not have during his first six years in office--he doubled the total of all the deficits ever incurred by an American administration. Where did all that money go? Certainly not to the American people. During Reagan's years inflation reached an all-time high of 28%, and at the same time unemployment rose to a high of, what was it, 22%? Today, thanks to the sound fiscal policies practiced by this Democratic administration (the man has a big set of huevos, going against even his own party), inflation is less than 5%, unemployment is at an all-time low (3.4%).

The male life expectancy in the US is still 67; for females the expectancy is 72. But this is a rather silly thing for you to focus on, isn't it? Even if the retirement age were dropped to 60, few of us would draw out of it all the money we had paid in. Tough, and hardly fair unless you live to be a 100. However, what about all those widows and children and disabled 22yr old social security recipients? If healthy 20-somethings are permitted to pay into an "untouchable" private account,, friend, who will pay the benefits of you and me, for the trust fund will be bankrupt. Bush and his Repug colleagues know that this is the aboslute truth: call me cynical, but I beleive the Republican Party wants just that: to bankrupt the Fund. They fought like hell to defeat it when Roosevelt proposed it, and they have been slicing at, or trying to, ever since.

True, governments do not create the wealth; they do tax it. They tax it to provide essential services -- fire, police, bldg inspectors, DOT inspectors, and hundreds of other categories of regulators whose purpose is to protect the health, wealth and freedoms of the people. When I was in high school the top tax rate in this nation was 98%. The wealthy cried, but they paid, and, guess what, they still prospered.

For years they've been lobbying for repeal of capital gains taxes. Investment would soar, they say, if they don't have to pay taxes on gains. Do you even know how those work? If a businessman sells a business or portion thereof for a profit, he has xx years to reinvest the money, and he pays no taxes on it--the capital gains taxes apply only if the profiteer puts the money in his hip pocket. Today, they're crying about the "death tax." The present exemption for an individual is $650,000. So, unless you leave an estate valued at about $1,000,000 the estate escapes tax free. I and Al Gore are in favor of even larger exemptions for small businesses and family farms. But I for one believe that when Bill Gates dies, he does not have the right to leave $65,000,000,000 untaxed so that the next forty generations of his family can sit on their butts and do nothing.

Corporations do not create wealth; they use wealth already created, in most cases. Microsoft's bill Gates did not begin life as a corporation. And no one would deny that corporations, being legal entities, not people, are not expected to have a conscience, whcih they obviously do not. If the USDA bans a drug in the US to protect the health of the people, the corporation merely packs it up and sells it in some poor desperate backwoods country.

Okay, as to Bush's intelligence. Daddy Bush donated a dormitory to Dubya's university...might that not affect the grading applied to his papers? As for his work in the private sector, friend, as to his vaunted oil business, every well he sank was DRY. If his daddy had not been president, it is likely he would be in jail, for his part in the failure of a savings & loan.

Clinton/Gore did have eight years to fix Medicare, etc. Where did you spend the last eight years? They sent several proposed bills to Congress. But the REpublican Congress was determined to rob Democrats of the credit for fixing the systems that they, and Ronnie REagan, and George the Daddy screwed up.

I wish that Clinton could run again. Gore may not be quite the man that Clinton was; he may be even better. Time will tell. If the American people are smart enough to elect him. If we deserve the continuation of the strong Clinton economy.

Gary Addis
 

ACE

Veteran Expediter
Charter Member
"There you go Again" the numbers you use are a little fuzzy could you list the resources that you use.

I would like to see were in the tax code it said that the Premise was to be fair. I Thought the income tax was originated to pay for WWI.
The richest people will still pay a sizeable amount of their income to the Federal Govt.
How can you say in one paragraph things are so good and in an other people do not know where their next meal is coming from.
Which is it?

Clinton/Gore had two years with a Democratic controlled Congress when he was first elected why didn't the Clinton/Gore achieve any of the things that you value.

The House of Representatives start all legislation on spending matters. So the Republicans with Rep.John Kasich leading the way balanced the budget.

I don't understand how you could insult the profesors at two respected Universities.Insinuating that they would pass some one for the donation of a dormitory.

Neil was involved in the savings & loan scandal, NOT George W Bush.There was some Democrats involved also.

The Death tax is unfair because it taxes money twice once when it is earned and then when it is given to the heirs.

Gov.Bush will work with Democrats and Republicans to give America a bright future.

Gov.Bush will work to make education fair for all.

Gov.Bush will let everyone who pays taxes decide how they want to spend the money they worked for. {some may even donate to charities}. We need to trust the working american,on how they want to spend the money.
 

garyaddis

Veteran Expediter
Charter Member
>"There you go Again" the numbers
>you use are a little
>fuzzy could you list the
>resources that you use.

Guy, I got my figures the same place Bush got his, and you got yours: someone else came up with them, and he, you, me, merely pass them on as well as we understand them. The fact is, however, that Bush doesn't deny that Gore's statements about Bush tax plan are wrong--he calls them "fuzzy," but he does not put up any figures of his own. Fact is, his own top economic advisor, in a televised press interview, shook his head, and said, "I don't know why Gov. Bush said that." (Referring to Bush's statement that the "private investment accounts" he proposes will come from the budget surplus. You see, he had already pledged that money to tax cuts.)

>I would like to see were
>in the tax code it
>said that the Premise was
>to be fair. I Thought
>the income tax was originated
>to pay for WWI.
>The richest people will still pay
>a sizeable amount of their
>income to the Federal Govt.

Yes they will still pay. However, the "sizeable amount" you're referring to is a pittance. For the wealthy there are loopholes built into the system large enough to drive a truck through. George Jr earned $1,600,000+ last year, mostly from CDs, stocks & bonds, and other investments. Gore's income, total of $220,000, mostly from salary. Salary affords few tax cuts. Guarantee you that Bush did not pay even 15% of HIS income in taxes. My rate is 28%, and I sure as hell don't have any big write-offs. As the wife of one billionaire remarked on 60 Minutes a few years ago, "Taxes are for little people."

>How can you say in one
>paragraph things are so good
>and in an other people
>do not know where their
>next meal is coming from.

Wait a minute. Reason crime rate is down? Clinton claims it due to his crime-busting legislation; Repug governors claim due to their crime busting. Wrong. Crime is down mostly due to strong economy. But the min. wage is still only $5.15 per hour, and millions of 4-person families are still stuck in this rut.

AS for Bush's tax cut benefitting folks at bottom, "eliminating millions from tax rolls," if Bush weren't so frigging ignorant he's realize that few people earning under $15k pay a dime in taxes; to the contrary, you ever heard of earned income credit?

>Which is it?
Duh.

>Clinton/Gore had two years with a
>Democratic controlled Congress when he
>was first elected why didn't
>the Clinton/Gore achieve any of
>the things that you value.

They did, guy, check the legislative facts. But "control of Congress" is more than a numbers game. Repugs claim that REagan never had control. Au contrar. For two years he had supreme numbers control and for the remainder of his time he had virtual control due to his popularity, which scared Democrats into doing his bidding. Reagan's vetoes were overridden only once, and anything he proposed went through without hitch. Thus the deficit. Thus the ripoff of S&Ls (which personally benefitted George Jr to the tune of $232 million in unsecured loans which were forgiven, and eaten by the taxpayers.
>
>The House of Representatives start all
>legislation on spending matters. So
>the Republicans with Rep.John Kasich
>leading the way balanced the
>budget.

Horseshit. Where the hell do you think the budget originates? The President. look it up. The President proposes; the Congress disposes.

>I don't understand how you could
>insult the profesors at two
>respected Universities.Insinuating that they would
>pass some one for the
>donation of a dormitory.

Duh. do you live in a fishbowl? It happens every day. You don't really believe that all those college graad-uuate basketball players can read their own biography, do you? Here's proof of Jr.s stupidity, out of George's own mouth:

"If we don't succeed, we run the risk of failure."

"The Holocaust was an obscene period in our nation's history. I mean in this century's history. But we all lived in this century. I didn't live in this century."

"The future will be better tomorrow."

"It isn't pollution that is harming the environment. It's the impurities in our air and water that's doing it."

"People who are really very weird can get into sensitive positions and have a tremendous impact on history."

I'll say! Duh, let's make ol' Georgie king! The man who was born with a cocaine spoon up his nose.

>Neil was involved in the savings
>& loan scandal, NOT George
>W Bush.There was some Democrats
>involved also.

George had his hand in the till too. And you telling me they all don't share in the investments?

>The Death tax is unfair because
>it taxes money twice once
>when it is earned and
>then when it is given
>to the heirs.

Grow up. You heard that on television Bush sound bite and it sounded good, huh? Look at the legacy the great fortunes have bestowed on the heirs. Big mansions, fast cars, summers in France, winters in the Andes, fancy clothes, jewelry, big asses, and supreme confidence that they are better than you are. They are not. Granddaddy's thievery should not entitle two thousand Rockefeller offspring to be leeches on the blood of the rest of us.

Read a little history, learn where/how the great fortunes (old money) were built. I lived two years in South America. Lots of really nice homes in Bolivia beautiful public bldgs and parks. The average yearly income is less than $200, and don't tell me that "you can live like a king down there with a $1000." Because you cannot. To live the lifestyle of American middle class requires even more money down there than it does here. But then, they don't have a middle class. They have filthy frigging rich and dirt poor, which was the life of 98% of our American ancestors. The Repugs enjoy it when our economy is poor--it means that they can hire 100 servants for the price of ten; it means that they can slurp up our mortgages when we can't make our bills. They want to eat steak and sip champaign and allow us, if we're nice, to dine in their outhouses. Why do you think Reagan himself referred to his edconomics system as "trickle down economics?"

>Gov.Bush will work with Democrats and
>Republicans to give America a
>bright future.

You're related to George Bush, I take it? Neither candidate will accomplish a helluva lot, because neither will have strong majority and the people opinion is evenly divided and can't be weilded as a club to force the pres or congress to toe the mark.
Right now, at this moment, you are enjoying the brightest, most equable, an prosperous America you will ever see, and you're just too %^&* stubborn to understand it.

>Gov.Bush will work to make education
>fair for all.

Yeah, right. Provide vouchers which will be sucked from public school funding. Since this money will be passing into the hands of poor, desperate people, easily mislead, these millions will be wasted on local church "schools." My daughter attended one of those for a while. Her grades were great; I was pleased, till I looked at the curriculum. In the 8th grade they had her doing 4th grade math. Because it made them look good. Same reason George's texas system concentrates on teaching to texas' self-designed tests. Texas system is a failure.


>Gov.Bush will let everyone who pays
>taxes decide how they want
>to spend the money they
>worked for. {some may even
>donate to charities}. We need
>to trust the working american,on
>how they want to spend
>the money.

Come on get real. And leave a $6,000,000,000,000 debt for our great grandchildren to pay. Trouble is, the interest keeps compounding. And guess who the money is owed to? George's buddies, that wealthiest 1%. They do not want the deficit paid off; they're earning too much off the interest payments.

I'll leave you with quotes from the Man Who Would Be King:

"I know how hard it is for you to put food on your family."
"Will the highways on the Internet become more few?"
"The most important job is not to be governor, or First LADY in my case."

A heartfelt sigh. At least Ronnie Reagan could read the scripts they put in front of him. George admits that he hasn't read his own mother's best-selling book. (I don't like to read.") Some president he'd make.
 

garyaddis

Veteran Expediter
Charter Member
RE: Reply To Article "Decision 2000"

Ace, forgive me, friend. I am passionate in my ire toward those who would abuse the working people of this and every country. For we are the producers; everything manufactured or grown or carted anywhere or CLEANED, we the working people do. The wealthy, the idle wealthy, of which there are many, are the true enemy.

I am not anti-corporation. Not anti-capitalist. My vitriol is directed at the leeches. While decrying the welfare rolls, corporations suck at the public teat whenever they can, and because they can buy the politicians (Repub and Democrat alike), they are seldom pushed away from the cash cow.

Walt Disney was a producer. HE, his vision, his energy, made the name Disney synonymous with children having fun. During his lifetime his yearly salary was a tiny fraction of the $240+ million ripped from the hands of the parents of small children yearly by CEO Michael Eisner, who produced nothing. Eisner's yearly take-home exceeds the take-home of 5,000 American middle class families! Corporate CEOs are the true enemies, for they don't do very much. Indeed, they are often anti-production, which might make the company a target of a takeover by a larger, greedier corporation CEO.

Back to George W. Bush. He is not the problem. He is merely a convenient mouthpiece. A willing stooge for those who will rape the American treasury; those who will strip a mountain bare of trees; those who will pump raw chemicals into our rivers. Because they hide beneath a blanket called "corporation," these thieves and murderers do get away with murder.

Please do not fear government. Government is seldom the problem-- it is seldom the sole, or even the best, solution. But allowing corporations to regulate themselves is usually a mistake. Because corporations are barracudas; they eat their young.

George W. Bush is dangerous because he will besuch a willing--eager--stooge. And, please believe me, the man truly is an idiot.

Again, please forgive me if my attack became personal toward you. I mean no disrespect. For you are a working man. You and I and all other members of the middle class are in this together.
 

Kyle O

Veteran Expediter
Charter Member
Reply To Mr. Gary Addis

I appreciate someone who defends their beliefs. It is rare that I hear a democrate articulate why they support their party. They (especially Gore) will make general statements like they want: insurance for all americans...better schools...cleaner air...reduce drugs and tean pregnancey...the list goes on.

Obviously we all want these things but few democrates understand or at least like to talk about how they are going to get them. However, Mr. Addis has explained his/their democratic strategy. If you throw out about two thirds of his comments (which are the typical republican/democrat arguements) and focus on the real strategy on how he (Gore) wants to achieve their goals it is simple.

TAKE IT FROM THOSE WHO HAVE IT AND GIVE IT TO THOSE THAT DON'T

If you agree with Mr. Addis, if you vote for a democrat if you vote for Gore you are supporting this concept.

Their fundemental idea of the government targeting someone and then stealing money from them because they have a lot of it is absolutely rediculous. Where does it stop Mr. Addis?

You mention Bill Gates...Hell take anyone who has "made it". Collin Powell is a good example. You are supporting a party that says Mr. Powell you have been given the same opportunities as you sisters and brothers and friends from the day you were born. You however have been more successful than your peers so what I am going to do is take more from you because you have more to take????? Mr. Gates...you are loaded. I realize at one point you were sleeping in a garage trying to make some new fangled machine that counts or something...to be honest I dont care how you got here you are rich and I am stealing almost half of your money!

TAKE IT FROM THOSE THAT HAVE IT AND GIVE IT TO THOSE WHO DON'T

Some people WORK their entire lives to achieve wealth.
Some people WAIT for Mr. Addis to deliver them someone elses wealth.

You decide which type of person you are?

PS It is interesting that through hundreds of years of history the country has remained spilt about 50/50 on this. Possibly because one American can really only CARRY one other American??

Are you carrying someone or being carried. If you feel like you are carrying someone then vote republican.
 

Beaker

Veteran Expediter
Charter Member
A first grade teacher explains to her class that she is a liberal Democrat.

She asks her students to raise their hands if they were Liberal Democrats too.

Not really knowing what a liberal Democrat was but wanting to be like their teacher, their hands explode into the air like fleshy fireworks.

There is, however, one exception. A girl named Lucy has not gone along with the crowd.

The teacher asks her why she has decided to be different.

She replied, "Because I'm not a liberal Democrat."

Then, asks the teacher, what are you?

"Why I'm a proud conservative Republican," boasts the little girl.

The teacher is a little perturbed now, her face
slightly red. She asks Lucy why she is a conservative Republican.

"Well, I was brought up to trust in myself instead of relying on an intrusive government to care for me and do all of my thinking. My Dad and Mom are conservative Republicans, and I am a Conservative Republican too."

The teacher is now angry. "That's no reason," she says loudly.
"What if your Mom was a moron, and your dad was a moron.
What would you be then?"

A pause, and a smile. "Then," says Lucy, "I'd be a liberal Democrat."
 

RichM

Veteran Expediter
Charter Member
Gary way back on your first post you said at the end you wish Bill Clinton could run again. This is a draft dodger who insulted the country by lying to the American People,lying to his cabinet and VP,lying to his wife and daughter which created the first impeachment trial in over 100 years.He brought shame to the high office that he was elected to ,cost the taxpayers about $50 million or so all because he did not have the morals to resist the sexual attraction of a woman his daughters age. What has he accomplished,the economy is the way it is due to the Internet dot com activities (which Al Gore Invented),foreign policy is a joke etc.Have you been to a military base lately,half of the equipment doesn!t work,the good decent personel are all getting out and leaving the rif raff who don!t mind going to Somalia,Kosovo etc for 1-2 yrs.Recently I deliverd some machinge guns to a Infantry unit at Ft Benning GA,they had been waiting 3 years for them. I don!t know if George Bush is the answer but he is better then Bill Clinton for sure..Just my thoughts..
 

RichM

Veteran Expediter
Charter Member
One other item since I am somewhat worked up LOL. How does a woman who was raised in Ilinois,live most of her adult life in Arkansaw and Washington DC,then decide she is a native of New York.It took her exploritory commitee a year to tell her that it!s OK to be a new Yorker.Why not run for the Senate from Arkansas or Ilinois?? I saw a debate the other night,this is one arrogant lady, sure glad I don!t live there..
 

garyaddis

Veteran Expediter
Charter Member
>One other item since I am
>somewhat worked up LOL. How
>does a woman who was
>raised in Ilinois,live most of
>her adult life in Arkansaw
>and Washington DC,then decide she
>is a native of New
>York.It took her exploritory commitee
>a year to tell her
>that it!s OK to be
>a new Yorker.Why not run
>for the Senate from Arkansas
>or Ilinois?? I saw a
>debate the other night,this is
>one arrogant lady, sure glad
>I don!t live there..

Are you forgetting that brother Jeb moved to Florida in order to run for governor there? A few months back at a televised rally, Geo Jr told a crowd that no mstter where he hangs his hat Massachusettes will always be his home. The Bush family spends about half their time there, always have, always will. Besides, the residency req when fulfilled entitles one to run for office within that state.
 

garyaddis

Veteran Expediter
Charter Member
Excuuuse me! What would you have had us do re: Kosovo? That's the area that caused two world wars. Should we have sat on our haunches till 6,000,000 were raped, tortured and buried in the sand.

Clinton's allowed the military to sink? Too much Rush Limburger cheese in your diet, dude. Clinton RAISED the military spending during his tenure; Gore's plan is several billion dollars larger than Bush's. How many military bases you been around? Back in '68-'70, when there was a war going on, half the equipment on the bases was 25 years old. Whenever any active duty major officers are interviewed, they all admit that the state of the military readiness has never been higher.

And talk about arrogance! That dweeb who is running against Ms. Clinton spent the entire debates attacking on a personal level. HE is arrogant. But then I've never heard of a
Republican who is not arrogantly assured that he is better than everyone else
 

RichM

Veteran Expediter
Charter Member
Well I!m not going to go any further with this topic,but one thing is that I can only take Rush L for about 4-5 minutes than the station is changed.I agree about Kosovo but why are we THE WORLDS POLICEMAN. The Europeans have a lot more at stake in that part of the world than we do. When I entered the US Army I took a oath to protect and defend the constituion of the United States,not to be a policeman against 2 ethnic groups that have hated,killed and pillaged against each other for 1000 years. How would you like to put your life on the line for something like that. By the way I see you didn!t reply about Bill Clintons morals.Not much you can say about that.and in closing I am a registered independent. LETS keep this site for EXPEDITING..
 

garyaddis

Veteran Expediter
Charter Member
RE: Reply To Mr. Gary Addis

>I appreciate someone who defends their
>beliefs. It is rare
>that I hear a democrate
>articulate why they support their
>party. They (especially Gore)
>will make general statements like
>they want: insurance for all
>americans...better schools...cleaner air...reduce drugs and
>tean pregnancey...the list goes on.
>
>
>Obviously we all want these things
>but few democrates understand or
>at least like to talk
>about how they are going
>to get them. However,
>Mr. Addis has explained his/their
>democratic strategy. If you
>throw out about two thirds
>of his comments (which are
>the typical republican/democrat arguements) and
>focus on the real strategy
>on how he (Gore) wants
>to achieve their goals it
>is simple.
>
>TAKE IT FROM THOSE WHO HAVE
>IT AND GIVE IT TO
>THOSE THAT DON'T
>
>If you agree with Mr. Addis,
> if you vote for
>a democrat if you vote
>for Gore you are supporting
>this concept.
>
>Their fundemental idea of the government
>targeting someone and then stealing
>money from them because they
>have a lot of it
>is absolutely rediculous. Where
>does it stop Mr. Addis?

Your argument is facitious. When the income tax was first imposed, the disparity in ability to meet families' basic needs was so great that the top tax rate was set at 98%! Yet Rockefeller still managed to accumulate so much wealth that no Rockefeller will ever be considered anything other than filthy rich. Read a history of Rockefeller; gain an understanding of how he, Diamond Jim Brady, and some of their pals got so rich. They hired private armies to gun down those who tried striking for a living wage. You'd never support a union vote would you? When 3 million drivers are complaining that we need to band together, to get our rights, you're one of those who write down the names for the front office, aren't you.
>
>
>You mention Bill Gates...Hell take anyone
>who has "made it".
>Collin Powell is a good
>example.

Bill Gates is one in a billion--no, one in 65 billion! Extremely talented, extremely energetic, and as he himself admits, extremely ruthless. He built his empire on the backs of more talented entrepreneurs. He steals ideas--whenever someone comes up with a program that fits well with Windows, first Bill uses his enormous economic clout to buy temporary rights to it (if the programmers refuse, he has it blocked from Windows compatibility). Then a year later, after his crew of foreign-born codebreakers have reverse engineered the program, he freezes out the innovator and puts it on the market as a module of MS Windows. The government was right to go after MS on anti-trust charges.

Having said that, I'll admit that in my opinion Gates and MS have been very good for the computer age. He forced all software into compatibility, which benefits all users. Trouble is, he is a greedy bastid; he wants it all for himself. B4 you remark, he is not selfish with his friends, those who helped him start; he is stingy only with those who buy his high-priced products.

Now, as for Colin Powell. Colin Powell would not have succeeded, no matter how great his talent for kissing ##### of those above him, without Affirmative Action legislation. He himself admits this. He is Repuglican, because, having served in the White House (the military appointed him, not Reagan or Bush), he well knew that he would never be trusted by the Democrats. Therefore, being ambitious, he has sold his soul to advance his career into a Cabinet post. I do not deny the man's abilities. But if Bush is president the next time an gifted person of color attempts to rise through the military ranks, he will be blocked, for Bush is dead set against Affirmative Action.

>Some people WORK their entire lives
>to achieve wealth.
>Some people WAIT for Mr. Addis
>to deliver them someone elses
>wealth.

Excuse me. A $1.00 per hour raise in the minimum wage is hardly giving anyone great wealth. As a Democrat, I am not anti-wealth. I certainly am no proponent of welfare. That is why I am a Democrat: I think it is time to end Corporate Welfare.
Bush's tax cut will provide $3,000,000 tax break over a two year period to each family of that top one per cent of American taxpayers.

>You decide which type of person
>you are?
>
>PS It is interesting that
>through hundreds of years of
>history the country has remained
>spilt about 50/50 on this.
> Possibly because one American
>can really only CARRY one
>other American??


Excuse me again. An example I used earlier, Disney CEO Michael Eisner receives yearly compensation of $230+ million. Divide that by $50,000. Comes to more than 4,500 families. That one man is not more deserving, he is not harder working, than each of those 15,000+ human beings. He is damn well able to support more than one American on his great wealth. Then again, he pouts if he is asked to wash his hands in a sink that isn't equipped with gold faucets. Or so I've read.


Every working class American carries far more than his share. For the politicians supported by the filthy rich provide their benefactors with plenty of tax loopholes. Don't tell me how many thousands or millions some billionaire paid in taxes last year. Tell me instead how much his personal income was, before the tax breaks kicked in.

Crying about the "death tax?" Unless you're leaving more than a $1,000,000 for your heirs to fight over, there is no inheritance tax for you. Gore proposes raising the exemption to as much as $3,000,000, and making family businesses and farms totally exempt. But exempting Bill Gates' $63,000,000,000 from taxation is a rape of the majority of American taxspayers. I mean, Christ, if his estate were taxed at the top rate, his children would still have more than $30,000,000,000 to haggle over.
While a fatherless family of four struggles to get by on the ridiculously low $5.15 minimum wage?
If you believe that, you are a fool.
 

garyaddis

Veteran Expediter
Charter Member
Cute. True idiocy, however, is a working stiff voting for a man who is anti-Union, anti-Civil Rights, anti-woman's rights, anti- nearly everything that a considerate, thinking man or woman believes in.

As my granddaddy said forty years ago: Two kind of people vote Republican: Rich people, and poor stupid clods who think the Baron can be trusted to allow them to hunt a rabbit on the estate when the sodbuster's familiy is hungry.

Both Gore and Bush are members of the Lucky Sperm club. Gore realizes how fortunate he is, and wants to help those less fortunate to at least a chance in life. Bush, on the other hand, sneers down from his throne and says, "The peasants are hungry? Let them eat cake!"
 

RichM

Veteran Expediter
Charter Member
Well it!s Friday night,nothing on the idiot tube so why not keep this silly BS going,Gary your last post said only rich people vote Republican..It seems to me that quite a few people from the entertainment industry I.E. Hollywood give large contributions to the Democratic party and even pay to sleep in the White House.Question?? are they poor?? I don!t think so.As far as the working stiff goes I think most labor unions generally endorse Democratic candidates,I think the republican voter is a middle class guy or woman who works hard and wants relief from excessive taxation that goes to support those who elect not to work,have very little personal responsibility and want the Government to always bail them out.Sure there are rich bankers who are Republicans but there are many Owner Operators who are struggling due to government policies that do not take into account the common guy..Have a good weekend.I have enjoyed this dialogue..
 

garyaddis

Veteran Expediter
Charter Member
Clinton screwed around with a secretary; Reagan/Bush screwed around with the nation. Bush Jr. was arrested for drunk driving once. Twenty years ago, yes, but tell a mother who has lost a child to a drunk driver that that is no big deal. Want to believe in a left wing conspiracy to bring that out at the end of the campaign? Is it a Right Wing Conspiracy that no mention has been made in the Press that Jr was once arrested for theft? That too was many years ago, a "youthful indiscretion." But had it been Gore-- or Clinton-- we'd never hear the end of it.

We're not so far apart, driver. For we are both working class grunts, we deliver the nation's goods.

I'm just not as willing to trust nameless faceless corporate CEOs to do the right thing. You ever ride through the state of Washington, viewed the once bountiful forests stripped bare. Nowadays they hide the rape from public eye behind a few acres of forests that front the highways. I've been there, and I have seen the future.

Bush wants to drill in Alaska. How will that help us, pray tell, because Big Oil sells Alaskan oil in Asia, at a much higher price than they'd receive in the US.

We're more alike than we are different. We just differ in our opinions of a political nature.

Signing out of this thread, I apologize if anyhting I've said has offended you.
 

garyaddis

Veteran Expediter
Charter Member
>Hollywood give large
>contributions to the Democratic party
>and even pay to sleep
>in the White House.Question?? are
>they poor?? I don!t think
>so.

Most, however, were once poor, and understand how very fortunate they have been. That is why they attempt to give something back. As for the "paying to sleep in the White House," son, that has always been done. Richard Nixon, Ronald Reagan, George Sr, Jimmy Carter, Clinton, even good ol' do-nothing Gerald Ford did it.
It's one of the benefits of being elected. It's called political patronage: hell, ambassadors to foreign governments are openly selected on the basis of their contributions to the party in power.


>stiff goes I think most
>labor unions generally endorse Democratic
>candidates,I think the republican voter
>is a middle class guy
>or woman who works hard
>and wants relief from excessive
>taxation that goes to support
>those who elect not to
>work,have very little personal responsibility
>and want the Government to
>always bail them out.Sure there
>are rich bankers who are
>Republicans but there are many
>Owner Operators who are struggling
>due to government policies that
>do not take into account
>the common guy..Have a good
>weekend.I have enjoyed this dialogue..

Ever hear of a guy named Andrew Mellon-Scaife? Almost singlehandedly this billionaire-who inherited-his-wealth supports
such right wing "think tanks" as the Heritage Foundation, the Cato Institute, etc. He also awards huge "donations" to Rush Limburger, Mike REagan (who btw was not permitted by his mother to attend the recent memorial to his ailing father) et al.

I too have enjoyed our debate--it' always fun to get the juices flowing. Nothing personal, guy.
 

Beaker

Veteran Expediter
Charter Member
Clinton and Gore have always claimed to be friends of organized labor. In 92, the centerpiece of the Clinton-Gore agenda for labor were proposals to “Sign the Workplace Fairness Act to ban permanent replacement of striking workers and preserve the collective bargaining process,” and “repeal Section 14b of the Taft-Hartley Act to create a level playing field between labor and management.”

Clinton and Gore were unwilling to fight to keep either promise.

In 95, Clinton did sign an executive order canceling federal contracts with companies that hire permanent replacements for lawfully striking workers, but when a lower court overturned the order, the Clinton-Gore Administration went into retreat!

8 more years of broken promises?

I don't thinks so!
 

RichM

Veteran Expediter
Charter Member
You know what this is fun,lets keep it going all weekend,the beauty of America is that we can all disagree without consequences. Debates and differences are actually what made this country strong and some one said many years ago "While I cannot agree with you I will defend to my death your right to say it"Might have been John Adams.. Wendy,,comon and chime in..
 

garyaddis

Veteran Expediter
Charter Member
>Clinton and Gore have always claimed
>to be friends of organized
>labor. In 92, the
>centerpiece of the Clinton-Gore agenda
>for labor were proposals to
>“Sign the Workplace Fairness Act
>to ban permanent replacement of
>striking workers and preserve the
>collective bargaining process,” and “repeal
>Section 14b of the Taft-Hartley
>Act to create a level
>playing field between labor and
>management.”
>
>Clinton and Gore were unwilling to
>fight to keep either promise.

>In 95, Clinton did sign an
>executive order canceling federal contracts
>with companies that hire permanent
>replacements for lawfully striking workers,
>but when a lower court
>overturned the order, the Clinton-Gore
>Administration went into retreat!
>
>8 more years of broken promises?
>
>
>I don't thinks so!

It's not a matter of broken promises. Because Clinton did try to keep his word--he did fight for us. Not his fault that the Republican Congress acts so contrary. Are you forgetting that Reagan/Bush were the primary union-busters of the past 80+ years?

Here's the tactics the Rep. used: on a bill that had already been approved by all concerned (and passed, by the Senate) the House tacked on dozens of high-dollar pork bills, and one teeny tiny rider that would have repealed the telephone tax. Which would have saved the average telephone user about $50 per year. And in the Press Conference afterward they ranted and raved that Clinton/Gore and all Democrats were anti-tax cuts because Clinton promised to veto the cholesterol-heavy bill.

Eight years of another Bush? God, for your sake as well as mine, I hope not. As it now stands it appears that Bush will win. Alright, I want you to print this entire topic, and store it in a safe place. In two-three years when inflation has climbed to 20% and unemployment is 15% or better and the stock market investors are taking a bath and the social security fund is beginning to leach money and seniors still are paying out the nose for subscriptions, I'll ask you to pull this topic out and read it. I will tell you I TOLD YOU SO.

Every time Congress meets, we the people lose a wee bit of freedom. I readily admit this. It is inevitable that eventually some sort of restriction will be placed on right of free speech--which has never been inviolable, because we are not permitted to shout Fire in a theater. The world is a frightening place now, populated by fear-mongers and hate-mongers and conspiracy freaks who keep shouting that the government is our enemy, that UN black helicopters fill our skys, that Bill Clinton is involved in a world-wide Jewish One World Government attempt to take over the United States. Christ, is it any wonder that freakazoids deck themselves out in fatigues and take to the woods with grenades between their legs and compact submachine guns in their hip pockets? Tune in David J. Smith some night btween 10-11 Central time 870 am; listen to one of Al Sharpton's speeches; visit the website of one of those skinhead-who-would-be Hitler. It ought to scare you to death.

Nobody likes government regulations. AS I mentioned in the article that started this debate, twenty-five years ago, cops and everyone else was thrilled that freight haulers (expediters included) used amphetamines to keep from killing people when they fell asleep at the wheel. But nearly three times as many trucks are on the road now, with thousands added every week, and some of these drivers are A) immature B) inexperienced C) stupid as a stump D) and just plain mean mothers who enjoy running a car off the road. Unh unh, no way do I want the trucking industry or any other industry to receive an exemption from drug-testing laws. I own guns myself and do not plan to willingly surrender them. However, my ego does not require me to shoot 10,000 rounds through an Uzi on a daily basis. Since I know even less about my neighbors than you probably know about yours, I sure as heck do not want him to be permitted to store a box of bazookas beneath his bed.

So, yes, in today's society an increasing infringement of individual rights is unpreventable. I don't like it any better than you do. But the pure fact is that where laws do not maintain order, anarchy reigns. It's a certainty that a tiny percentage of every group will be thieves and murderers. If the group is only 100 people strong, and the percentage is even a minsicule 1%, then the other 99 don't have a lot to worry about. But 1% of a population totalling 300,000,000 equals a scary 3 million criminals to roam our neighborhoods. So, we must have laws and policemen and courts--and prisons, and yes, death chambers.

If all the officers of all the billion-dollar corporations were honest, and generous, and willing to forgo profit for the betterment of all, then we'd not have a problem, a reason for you and I to disagree. But corporation execs climb the corporate ladder based on how well they stab one another in the back. This experience does not do much to develop "character." By the time that step off that top rung onto the corporate throne they are heartless. They willingly pump sewage and cancer-causing chemicals into the groundwater if cleaning it would cost $10 more than the fine will be if they're caught. History bears me out. This kind of corporate irresponsibility is common in our lifetimes--indeed, during all lifetimes. Therefore, business big and small must also be made to toe the mark, to obey laws. And who will insure that these rules are followed? Government regulators. Bureaucrats.

Perhaps it's inevitable that a large percentage of these regulators become rather full of themselves, and abusive of their power. For they are as human as the people they regulate. And the businesses they watch are not above bribery of government officials. The answer is not to eliminate the bureaucracie but prosecution of the conscienceless corporate execs who corrupt the process. Certainly the answer is not to permit the meat industry, for example, to inspect its own hamburger.

Because we are a large, rich society, and people everywhere are imperfect, self-centered greedy beasts, we must have governments. And to function effectively, governments must establish bureaucracies. And they in turn will necessarily deprive us of some of our rights.

I was once the chief accountant of a company that constructed highways under state contracts. Know why construction sites are busted up into seeminly hundreds of little patches? The contracts are set up on a "cost-plus" basis. Meaning that the contractor (not his employees, mind you) is permitted to charge his actual costs plus a "reasonable" profit. Each section of that highway is awarded under a separate contract number, so the twenty five employees you see leaning on their shovels over here are, on paper, also working on ten other stretches of highway at the same exact time. The commissioners (political appointees or sometimes elected) establish these billing procedures, and share in the slush. On a weekly basis my employer ordered me to write a large check for cash, which was used to keep everyone happy. The working stiffs who did the labor received not one thin dime more than they earned.

Another example. A brother is an electrical engineer for a nculear power station. He earns $40 per hour for sitting on his hump all day. He wonders how they can afford to pay him so much to change the occasional lightbulb. Well, utilities are also on a cost-plus basis. Their profit is greater if they pay him $40 than if he earned only $4.

It's not the system that is bad--for we must have one. The fault lies with the corruption of government workers and politicians by overly rich corporations.

I certainly am in favor of totally outlawing of all political contributions. This of course would require total public funding of the campaigns. But then rules would be established to control the campgaigns.

In this world MONEY rules. Money equates to power. And as some wise someone once said, Power corrupts. We need government to control the power-mad, the selfish, the conscienceless. And, yes, to keep a rein on wildcat truckers who would try to drive when they're too drunk or too stoned to walk across a street.

Enough said. I'm going to bed. I'll check the thread tomorrow.
 
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