R.I.P John McCain

Turtle

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He considers it for a while, then says, "OK. Yeah, sure, let's do that."

IOW he backed down.... Imho
Like so many in the media, you're trying to read his mind, and likewise you think you have successfully done so. In order to back down from something, you must first take a position or act on something, make a claim or assertion about something. And then in the face of opposition you withdraw the position, claim or assertion.

More, it's entirely possible that I missed it, but as far as I know, the only position Trump took was the action where he "signed a proclamation to fly the flag of the United States at half-staff until the day of his interment." To my knowledge, which I admit is likely incomplete since I am unable to read his mind, he has not backed down from that at all.
 
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LDB

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I'm sure Trump backed down. Because I'm sure he has nothing else to do other than go up on the roof and put the flag up and down himself. So he must have been the one. [/sarcasm]
 
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Ragman

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He considers it for a while, then says, "OK. Yeah, sure, let's do that."

IOW he backed down.... Imho
Like so many in the media, you're trying to read his mind, and likewise you think you have successfully done so. In order to back down from something, you must first take a position or act on something, make a claim or assertion about something. And then in the face of opposition you withdraw the position, claim or assertion.

More, it's entirely possible that I missed it, but as far as I know, the only position Trump took was the action where he "signed a proclamation to fly the flag of the United States at half-staff until the day of his interment." To my knowledge, which I admit is likely incomplete since I am unable to read his mind, he has not backed down from that at all.
I dont need to read his mind.... i can read his action or lack thereof..... not a peep from him until presured by the American Legion and FVW.

I.o.w backed down.
 
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LDB

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The democrats lost one of their strong leaders regardless of how any flags are flown.
 

Turtle

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The thing is, McCain was best known as shooting straight from the hip and not putting up with any BS, saying exactly what he thinks about people. Trump is best known for being politically incorrect, not putting up with any BS, and saying exactly what he thinks about people.

It would have been just as out of character and hypocritical for McCain to have wanted Trump at his funeral as it would be for Trump to suddenly become politically correct and heap praise onto McCain which nobody would believe to be sincere.

In the end, Trump is being derided by the press (and the Left, same thing) for not being politically correct and for not being insincere enough. Seriously?
 

Grizzly

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From Facebook ....




Donald J. Trump — President of the United States
July 21, 2015 ·
Donald J. Trump Orders Flags to be flown at Half-Staff at all Trump Properties in Honor of the Five Fallen Soldiers

Mr. Trump Takes Action and Shows Commitment to Military and Vets

(New York, NY) July 20th, 2015- Today Donald J. Trump has ordered all flags at Trump properties around the country to be flown at half-staff in honor of the five fallen soldiers who were tragically killed in last week's shooting. Mr. Trump has long been a dedicated supporter of our military and our Veterans and if the President won't act, he will.

Mr. Trump stated, "This disgraceful omission is unacceptable and yet another example of our incompetent politicians. It is a simple yet meaningful and important gesture that signifies our respect and recognition for these great soldiers who lost their lives. We must do better for all Americans, especially our military. We must Make America Great Again!"

In addition to the lowering of the flags, Mr. Trump has established a hotline (855- VETS- 352) and email address ([email protected]) for Veterans to share their stories about the need to reform our Veterans Administration.

If he is elected President he will take care of these and all Veteran complaints very quickly and efficiently like a world-class business man can do, but a politician has no clue.
 

Grizzly

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And once again, please stop attempting to lump anyone who has any type of criticism for The President into groups as "the left", "the press" or whatever ...

IS TRUMP PERFECT!?

Credibility is lost by attempting to defend every single thing Trump does or doesn't do.
 

Turtle

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And once again, please stop attempting to lump anyone who has any type of criticism for The President into groups as "the left", "the press" or whatever ...
I'm not at all attempting to lump anyone who criticizes Trump as being part of a group of The Left or The Press. I'm lumping The Press in with The Left because the vast majority of the mainstream media is in fact comprised of left-leaning liberals. There are exceptions, to be sure, but I'm not talking about the exceptions. There are plenty of people with criticisms of Trump who are not in any way considered to be left-leaning liberals, and I have never lumped then into groups with The Left or The Press. I lump people into groups only if they fall into that group.

For example, the group known as The Never-Trumpers (or sometimes more loosely and more inclusive the Anti-Trumpers) are just chock full of Trump criticisms, and very few of them could reasonably be lumped into groups labeled as The Left or The Press. Most of them are, in fact, conservative Republicans.

As an example of how ridiculous it is to assert that I lump anyone who criticizes Trump into either The Left or The Press, despite virtually no positive comments about Trump whatsoever and virtually nothing but criticisms, I wouldn't lump Senator Jeff Flake as a member of The Left or The Press. Same with John McCain. Bob Corker. George Will. George Bush, Junior Bush, Laura Bush, Jeb Bush, John Kasich, Ben Shapiro, Max Boot, Charles Krauthammer, Meghan McCain, Colin Powell, Condoleezza Rice, Tom Ridge, Robert Gates, The Harvard Republican Club, The Cornell Republicans, The Church of Christ of Latter Day Saints. Just to name a few who have criticized Trump ,and even voted for or endorsed candidates other than Trump.

No, I lump people into groups like The Left and The Press if they are members of those groups. If they aren't, I don't. Criticism of Trump isn't the litmus test. Sorry.
 

Turtle

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Credibility is lost by attempting to defend every single thing Trump does or doesn't do.
If you're trying to assert that I have attempted to defend "every single thing" Trump has done, then you're breathtakingly wrong and haven't been paying attention. I have been openly critical of some of his policies, appointments and nominations. True enough, I haven't called him names or criticized him personally as an emotional tactic to shut down discussion, so maybe that's where you've gotten confused.
 

muttly

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Many republicans that Turtle listed I would call Never Trumpers. Because they would never ever ever( like Dale in Step Brothers don't ever ever ever touch my drum set)support or vote for Trump. And because some of them call themselves Never Trump. Some are openly calling to vote Democrat just to defeat Trump.
 
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Ragman

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Many republicans that Turtle listed I would call Never Trumpers. Because they would never ever ever( like Dale in Step Brothers don't ever ever ever touch my drum set)support or vote for Trump. And because some of them call themselves Never Trump. Some are openly calling to vote Democrat just to defeat Trump.
Whats your point?
 

LDB

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That there are a large number of dumber than dirt morons encouraging actions detrimental to the nation only because of their hatred of an individual that until 3 years ago most of them loved? Hypocrites and morons.
 

muttly

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Many republicans that Turtle listed I would call Never Trumpers. Because they would never ever ever( like Dale in Step Brothers don't ever ever ever touch my drum set)support or vote for Trump. And because some of them call themselves Never Trump. Some are openly calling to vote Democrat just to defeat Trump.
Whats your point?
Lol. My point is that many already lump themselves into groups already: Never Trumpers, The Resistance, Me Too.
 
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Ragman

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That there are a large number of dumber than dirt morons encouraging actions detrimental to the nation only because of their hatred of an individual that until 3 years ago most of them loved? Hypocrites and morons.
Was the name calling necessary?
Sheesh.....
 

LDB

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Was the accurate labeling and representation necessary? No more or less so than any other comments made.
 

muttly

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Off topic? My post was in response to another post, who was responding to another post, which apparently was...off topic? Lol
 

Grizzly

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And of course, I'm currently in Phoenix ....
Motorcade currently rolling through town bringing McCain to the state capitol building ....
 
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Turtle

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Yeah, not too sure about the off-topic thing. I was accused of mislumping people into groups for reasons that play no part in the lumping

If I were to lump anyone who criticizes Trump into a group, it certainly wouldn't be one as constrained and limited as "The Left" or "The Press." Such a group would have to be far more inclusive, such as "Everybody Who Isn't Donald J Trump," because he's the only one who has never had a criticism of Trump.

The accusation that I lump people into certain groups, like The Left or The Press, simply or solely because they criticize Trump, is a specious charge (superficially plausible or attractive or satisfying, but actually wrong).

It kind of reminds me of how The Left and especially those in The Press constantly espouse the equally specious claim that any news that Trump doesn't like he labels as FAKE NEWS. It's superficially plausible, attractive, and quite satisfying because it allows The Press to play the victim. It's also actually wrong.

Trump labels as FAKE NEWS any news reporting that is intentionally misleading, spun to further an agenda or narrative, passes off opinion as factual news, or is outright fabricated or false.

For example, the 12 Diet Cokes a day story was one he didn't like, and was certainly unflattering and presented in a negative way, but he never called it FAKE NEWS, because while it was petty and immature and not really newsworthy, it was nevertheless true and accurate. One could argue that by fixating on it for several days or weeks as the MSM did, as if it was newsworthy or something, it morphed into FAKE NEWS because the fixation itself was to further an agenda, but Trump himself never made that argument.

CNN's Editor-at-large, Chris Cillizza, wrote about this very thing regarding Trump's views on words "fake" and "negative."

"To Trump, those words mean the same thing. Negative news coverage is fake news. Fake news is negative news coverage."

That's just another example of a 'journalist' who thinks they can read the mind of the president. It also allows breathtakingly faulty logic to be employed. The mainstream media rarely, if ever (never, to my knowledge) crafts fake or misleading news in order to present the president in a positive way. It's always negative. So to say fake news is negative news isn't inaccurate, but to flip that and say negative news is fake news is simply not true. Some (a lot) of the negative news is fake, but some is not.

But Cillizza, while claiming to be a journalist, has also flatly stated that he's more interested in clicks and shock value rather than journalistic integrity and accuracy. According to him, he's leading the charge of new journalism.
 
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