We are looking for opinions on income potential... We are looking at running team in either a straight truck ( class 8 stretched with 22 foot box with lift-gate or Sprinter with long wheelbase and moveable divider to carry 3 pallets if needed. Our home would be south cental OK. . We are even looking for ballpark figures on 1099s with total miles driven. We can get a good estimate from that. Anything would help. We cant check this forum everday but will check whenever we can. Thank you for your opinions and help. Dan and Mandy
Opinions on income
- Thread starter Dresow
- Start date
mypie
Seasoned Expediter
I may not be the best person to answer this question, because I am not currently in the expediting business. But, that being said, I have done quite a bit of research on the issue. So, I will take a stab at it . . . I know if I quote something wrong someone will quickly correct my error!
The correct answer is that there is no real answer to your question . . . this is because there are too many contingencies and variables and each contingency can expect a variable pay rate. The easy answer is read this website and look at each company carefully.
But, that is not what you asked . . . So, here goes:
First - What company will you be working for? Each company pays a different cpm. Within that cpm, there are different rates based upon your years of service and experience level.
Second - What type of truck will you be driving? Van? Straight Truck? Semi? Each pays at a different rate.
Third - Company Driver, Lease Operator, or Owner Operator? Each pays, again, at a different rate. If you are a Company Driver the company takes all the liabilities. If you are a Lease Operator you split your pay (usually 60/40) with the lease owner and he pays for repairs, etc., whatever the lease agreement says. If you are an Owner Operator you get the best rate of pay, but are left with all the liability and maintenance - if prices go up you take the hit.
Fourth - Now you know who you are driving for . . . what you are driving . . . and how your ownership is . . . You are on the road and driving - Are you driving long-haul (3 weeks cross-country), short-haul (home every weekend) or something else? Do you get paid lay-over? Dead-head? Etc.? What if you get sent to some obscure place to pick up a load and the load isn't ready for 3 days - and there are no other loads for you to take in the area? You're not making money if your wheels aren't turning. A company driver will get the load first, because no matter what if a company driver sits it costs the company money. From there Lease Operators and Owner Operators split the rest.
The best advice I got on this was from a driver that said "Most companies are about the same", (it will be up to you to sort out the bad ones and there are bad ones), "once you pick the companies you would like to work for . . . then its just a matter of looking at their benefits package."
So, brush up on your spreadsheet abilities and start doing your homework. In the end, the research you do now could make or break you, so doing a good thorough research can never be under valued.
Best of luck to you.
Mypie
The correct answer is that there is no real answer to your question . . . this is because there are too many contingencies and variables and each contingency can expect a variable pay rate. The easy answer is read this website and look at each company carefully.
But, that is not what you asked . . . So, here goes:
First - What company will you be working for? Each company pays a different cpm. Within that cpm, there are different rates based upon your years of service and experience level.
Second - What type of truck will you be driving? Van? Straight Truck? Semi? Each pays at a different rate.
Third - Company Driver, Lease Operator, or Owner Operator? Each pays, again, at a different rate. If you are a Company Driver the company takes all the liabilities. If you are a Lease Operator you split your pay (usually 60/40) with the lease owner and he pays for repairs, etc., whatever the lease agreement says. If you are an Owner Operator you get the best rate of pay, but are left with all the liability and maintenance - if prices go up you take the hit.
Fourth - Now you know who you are driving for . . . what you are driving . . . and how your ownership is . . . You are on the road and driving - Are you driving long-haul (3 weeks cross-country), short-haul (home every weekend) or something else? Do you get paid lay-over? Dead-head? Etc.? What if you get sent to some obscure place to pick up a load and the load isn't ready for 3 days - and there are no other loads for you to take in the area? You're not making money if your wheels aren't turning. A company driver will get the load first, because no matter what if a company driver sits it costs the company money. From there Lease Operators and Owner Operators split the rest.
The best advice I got on this was from a driver that said "Most companies are about the same", (it will be up to you to sort out the bad ones and there are bad ones), "once you pick the companies you would like to work for . . . then its just a matter of looking at their benefits package."
So, brush up on your spreadsheet abilities and start doing your homework. In the end, the research you do now could make or break you, so doing a good thorough research can never be under valued.
Best of luck to you.
Mypie
arkjarhead
Veteran Expediter
I'm going to be upfront and honest with you. Forget about a Sprinter. The market for Sprinters and Cargo Vans is flooded. Almost all of the Sprinter and Cargo Van O/Os will tell you that a newbie hardly has a chance. Take it for what it's worth. I have a good feeling others will back me up on this.
Oh by the way, what are currently doing employment wise? Just curious.
Oh by the way, what are currently doing employment wise? Just curious.
mypie
Seasoned Expediter
Why, you looking for a J.O.B.? I heard on the news the other day that the one place in the country where there is no recession is in (you'll have to check this yourself because I could be wrong) Anderson, TX. They need rough necks for oil drilling. The town is growing. Money is there to be made.
If you are serious about going into expediting, you would serve yourself well to research the posts and the archives here at EO. Then take that information to former, current drivers, and recruiters.
There are numerous variables in this business that can't come anywhere close to an answer by looking at a 1099.
Gross revenue numbers mean nothing. It is the net numbers you need. Same with mileage figures. Not a lot of value there either unless you know what mileage is paid, what isn't and at what rate. Then you have to take those numbers and put them against the type of vehicle and the costs to operate that vehicle.
It can get complicated with 1,000 scenarios and answers. Take your time and really do some research to find whether this will or won't work for you.
There are numerous variables in this business that can't come anywhere close to an answer by looking at a 1099.
Gross revenue numbers mean nothing. It is the net numbers you need. Same with mileage figures. Not a lot of value there either unless you know what mileage is paid, what isn't and at what rate. Then you have to take those numbers and put them against the type of vehicle and the costs to operate that vehicle.
It can get complicated with 1,000 scenarios and answers. Take your time and really do some research to find whether this will or won't work for you.
nightcreacher
Veteran Expediter
As Im a tractor trailer driver I cant give you a really good answer,but do exactly as DaveKC suggested.But i can tell you,stay far far away from a van or sprinter,every expedite company is loaded with them,and unless you are independently wealthy,and dont need to work,this is not a good move.
While I agree with DaveKC that the most important income number is your bottom-line, net revenue number, I do not agree that gross revenue number means nothing.
A carrier will look more favorably on a truck that grosses say $200,000 a year than on a similar truck that grosses $100,000. That's easy for the carrier to do, since it is the owner-operator that needs to be concerned about his or her own net revenue.
But still, what your carrier thinks matters. Especially if times slow and they are thinking about downsizing the fleet. Or, if you are trying to gain something like entry into the White Glove or Elite Services credentials. All other things being equal, the higher-grossing truck will have an edge.
I attended a seminar once where a true-story example was given about a big-rig driver that grossed over $300,000 in a year and went bankrupt. The point made was not that the driver grossed too much or too little. It was that the driver managed his money poorly and spent it foolishly.
All by itself, a gross revenue number means, not nothing, but little. Combined with additional numbers like number of trips made, miles driven, time in service, acceptance percentage and others; a profile can be created that then can be meaningfully compared with other trucks to guage one's performance and results.
Drivers sometimes do this on the road. More than once, I have sat down with a fellow FedEx Custom Critcial contractor with computers open to compare numbers. It's a great way to discuss strategies and get a better sense of what works and what does not.
Gross revenue is not the most important number, but it is meaningful and necessary. A performance analysis that includes all the numbers except gross revenue would be as meaningless as an analysis that included only the gross revenue number.
A carrier will look more favorably on a truck that grosses say $200,000 a year than on a similar truck that grosses $100,000. That's easy for the carrier to do, since it is the owner-operator that needs to be concerned about his or her own net revenue.
But still, what your carrier thinks matters. Especially if times slow and they are thinking about downsizing the fleet. Or, if you are trying to gain something like entry into the White Glove or Elite Services credentials. All other things being equal, the higher-grossing truck will have an edge.
I attended a seminar once where a true-story example was given about a big-rig driver that grossed over $300,000 in a year and went bankrupt. The point made was not that the driver grossed too much or too little. It was that the driver managed his money poorly and spent it foolishly.
All by itself, a gross revenue number means, not nothing, but little. Combined with additional numbers like number of trips made, miles driven, time in service, acceptance percentage and others; a profile can be created that then can be meaningfully compared with other trucks to guage one's performance and results.
Drivers sometimes do this on the road. More than once, I have sat down with a fellow FedEx Custom Critcial contractor with computers open to compare numbers. It's a great way to discuss strategies and get a better sense of what works and what does not.
Gross revenue is not the most important number, but it is meaningful and necessary. A performance analysis that includes all the numbers except gross revenue would be as meaningless as an analysis that included only the gross revenue number.
We drive tractor trailer for Landstar. 14 years exp and my wife and I have been driving team for 7. We are looking at staying with Landstar because of the percentage pay. We drove a straight truck 6 years ago for 4 months and enjoyed that. All we ever saw was the fuel advance from the owner. But the truck was making as much as ours is now but we never saw what we were supposed to. Also a 1099 can tell a lot with the total mileage. All of our expenses would be lower than they are now because of the lighter weight and the truck would last longer but we have a good idea of the expenses are.
The reason I don't pay attention to a gross number is that it has no value unless you know the investment dollars against it.
What the carrier thinks doesn't necessarily translate into revenue. That is driven by the market and customer needs.
Since this is a business, return on investment is what I pay attention to. A lower grossing truck may be ideal because it has a fraction of the risk that a higher one would. That higher grossing truck will require a much larger cost to replace when that time comes.
Real simple, for every dollar you put in, what are you getting back as a return.
I probably should add as well, that if it slows down, it just slows down. We have been with several different carriers over the years with both dry vans and reefers and the high dollar equipment slowed the same. The carriers didn't move the reefer WG trucks any more than they did the other. Only difference was the losses were higher on the specialty equipment because it is a more difficult piece of equipment to move from one carrier to the other.
What the carrier thinks doesn't necessarily translate into revenue. That is driven by the market and customer needs.
Since this is a business, return on investment is what I pay attention to. A lower grossing truck may be ideal because it has a fraction of the risk that a higher one would. That higher grossing truck will require a much larger cost to replace when that time comes.
Real simple, for every dollar you put in, what are you getting back as a return.
I probably should add as well, that if it slows down, it just slows down. We have been with several different carriers over the years with both dry vans and reefers and the high dollar equipment slowed the same. The carriers didn't move the reefer WG trucks any more than they did the other. Only difference was the losses were higher on the specialty equipment because it is a more difficult piece of equipment to move from one carrier to the other.
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Falligator
Expert Expediter
Let the loads come to you. I found that dh costs more than just staying put also depends on what area you are in.---even tho i still dh every now and then (home mainly) unless, of course, the boards near you are swamped with vans and you have no choice then it's really where you think that would be the closest profitable boards. However, I'm still new at this and learning the ropes.
Single Van Driver
Single Van Driver
nightcreacher
Veteran Expediter
My co-driver is paid on pecentage,so he looks at gross pay,I look at what I'm going to have left to send home after I do the load.If I do 200000 dollars hauling just D loads,or doing 170000 dollars hauling just E loads, my bottom line is going to be better running just the E loads,so therefore gross revenue would mean nothing as with the E loads I'd be running many less miles
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We are a team in a Sprinter with Express 1 and still doing ok during this period....I said ok not great, terrific nor busy...just ok.
For the Chinese, 2008 is the Year of the Rat; for the expediters, it is the year of anything but a van, cargo or Sprinter. I say this in general terms for those folks thinking of entering this business and leasing to an expedite carrier. Whatever you truck of choice, there is a learning curve that must be surmounted before real success will be realized.