Newbees you need to read RE: DannyO Brooms Q.

[Broompilot]

Newbee Van wanabees. Please heed this mans advice. I cannot speak for Van owners but this seems to sum up what I have seen, and what seems to be the talk of Van Operators out there.

Look at the #s he is posting $100 a day to $150 a day for just local. You can generate much more on the open road but so goes your expenses with it thus his #s seem to reflect the true profit of Van Operators.

It is none of my business what anyone makes, but I question the survival on those #s. I can easily spend that in a day around the house, groceries, a new set of underwear, fuel for my personal vehicle, daughter needs a $20. and its gone. I am pretty good with $ but I have not found a secret to not spending any of it in life.

Believe Danny is very up front and honest, good post hope you agree and also if you can add to it. I am not out to save the world, I do enjoy helping others when possible, and there are some Van Operators that are very successfull, seems like when the heat is off of them (another income) they can do very very well. Investigate and know the industry before deciding to do this.

 

[DannyD]

To add to this a little bit.

I feel that in general, a van can't generate enough income for an owner & a driver, if they aren't related. A father/son, husband/wife might be a little bit different. Based on that logic, a van generally won't support a person trying to provide for a family. On a per hour basis, you can make more money running pizzas than ya can doing expediting.

The money in expediting comes because you're out on the road so much & ya can work so many more hours. Like ya might make $400/day going from point A to point B. The challenge though, is ya may sit at point B for a day before you get another run. So that $400 is now divided by 36 (using 36 hours as my example here) minus your expenses. So that doesn't come out to a whole lot on a per hour basis.

If you're going to do this job, it should be more because you enjoy the lifestyle of it than because you think you'll make a lot of money at it. You can do ok if you're a single guy w/out much expenses or if you're married & the wife works, that kind of thing.

Awhile back a friend of mine was considering this job. I can't recall exactly what he made at the time, but I think it was like $12.50/hour plus benefits. He has a wife & child. He's the sole provider for his family. We ran some numbers & came to the conclusion that keeping his present job was a better way to go.

To give ya some of my numbers:

2005 Income was just a touch under 40,000. (for 10 months work)
Van Payment/Insurance 5000 (would have been 3600 if I didn't have a Sprinter for the last 2 months)
Gas: approx. 10,000-12,000. I don't have the exact amount I paid for gas. I just know I drove 68,000 miles to make that 40K.
Apartment in Toronto: 3000 This you won't have to have. I got it because I didn't want to live in my truck all the time.

There's other expenses, but right there 40K becomes a lot closer to 20. If I averaged 50 miles per hour driving, I spent 1360 hours driving. That doesn't count time sitting/waiting. To make it easy, lets say I spent 640 hours sitting. That's 2000 hours of work for $20,000/year. $10/hour.

Yeesh, I gotta stop doing these numbers. I'm gettin depressed!! =) Seriously though, those numbers are why I'm back to playin poker & now doing this job part time.

Hopefully this doesn't come off as bashing this job. I'm doing it & for the most part like it. In fairness, others have done better numbers than I have. I'll flat out tell ya I'm a homing pigeon & wanna get home a fair amount. Those who are willing to stay on the road for long time can do better. I bet there's also some that have done worse though.

So think about what ya REALLY want out of life. This line of work might be your calling. I can't say because I don't know your situation. I'm mainly trying to get across that odds are ya won't become wealthy doing this line of work. So if ya take up expediting, think of it more like you're getting paid a lil something to visit new places.

Good luck,
Danny

 

[Broompilot]

Danny I personally want to just say THANKS, nice job. This may be ones calling, but BILLS will never stop just cause the Post Office has a day off.

These are the #s I have been hearing about. And most drivers could never be as sharp as Danny is. He is a good business person who knows when he is not making it others want to continue on nothing. And what I mean by a good business person, sure he is not making much profit, but this is what he loves and is doing it but also realizes its not paying the bills.

Danny good luck, I hope it begins to follow you everywhere.


Broom

 

[DooWop]

So true, so true, so true. If you are truly set on trying this with a van, my advice from personal experience is to buy used and buy a gasser, not a diesel. Do any outfitting such as e-trak installation yourself. A sleeper partition can easily be made from metal studding that you can buy very cheaply at a Loews or Home Depot. Even with these cost cutters, it is very difficult to make a living with a van. I saw the writing on the wall, or should I say in my checkbook, and could easily see that each week I was actually falling further and further behind. Fortunately I had a pension and other assets and the wife had a decent job. I packed it in after 10 weeks, but still sustained some minor financial damage. Maybe I did not give it enough time, who knows? I just saw trends that would lead me to at best a break even point, and got out before things really could go bad. Believe me, have another source of income. You will have difficulty supporting yourself let alone a family. To me owning a van would be a way for a retiree to supplement their income, but only with a used, paid for gasser, and then staying out only 1-2 weeks at a time. Otherwise you will lose your shirt. Just go to classifieds on EO and you will see people selling their tricked out vans that they can't pay for.

Regards

Doowop

 

[FIS53]

Definitely making money in a van is tough, especially now that it's pretty slow. Expect to do between 45,000 to 60,000 for the year. If it picks up and companies start shipping small loads again then it can be good. I've had 100000 plus years (yes more than one or two).
Last year I made under 60000 and spent roughly 500/month on maintenance. This income only paid the bills and left zero for savings etc (this year i'm the only income for house).
Recently I talked with a fellow at a company I used to run with and he had the wrong attitude for making money there. He thinks he's going to do well only being out around 50-60 hours a week! Got news for him! I did ok but at being available everyday for 24 hours and running everything. I don't recommend running everything for everyone as there are a lot of poor paying runs and it doesn't make sense for doing them. I did it with a plan in mind and it worked for me but the hours on the road mean no home life.
As I said in another post if you're going into a van, be prepared to be available for 26-28 days a month for the first year or two. Get the company to realize you're dependable, available and can do the job. This means learning everything you can and fast, as well as getting to know the dispatchers (very important).
Basically in a van you're in for a rough ride until it picks up so it would be good to have second income for the house and maybe even a part time job on the side. I've gotten back into the computer business. Bit tough when I'm on the road but sofar working ok.
Rob Fis

 

[rfrogger120]

From the estimate you gave $45000 to $60000 would be the average, if i read it right. Lets say a "B" unit would make $45000 for the year, would it be safe to say that 40% of that would be business expenses only and the remaining 60% would be personal. If not what percentage would be business expense only? What I mean by "business expense" (food,gas,maint,showers,etc.) just the OTR expenses.

 

[FIS53]

Wow you won't like this answer. Several guys are running those numbers in reverse 60-65% business in the current environment for vans. That's why keeping expenses low is an execise in money management. But usually the 40% would be about right. Your truck payment (if you have one) is a heavy hit after fuel and maintenance. Food you can control with utilizing a coolatron and buying good things to eat that you can store for a couple of days and buying drinks at Wallymart etc. The lower your fixed costs (truck payment, insc, etc) the better as the variable costs are the ones you can work on while on the road.
Rob Fis

 

[graywolf71]

Ok i understand the van information, but how do the number crunch for straight trucks. There's more work for them, right? And it should work out even better for sub contractors, so long as your willing to put in the hours.