Is it starting?

[greg334]

A while ago I was educated on the finer points of Nazi Germany by people who lived there. It wasn't a text book education but a true to life education that haunts me.

The one thing that I get nervous about is the way it was done, for the greater good and to get them on a road to recovery. Very few remember the depression, surly there are few who lived as adults through it left. We make comparisons to that time with our own, saying we must do this or have a New New Deal to save that, we are not following FDR and the path the US took then but we are actually following the path of Germany and already elected one leader who is acting like a God. The rhetoric, the people who are controlling things, the ignoring of the people who elected them, the AIG mess, all that and more all point to totalitarianism.

I posted a link up Are You A Domestic Terrorist and would like people to go there and down load the PDF to read it carefully.

I want people to know that this was the first step to real power in Germany for the Nazis, identifying groups who they would need to control.

 

[layoutshooter]

Yes Greg, it has started. You know it and I know it. The problem is that many don't. Why? They never studied history. Oh, they might have learned a date or two, but they NEVER really studied history. We have the result today. Layoutshooter

 

[greg334]

Well I can't wait to see the looks on their faces when they find out they can't vote.

 

[letzrockexpress]

O.K., I have read the pdf on the reemergence of the militias. I have read the posts that both of you have written on this subject. I know there is at least some creedence to what you are saying. I get the feeling from these posts that you guys are waiting to see what happens so you can say I told you so. I ask you this: What do you propose we do to turn this around? What can we do today to rally the people and stop the bleeding? I too am a student of history. I know that without action by the people, the machine wins. I am willing to act. Put your money where your mouth is. Show me something concrete and I'm in...Seriously.

 

[greg334]

What do you propose we do to turn this around?

It has to start with the people, and it has to start with them understanding that incumbents are the real problem, the career politicians who think they are better than we are.

Some of the groups who are trying to get people to vote and think at the same time can be targets because they are not of the ''right" political leaning or they have one indicator on that list.

What can we do today to rally the people and stop the bleeding?

I am doing it quietly, I am starting with my family and going from there. I gave up on trying to talk to ''truckers", some of them are so ignorant, it makes me sick.

Being a student of history is easy (not saying you don't get it, I think you do but others don't), understanding the ramifications of history if it happens again is what sets people apart. I learned from hearing the stories and engaging the people first hand, I didn't read about it in a book or on the web as a lot of others have - or worst yet sit in a class room or lecture hall and have it interpreted for me. Some of the stories were gruesome and some didn't make sense until I was older.

With that, it also matters if the person is capable of deciding outside of the herd, meaning being independent with their thoughts, feelings and actions. If you studied mass psychology and the herd effect in depth, you will understand that our last election was not an election at all, it was a true stolen election. The mass media, the Hollywood people and all the others who we are exposed to most of all told us who to vote for and why. It isn't hard to understand why we can't get people to vote to get us out of this mess, especially when I hear ''you got to vote for him to right an injustice" or something along those lines. It makes me question what injustice has been done to this person and why should I be told who to vote for.

It is like the attack on the citizen journalist, the purpose of the 1st amendment was not to have a controlling organized press but a free press that everyone can participate in. Brain Williams made a speech I think last year in which he was calling for the end of the citizen journalist in order to protect the organized press.

 

[Pilgrim]

What's starting is the rebellion of the workers or proletariat, if you prefer. I assume everyone who pays attention to current events has seen similar articles to this one from the Guardian on the network news or in their newspaper or on their website of choice (bold emphasis mine):

"AIG's employees have been subjected to death threats since the company handed out $165m (£115m) in "retention" awards to employees in its disastrously loss-making financial products division this week.
Recipients of the bonuses said they feared for their own safety. A UNION BACKED CAMPAIGN GROUP is today taking protesters on a bus tour of AIG executives' homes in a wealthy enclave of Connecticut known as the 'gold coast'."

AIG warns staff to travel in pairs after death threats over bonuses | Business | The Guardian

This public hysteria is the direct result of the corrupt practices of our Congress (both parties), the false statements and hype being spread by the Obama administration, and the demonization of big business in general and AIG in particular by the Democrats and their willing accomplices in the mainstream media. There's yet another article today from the AP announcing that the amount of bonus money paid by AIG was actually $218 Million: Connecticut seeks answers on AIG bonus documents

The facts are plain as day and well documented that members of Congress and Obama's Sec. Treas. knew about these bonuses well in advance and actually made sure language was inserted in the Stimulus Bill that protected the bonuses. However, very little coverage is offered in the media pointing the finger of blame at these corrupt politicians who intentionally allowed these payouts to go forward. The outrage is instead channelled toward "evil corporate executives."

What's even more bothersome is that this is just the start of the socialist agenda being imposed on our country by this radical leftist president and his minions. The sycophantic press does his bidding without giving even a half-assed effort toward presenting a balanced presentation of the facts. The result is lynch mobs organized by the unions (re: proletariat) are now going on vigilante raids to private citizens' homes. What do you think it will take for one of these events to turn violent, especially after the union thugs have had a few beers from the refreshment selection offered on the buses?

Hopefully, cooler heads in the Senate will prevail and stop the illegal taxation of these bonuses, and someone will have the guts to point the finger at the real culprits that allowed this mess to happen. Even Maxine Waters (of all people) has called out Obama and Geithner for letting this mess happen. However, who's going to be the next targeted villan of Obama - maybe the Pharmaceutical industry? Or perhaps the evil doctors that make too much money by taking advantage of the sick?

Maybe it's time to go online or to the library and check out a few books and/or articles about Karl Marx and Vladimir Lenin. History does have a way of repeating itself.

 

[greg334]

However, who's going to be the next targeted villan of Obama - maybe the Pharmaceutical industry?

They won't. The pharma industry actually like people like him, they give a lot of money to the dems in hidden ways because the medicare part D program.

Just to throw this in, you do know that there are more books on Marx, Marxism and other socialist center subjects in book stores and libraries than there are on Washington, Jefferson and Adams?

I have some of the old Soviet printed material that was produced in the 30's and reading it today is getting me scared.

 

[layoutshooter]

No letzrocketexpress, it is the exact opposite, I do not want to see this happening. What can be done? Write your legislatures and DEMAND that they stop the trashing of our Constitution, including the Right to Keep and Bear arms since that is the FINAL Check and Balance to insure our dominence over the government. Vote out ANYONE in office today in the next election and continue to do so. Start to demand qualified and quality candidates. One way to do that on a national level would be to require the same backround checks that intelligence agents are required to go through to be allowed access to clasified infomation for any person in any elected office that will be handling classifed documents. INCLUDING the same polygraphs. That requirement would have exclued Obama/Biden and Hlliary. They would NEVER pass a counter-intelliegence backround check. Neither would most of the House or Senate.

I know it seems as if I rant. part of that is my lack of writing skills. I did used to write for a living but I wrote technical papers, nothing like this. Part of it is that I am SO passinate about this. Freedom is very fragil and precious and we are just letting them take it away from us. That to me is just un-believible. If we ever "run into" each other on the road I will go into some detail about things I learned de-briefing Soviet defectors. Tell you about a particular family member that I was never able to meet because the Soviets would not allow him a visa to visit the states. (He was Polish) All of this can be put into perspective. Hundreds of thousands of your countrymen have DIED to protect this freedom for you. If YOU allow this government to take that away all of those lives will have been lost in vain. It is up to the individual. YOU have a responsibility to protect that freedom. Layoutshoter

 

[letzrockexpress]

Greg said:
"Being a student of history is easy (not saying you don't get it, I think you do but others don't), understanding the ramifications of history if it happens again is what sets people apart. I learned from hearing the stories and engaging the people first hand, I didn't read about it in a book or on the web as a lot of others have - or worst yet sit in a class room or lecture hall and have it interpreted for me. Some of the stories were gruesome and some didn't make sense until I was older."

Seeing it first hand is apples to oranges to reading it in a book. The unfortunate thing is most people, including me, only know about it from teachings or reading. If it is to be, it is up to people like you who have seen it up close and personal to edify the rest of us.

Greg said:
"I am doing it quietly, I am starting with my family and going from there. I gave up on trying to talk to ''truckers", some of them are so ignorant, it makes me sick."

I'm hip man. That's the irony of this forum...

Greg said:
"It is like the attack on the citizen journalist, the purpose of the 1st amendment was not to have a controlling organized press but a free press that everyone can participate in. Brain Williams made a speech I think last year in which he was calling for the end of the citizen journalist in order to protect the organized press."

I agree, but that is why checks and balances are so important. It seems to me that ranting from the other side is not the answer either. Friction is good, but when you take into consideration the average American you mentioned earlier who probably isn't paying close attention for whatever reason, be it ignorance or apathy, etc., Appealing to their sense of reason in small doses seems to me the better route. The reasonable people are usually the ones who vote. The fanatic's audiences are generally let's say, less than reasonable, and probably aren't registered to vote, let alone going to vote.
Someone mentioned earlier that this past presidential election was stolen. I don't know if that is a good description of what happened but it was definitely domineered. It was well organized and the campaign had a message, layed out and communicated in a clear concise, simple way. The masses responded to that. It's not magic. Ankle biting does not create mass appeal.
__________________

 

[Pilgrim]

They won't. The pharma industry actually like people like him, they give a lot of money to the dems in hidden ways because the medicare part D program.

That won't help them. A lot of these AIG bonus recipients were big contributors to the Democrat party - one of the big ironies to this whole mess. Remember, these execs live in CT and Sen. Chris Dodd (D-CT) was the one that changed the wording of the stimulus bill to allow the bonuses to be paid. Of course there's always the oil company executives - remember they're still making too much money. Hillary wasn't the only one to say she would take those excess profits away from them and give those funds back to the people. "From each according to his ability, to each according to his need." - Karl Marx

I have some of the old Soviet printed material that was produced in the 30's and reading it today is getting me scared.

My point exactly - this is following the template of how revolutions get started. Hitler was an extremely gifted public speaker and thought to be a charismatic new leader. He didn't have today's media, but he spoke often to large crowds in his effort to foment revolution. I don't think Obama embodies the evil of Hitler. IMHO he's just a dedicated fanatic, a naive radical left-winger, and the most inexperienced president we've ever had - that in itself makes a dangerous combination. Now couple that with the most incompetent House Speaker in our history (another liberal fanatic), a sleazy Senate majority leader and a solid democrat majority and look what we've got.

 

[greg334]

Seeing it first hand is apples to oranges to reading it in a book. The unfortunate thing is most people, including me, only know about it from teachings or reading. If it is to be, it is up to people like you who have seen it up close and personal to edify the rest of us.

I agree somewhat, the problem with this is that people do have a chance to learn a lot more than they want to by engaging others. A lot of people are closed minded to the point that they would rather say someone is wrong because they don't understand it or it goes against their thoughts after being brainwashed. Others can't simply grasp what others are saying, thinking that the entire explanation is arcane in both fact and substance.

The other part of this is how it is passed on to others, many of the teachers today are not allowed to express themselves through the art of teaching but rather have to follow a revised history.

I am no expert on anything, I just took advantage of talking to people, which I used to like to do.

 

[layoutshooter]

What we have with that combination is a "Nightmare" Layoutshooter

 

[letzrockexpress]

No letzrocketexpress, it is the exact opposite, I do not want to see this happening. What can be done? Write your legislatures and DEMAND that they stop the trashing of our Constitution, including the Right to Keep and Bear arms since that is the FINAL Check and Balance to insure our dominence over the government. Vote out ANYONE in office today in the next election and continue to do so. Start to demand qualified and quality candidates. One way to do that on a national level would be to require the same backround checks that intelligence agents are required to go through to be allowed access to clasified infomation for any person in any elected office that will be handling classifed documents. INCLUDING the same polygraphs. That requirement would have exclued Obama/Biden and Hlliary. They would NEVER pass a counter-intelliegence backround check. Neither would most of the House or Senate.

I know it seems as if I rant. part of that is my lack of writing skills. I did used to write for a living but I wrote technical papers, nothing like this. Part of it is that I am SO passinate about this. Freedom is very fragil and precious and we are just letting them take it away from us. That to me is just un-believible. If we ever "run into" each other on the road I will go into some detail about things I learned de-briefing Soviet defectors. Tell you about a particular family member that I was never able to meet because the Soviets would not allow him a visa to visit the states. (He was Polish) All of this can be put into perspective. Hundreds of thousands of your countrymen have DIED to protect this freedom for you. If YOU allow this government to take that away all of those lives will have been lost in vain. It is up to the individual. YOU have a responsibility to protect that freedom. Layoutshoter

I certainly agree with you what you say here. I just felt a couple of your previous posts came across as fanatical and a little scary...

 

[layoutshooter]

LOL. Well, at least it got your attention!! There is nothing wrong with being passionate about your beliefs, which I am. I just need to practive my writing skills. Layoutshooter

 

[letzrockexpress]

By the way, I happen to think that Obama isn't the real enemy of the second amendment. I don't want to sound clichet' or like some right winger as I try to remain centrist, but this Pelosi chick has got to go...She IS the enemy of the second amendment, big business, free trade, and on and on.....

 

[layoutshooter]

Oh yea, the Wicked Witch of the West!! She is horrible. Don't be fooled about Obama, he is 100% AGAINST private gun ownership. So is Biden and Hillary (the Wicked Witch of the East) Ted (kill 'em all) Kennedy and most of the Dumb-O-Crat party. They are also against most of the rest of the Bill of Rights. I am not sure what a "centerist" is. I do not believe in left or right wing, liberal or conservitive, I don't like either the Re-Bum-Li-can or Dumb-O-Crat paries. I ONLY believe in a couple of things, our Constitution and right and wrong. There is NO middle ground for me. I live in a black and white world. No Gray. Just right and just wrong. I am a simple man with simple beliefs. Layoutshooter

 

[greg334]

Now why would you feel Nancy is an enemy of big business, she has certainly benefited from the tax changes Bush made and the ethic rules she changed in the house.

OH and can you imagine if we have that racist Biden as president?

 

[layoutshooter]

You might some day. I can see a senario where those on the left that own Obama and put him in office "do him in" as a step to them taking control. Biden is another really scary dude. layoutshooter

 

[letzrockexpress]

You might some day. I can see a senario where those on the left that own Obama and put him in office "do him in" as a step to them taking control. Biden is another really scary dude. layoutshooter

Biden has received a grade of "F" from the NRA, but if you read his voting record, he really isn't against guns for anyone other than criminals and children. He is himself a gun owner and has voted for most bills that benefit gun manufacturers.

Hillary Clinton also received an grade of "F", due mostly to the Assault rifle ban during the Clinton asdministration. Her father was a gun owner and her husband has been a duck hunter, not the fancy shmancy kind you are, but a duck hunter nonetheless. I don't fear them. I have been a gun owner for over 30 years. I get the argument. They don't scare me. Criminals will always have guns no matter what the law says. These people know that. If the day were ever to come when they try to take our guns, it would be because of something way bigger than a few politicians...

Besides all that, even if that day were to come, are you really gonna give them up? I'm not.

 

[greg334]

The scary thing about Biden is not his gun control votes, it is his whole persona. He is a racist and he is a loose cannon. He was the worst choice for VP but who else was there, Hillary? Obama would not have put Hillary in the VP position, she would have overshadowed Obama on many issues and already have moved a bit away from the official WH position.

The other thing that Biden will be doing is the ALGORE thing. Back in '94 ALGORE had a big press confrence on the WH lawn, he had a forklift with a 8 foot stack of paper on it - He was "reinventing" government. Now a couple weeks ago, Biden and Obama did the same exact dog and pony show but without the paper, they are going to bring accountablity back to government. My impression is that this is a speration of powers thing, the congress makes the laws, not the president.