Is it important for your carrier to be certified?

flatbedin

Seasoned Expediter
This probably should be posted in the newbie forum, but I figured that their were veterans that sometime ask themselves this question also. So, is it important for your carrier that you leased to be certified.

I know of a few brokers that will not load guys trucks if the company that they are leased to is not certified. And I was also wandering if carriers have to have certification of some sort to haul government loads?

So I guess I was just wandering from my stand point, is a certified company better than a non-certified company?

Thanks guys!!
 

flatbedin

Seasoned Expediter
RE: Is it important for your carrier to be certifi

I've noticed a few companies that are ISO certified. I-International O-Organazational S-Standardization. Most automotive companies require a Tier 1 supplier be ISO 9001 certified.

ISO is the governing body that completes audits on a companies ability to manage certain aspects of it's business. ISO not only audits a companies management practices, but also it's quality practices.

Most automotive companies (GM, FORD, CHRYSLER, TOYOTA, HONDA, SUBARU,ECT) require a company be ISO certified to be a "direct" contact supplier.

Assuming in the trucking industry it would be that you were able to be called for loads without being put on the NLM board?

But again, I am a newbie, so I was just taking a stab at things and wandering why I saw ISO certified on a few carriers trucks, and not others.

Thank You!!
 

greg334

Veteran Expediter
RE: Is it important for your carrier to be certifi

No NLM does not require ISO certification only fleet size and other things like financial stablity, and neither really does the Automotive companies for freight.

I won't go into my background (to prevent people from being bored) but I feel that the ISO certification does nothing for a carrier who hauls automotive freight or freight that is not specialized, like Pharma loads. I know that most Pharma loads follow GxP standards which is not a bad thing but getting back to the ISO thing, many companies use is as a marketing tool - look we are also ISO 9001/13000 certified to supply you with toilet paper.

I am wondering if certification means operating authority?
 

chuckwagon

Seasoned Expediter
RE: Is it important for your carrier to be certifi

As I researched for my next carrier I found that the 'tier one' companies, the big boys - are all certified.

Panther, UPS Expedite, Landstar along with others like Express-1. I would think since these are the guys moving alot of the loads out there it must have some purpose and solid meaning behind it.

I am wondering if this is why these carriers get those good paying loads we hear about and the rest of these companies like Bolt, Diamond, and the 'second tier' carriers except alot of their loads from the other carriers, pay their drivers lower per mileage dollars and also bid mainly off the low-paying load boards.

Just my thought and comments.
 

Jefferson3000

Expert Expediter
RE: Is it important for your carrier to be certifi

Well, you don't have to be ISO certified to have operating authority. There are businesses that run no trucks at all, but they have ISO certification. Lot of money for a small biz to do that.


Drive Safe!

Jeff
 

greg334

Veteran Expediter
RE: Is it important for your carrier to be certifi

Well my point is that NLM seems to do otherwise, when I talked to them they only mentioned ISO certifaction as something that is not needed to do business with them but would not hurt. They were more concern with the basics, fleet size, violations, etc..

I think that the cert cost now maybe over $30K or $50K don't remember and for a small carrier to asorbe that cost for some possible additional revenue just does not make sense.

Also got to add this in to the mix, ISO certification does not mean a thing because it is a paperwork trail/quality control thing for us and is only as good as the driver/owner operator following the rules. I heard that it increases the chances of on time pick ups and deliveries but I do not see any evedence of it as it is applied.
 

chuckwagon

Seasoned Expediter
RE: Is it important for your carrier to be certifi

I am going to disagree here on the previous post above.

If NLM said it is not needed to do business with them but it would not hurt - that is actually saying two different things. And I think it would be safe to say better to have it than not then.

Also if the 30-40,000 is going to 'keep the small carrier' from being certified maybe that is telling us that a small carrier should not be taken serious on the better paying loads. That maybe if the small carrier does not look at it from an investment stand point the shipper should take it as the carrier not believing in their own business structure.

If a carrier does not believe in investing in their own business and management structure why the heck would I want to move frieght through them?
 

greg334

Veteran Expediter
RE: Is it important for your carrier to be certifi

Well Chuck, NLM meant that the freight is put on the board for bids, the ISO certs are not added to the equation when determining the load award. They were clear that when you market your carrier, the ISO certification does provide some leverage but it didn't matter to them unless you were going to bid on the regular LTL freight.

Also the point I am trying to make is that you just don't get certified and thats it, there is a process that is followed with audit(s) and follow ups. For a small carrier, the DOT audit and paper work is mind boggling and sometimes costly, add an ISO certification and see the chaos. I mean many carriers are complaining that the DOT paper work is too much but truthfully it is minumal when you compair it to other things. The actual cost that my consulting company would have paid was somewhere around $80K for the consultants and application and a maintainence cost estimated around $15K a year. Now we estimated that the revenue increase would have been not justified the cost. Did it matter to our clients? not really, they didn't care what certs we had because we had to work within their requirments.
 

chuckwagon

Seasoned Expediter
RE: Is it important for your carrier to be certifi

Like you said the ISO certification does provide some leverage and that is the point I am making!
If it provides some leverage then you get a one-step advantage over the smaller carriers who do not want to invest in such a program.
I understand the ISO certification is a process that is followed with audits and follow ups - that is what I am saying. It shows a commitment to proper management procedures set by industry standards and monitored by the industry certification program.
I agree if a small carrier does not see the revenue increase justifying the cost of the certification they should not proceed with it.
However, I do not see the justification on stating the certification carriers no weight or merit - as that is not true. Sure some shippers only care about doing things within their guidelines, but, they seem to be the one's paying bottom dollar.
What I am saying is that if you want to make money - you may want to consider spending money and play with the big dogs.
 

x06col

Veteran Expediter
Charter Member
Retired Expediter
US Army
RE: Is it important for your carrier to be certifi

ISO,SMISO. Is simply put, that all in the chain know how to react to a certain event, conjured up by someone normally not in the foxhole. In a perfect world, the answer will be correct. That is why all the "thinkers" on this site have problems with "certified" organizations. There is absoutely "no" room for tinkin. Remember your military days?? SOP:) Samo, samo. But, you still have to put a little "on site" into the mix to survive - - as long as you have someone alive and tinkin on site.
 

flatbedin

Seasoned Expediter
RE: Is it important for your carrier to be certifi

Besides ISO certification, is there any other certification that a Expediting (or trucking company in general) can receive to get government loads, ect?

I guess I am really wandering for my own knowledge, what all certification is available to expediting companies. I know all about Operating Authority, and that is not what I am consindering certification. I mean Up and Beyond a companies operating authority.
 

highway star

Veteran Expediter
Owner/Operator
RE: Is it important for your carrier to be certifi

Wow... That has to be the most incoherent x06 post yet.
 

nightcreacher

Veteran Expediter
RE: Is it important for your carrier to be certifi

ISO has nothing to do whether the company gets the bid from NLM,there is a point structure they go by,from size of company,to on time delivery,to safety record,but ISO isn't in play there.
Almost all the expedite companies I know of,are ISO certified,
as far as any other certification,just make sure they are DOT certified,and have a bankroll to pay you when the time comes

Hope all had Merry Christmas,and your 2007 is better than 2006
 

Jefferson3000

Expert Expediter
RE: Is it important for your carrier to be certifi

A company, whether small or large has plenty to decide on. They must decide what licenses, certs, and/or hoop jumping actually does something to improve productivity, safety, as well as revenue. You have to decide what is necessary to play ball with whomever. Cert A may mean absolutely nothing to company B, who only care that you hold license C. Company D may not care what license or cert you have, just as long as you have that EXTRA 5 million dollars of insurance. No hard and fast rules here.


Drive Safe!

Jeff
 

greg334

Veteran Expediter
RE: Is it important for your carrier to be certifi

oh well, sorry for going off topic, thanks nightcreacher I forgot about the point system.

Ok flatbedin, here is what I am told and may have changed since last year;

Each goverment agency is in charge of shipping items and I am going to assume you are talking about military shipments - which there are a lot of - a carrier must be approved through Surface Deployment and Distribution Command (www.sddc.gov). The process seemed straight forward but the performance bond issues stopped me. Remember that you still have to have an operating authority and go through their inspection process and possibly an audit or two.

The other place you can check out but I haven't is fedbizopps.gov

Hope this helps.
 

JohnMueller

Moderator
Staff member
Motor Carrier Executive
Safety & Compliance
Carrier Management
RE: Is it important for your carrier to be certifi

Seems to be quite a bit of guessing of what ISO is and why it is important to our industry. To my understanding, carriers do not have to be ISO to haul freight for NLM. The following is an excerpt from ISO's website which I use for training new hires at our company, both driver-contractors and office employees.

Who ISO is
ISO is a network of the national standards institutes of 156 countries, on the basis of one member per country, with a Central Secretariat in Geneva, Switzerland, that coordinates the system.
ISO is a non-governmental organization: its members are not, as is the case in the United Nations system, delegations of national governments. Nevertheless, ISO occupies a special position between the public and private sectors. This is because, on the one hand, many of its member institutes are part of the governmental structure of their countries, or are mandated by their government. On the other hand, other members have their roots uniquely in the private sector, having been set up by national partnerships of industry associations.
Therefore, ISO is able to act as a bridging organization in which a consensus can be reached on solutions that meet both the requirements of business and the broader needs of society, such as the needs of stakeholder groups like consumers and users.

What ISO's name means
Because "International Organization for Standardization" would have different abbreviations in different languages ("IOS" in English, "OIN" in French for Organisation internationale de normalisation), it was decided at the outset to use a word derived from the Greek isos, meaning "equal". Therefore, whatever the country, whatever the language, the short form of the organization's name is always ISO.

How it all started
International standardization began in the electrotechnical field: the International Electrotechnical Commission (IEC) was established in 1906. Pioneering work in other fields was carried out by the International Federation of the National Standardizing Associations (ISA), which was set up in 1926. The emphasis within ISA was laid heavily on mechanical engineering. ISA's activities came to an end in 1942.
In 1946, delegates from 25 countries met in London and decided to create a new international organization, of which the object would be "to facilitate the international coordination and unification of industrial standards". The new organization, ISO, officially began operations on 23 February 1947.
Read Friendship among equals - Recollections from ISO's first fifty year for a historical perspective of ISO.

What 'international standardization' means
When the large majority of products or services in a particular business or industry sector conform to International Standards, a state of industry-wide standardization can be said to exist. This is achieved through consensus agreements between national delegations representing all the economic stakeholders concerned - suppliers, users, government regulators and other interest groups, such as consumers. They agree on specifications and criteria to be applied consistently in the classification of materials, in the manufacture and supply of products, in testing and analysis, in terminology and in the provision of services. In this way, International Standards provide a reference framework, or a common technological language, between suppliers and their customers - which facilitates trade and the transfer of technology.

How ISO standards benefit society
For businesses, the widespread adoption of International Standards means that suppliers can base the development of their products and services on specifications that have wide acceptance in their sectors. This, in turn, means that businesses using International Standards are increasingly free to compete on many more markets around the world.
For customers, the worldwide compatibility of technology which is achieved when products and services are based on International Standards brings them an increasingly wide choice of offers, and they also benefit from the effects of competition among suppliers.
For governments, International Standards provide the technological and scientific bases underpinning health, safety and environmental legislation.
For trade officials negotiating the emergence of regional and global markets, International Standards create "a level playing field" for all competitors on those markets. The existence of divergent national or regional standards can create technical barriers to trade, even when there is political agreement to do away with restrictive import quotas and the like. International Standards are the technical means by which political trade agreements can be put into practice.
For developing countries, International Standards that represent an international consensus on the state of the art constitute an important source of technological know-how. By defining the characteristics that products and services will be expected to meet on export markets, International Standards give developing countries a basis for making the right decisions when investing their scarce resources and thus avoid squandering them.
For consumers, conformity of products and services to International Standards provides assurance about their quality, safety and reliability.
For everyone, International Standards can contribute to the quality of life in general by ensuring that the transport, machinery and tools we use are safe.
For the planet we inhabit, International Standards on air, water and soil quality, and on emissions of gases and radiation, can contribute to efforts to preserve the environment.

I have this clarifies the issues with the original post.

Thanks,
HotFr8Recruiter
 

flatbedin

Seasoned Expediter
RE: Is it important for your carrier to be certifi

Im going to go off subject a little bit on this one. But if all companies large and small are on a pretty even playing field, and each company has the same ability to find loads, why can company A that has 20 trucks have a harder time finding loads for their trucks than lets say company B that has 500 trucks.

Is it based souly on the fact that company B has a larger customer base than company A? Or are there other factors such as availability to load boards, ect that company B has compared to company A?

I know that everyone always preaches that you need to find your companies freight lanes. And right now that is what I am trying learn.

Lets say though that you are offered a nice 600 mile run to a place that your company may not be able to get you a load out of, do you just decline the load? Knowing that you may get a good load on Monday, but Tuesday and Wednesday you'll be sitting.

Guess that's the reason I was wandering if companies could obtain any certification besides their normal Operating Authority that allowed them to have a broader area for freight.

Again, thanks for all the replies!!
 

greg334

Veteran Expediter
RE: Is it important for your carrier to be certifi

I would think that each company has an operational goal and set limits on the amount of money that they will accept as a resonable rate.

I know that some companies who pay a flat rate to the contractors reguardless what rate they get and a couple of them will not take any sort of loss for any reason because to them it make no business sense, greed. The problem I see using that philosiphy is the greed factor causes poor relations between the contractor and the company. Sending someone to a far away place and not bidding on stuff to get them out of there so you can maintain a percentage is dumb.
 

Broompilot

Veteran Expediter
RE: Is it important for your carrier to be certifi

My question is this, I see that Panther States they are ISO certitified. Any Panther drivers go thru any special training?

If not and I doubt it but maybee I am wrong, than what good does ISO certified stand for?

In the original Post it was stated that Automotive Co.s will only deal with ISO certified companies. This is not true, as stated here there are plenty of OO that have their Own Authoritiy and not certified.

My company chooses not to belong to this and we haul the same freight as anyone else to the same customer base.

When I was with FECC I do not recall anything covered about ISO, since they are looked upon as being the king of the hill you think they would advertise this so what good is it? I have often asked myself that question what does an ISO certification actually mean in training and knowledge to an individual leased onto a carrier?
 
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