Is It Happening Again?

ATeam

Senior Member
Retired Expediter
When researching the industry before we started expediting, Diane and I learned of a time when a lot of people got hurt real bad because fleet sizes had become too large. When the business slowed, there were way more trucks than freight to haul and a lot of folks failed.

I learned today that FedEx CC is now running about 1,500 units (all types). About a year ago, I think the nuber was around 1,200. As we all know, business has been booming. It only makes sense for carriers to add trucks. Everything I hear tells me carriers still feel they don't have enough trucks. There's a whole lot of freight to haul and a whole lot of money being left on the table because there are simply not enough trucks and drivers to haul it.

But looking further down the road, and knowing that business WILL slow, what's out there to keep the same expediter failure cycle from happening again? It's been said "Those that don't know the mistakes of history are destined to repeat them." (or something like that). While I have no data to rely on, I presume most other carriers have also expanded their fleets in the last year or so.

I note with some comfort that the recent fleet expansion is nowhere near as large as the previous one. Have carriers learned their lesson? Have drivers? Or does another trail of tears lie ahead?
 

Tennesseahawk

Veteran Expediter
So dramatic, are we A-team? LOL
Yes... the same thing will happen. Business will boom, companies will put way too many trucks on, and people will fail. Kinda sounds like the cycle of the stock market, huh? When this happens, I wouldn't mind being in the position Davekc was a couple years ago. He had enough money to catch the repos on the rebound. I feel sorry for those who lose their trucks during this time, but when it comes to business - I'm a Republican ;)

Oh... if I lose my truck and one of you get it, I have a spare key BWAHAHAHAHA :7 :7 :7 :7 :7
 

redytrk

Veteran Expediter
Charter Member
This business has allways been a roller coster ride. Like an owner told me when I was a rookie 16 years ago. "You have to run like hell when the business is good.Sock as much as you can away in the bank,and hold on for the downturn".I never forgot this and use it for my business model to this day.
 

mrgoodtude

Not a Member
Here we are looking at getting into the business and then we read this information. Talk about intimidating with making a major move in careers and lifestyle!

Someone please put my mind at ease that starting up in this business is the smart thing to do. I'm tired of the office/corporate world and this expediting is right up my alley!

Kitty Litter and Ms Puss
 

Dreamer

Administrator Emeritus
Charter Member
>Here we are looking at getting into the business and then we
>read this information. Talk about intimidating with making
>a major move in careers and lifestyle!
>
>Someone please put my mind at ease that starting up in this
>business is the smart thing to do. I'm tired of the
>office/corporate world and this expediting is right up my
>alley!
>
>Kitty Litter and Ms Puss

Unfortunately, that is something that only YOU can decide. It is a well known fact that this is a cyclical business.. with ups and downs from week to week, month to month, and year to year. Those who succeed are those who can ride out the valleys, to hit those mountains.. If you handle the good times well, you will have money to get thru the down cycles.. and OVERALL... the money will be there.


Dreamer
 

davekc

Senior Moderator
Staff member
Fleet Owner
The above observations are true. I don't have the desire to capitalize on starting another business, but if the situation floods the market with bargain equipment as in the past, of course I might sieze the opportunity to buy and resell repoed equipment.
People have to realize that the carriers objective is to make their money when the freight is their. Most carriers want their drivers to succeed but that can't and won't be their first priority. They will put as many trucks on as possible to cover any and all loads. Past history tells us that. That is why the larger carriers use owner operators. When the market slows or becomes stagnant, do you think they want to absorb any financial loss? Of course not. The economy is not doing that bad and the recruiting frenzy is in full swing. As I have said in the past, a company that is good this year, may not be next. Most seem to run in cycles.
A lesson learned is to keep an open and realistic mind about the industry. Have plenty of cash reserves, and don't over extend yourself.
In addition, I would under no circumstances buy carrier required specific equipment. Once purchased, you are stuck with that carrier.
If that carrier over populates their fleet, who do you think takes that loss? Always give yourself some flexibility.
Davekc
 

raceman

Veteran Expediter
Hey guys nothing ventured, nothing gained. I came out of the corp. world and I am doing just fine. I come from a background of very successful family businesses. My parents, my brother, my brother in law and sister, now my oldest daughter and her husband. They took over some equipment from me and run Fed Ex ground and are doing great in their early twenties. Down a little further DaveKC mentions equipment. If you go out and sink all your money in new equipment in a business like this you could very well get hurt. Buy some good used truck have it checked out very well so you know what you have, get on with a good company and drive it yourself and you will do fine. If can save some money along the way later you can add a truck or maybe buy yourself something nice at that point and just stay with the one truck and enjoy your tour. It is a very up and down business but you use your business head and do your own driving it is actually hard not to do half way decent at a minimum. I would love to add some more trucks but I have other goals as well so while I want more trucks I keep being reminded it may not be a great idea right now. My background is so varied I have seen many businesses go up and down the only time I did nothave that worry is while I worked for a very big Corp. deal. When you go into your own business there are no perfect days. If you do it for the right reasons and you use your head it will work for you. I do suggest you have a pretty nice savings that you can rely on when things slow or trucks have problems but I think it is worth the risk if you want to be your own boss. If you do not have a strong emotional base and a strong stomach it can eat you alive but let me tell you it is wonderful to wake up and know what ever happens you are in charge. I have had two other trucking businesses in my family over the years and now there is my daughters and mine and I can tell you we are a pretty happy bunch. All of us came from big business at some point. Even my father tried that route first sooner or later we have all ended up in business for ourselves and all of us have wondered where rent money would come from and all of have also seen the other side of the coin as well. If you have a positive attitude, a head for business and a good work ethic, go for it. Nothing ventured nothing gained. I will end by saying right now, my stomach is really burning but two months ago I did not have worry in the world. It simply comes and goes. Best of luck. You can do whatever you think you can do.

RaceMan

---Why Hug a tree when you can sit on a Diesle---
 

ATeam

Senior Member
Retired Expediter
>Here we are looking at getting into the business and then we
>read this information. Talk about intimidating with making
>a major move in careers and lifestyle!
>
>Someone please put my mind at ease that starting up in this
>business is the smart thing to do. I'm tired of the
>office/corporate world and this expediting is right up my
>alley!
>
>Kitty Litter and Ms Puss

Thank goodness you're figuring out the cyclical nature of the business BEFORE you jump in. That's what good research can do for you. You're doing a good job using EO as you make your plans.

I trust you've seen here and in other threads the importance of being well-captialized before you start. I suggest that while buying new or used equipment is an important choice, having the capital to carry you through the slumps trumps most everything else.

How much capital is enough? A good business plan will tell you, as will the financial professionals that review it (banker, truck-wise CPA).

While there are many ways to run an expediting business, some are profitable and some are not. Naturally, you must be profitable to succeed over the long term. So you should write your business plan with long-term profitability in mind. That includes some money-losing, and break-even months as the business cycle plays out.

The expediter that has the financial resources to make his or her truck payments on a very expensive, brand new truck will be standing long after the expediter that bought a used truck for a fraction of new, if the used-truck expediter has no resources to carry him or her through the slumps.

It's less about your equipment and more about your capitalization. It's less about your carrier and more about your cash flow.

In plain language, given the expenses you expect to have on the road (personal, business, and anything else you can think of), how long can you survive with no new money coming in?

Note that if you are in a fleet owner's truck you have little capital of your own at risk. That will help you get through a slump, but it's vital for you to also know that your fleet owner has the reserves to make his or her truck payments. Otherwise, your fleet-owner's lender may send the repo company to snatch up the truck you are in.

When the business slows, it will slow for everyone. Drivers in fleet owner trucks will quit because they are not doing as well as they hoped. That's a double whammy for a fleet owner, especially one with multiple trucks. Not only have revenues slowed because of the slump, the fleet owner has lost a team, which reduces revenue to zero. If the fleet owner owns multiple trucks, he's (she, them) really stuck because he can only drive one truck himself, and then at decreased revenue because of the slump.

In such a case, you may be in a position to buy a truck cheap! But it takes capital (money) to do it with. Again, capitalization is key.

If you have figured out that expediting is the lifestyle for you, it's going to be tough to do anything else until you have at least given expediting a whirl. In that sense, expediting is the right thing to do. Whether or not you do it successfully will be a function of several things, capitalization being one of the most important.

Allow me to share a bit about how Diane and I (straight truck team) put our minds at ease regarding the cyclical nature of the business.

(1) We did a ton of research before beginning. We estimate we spent 750-1000 hours studying the business, interviewing expediters, attending trade shows, visiting truck stops, etc. To your credit, you seem to be doing much of the same.

(2) While we quit our jobs, we did not burn our bridges when we entered expediting. At any time, we could have returned to our house, booted the house sitter out, and picked up our old careers more or less where we left off. Diane could have got hired again. I could have picked up where I left off with my old business (after a rebuilding period) or started a new one.

(3) We began in a truck someone else owned (fleet owner). That gave us the freedom to return to our old lives while availing us to the coaching our fleet owner was willing to provide (some fleet owners are better than others in that regard). It also gave us the opportunity to learn the business before making a truck purchase of our own. And it gave us the opportunity to learn about ourselves. We proved to ourselves that we could live happily together in a truck and on the road. We produced our own real-world numbers we neeeded to do our own real-world long-term business planning.

(4) Before committing to a major truck purchase, we restructured our lives and finances to accomodate that new financial reality. That restructuring enabled us to save more money (as in deposit our weekly expediting earnings in the bank) than we've ever saved before. That's the money that will help us purchase our new truck and also serve as reserves to get us though the slumps. And of course, we expect to continue building our reserves with the new truck. Our restructuring is such that we eliminated all debt and most expenses from our lives. We did so by selling our cars, house, and household goods (except keepsakes). The only debt we'll have in the future is the truck loan, which we expect to pay off years ahead of schedule.

(Please note that I did not say we sold our house to pay for the truck. People sometimes leap to that errant conclusion. We did not sell our house to buy a truck. We sold our house because we no longer wanted or needed it. Our residence is now modest rental property with someone else responsible for maintaining it. As we're fond of saying, "The truck is our home; the nation our back yard.")

I'm not suggesting such radical lifestyle changes for you. I'm simply sharing why we're at peace as our brand new, fully-equipped, and very expensive truck makes it's way through the manufacturing process. It will arrive before the snow melts and the payments and high insurance costs and all other operating expenses along with it. It will also give us the ability to keep the 40% of the gross we now pay to truck owners (a husband/wife team) for the use of their truck.

In a word, we're at peace because we've saved and will continue to save enough money from our expediting earnings to carry us through the industry contraction that will certainly come.

While we have additonal resources to also fall back on, we are loathe to do that. It's our strongly held belief that expediting should pay for itself in good times and bad. We've done our research and business planning. We've been on the road nearly a year and a half. We've established ourselves as top producers. We know the business. We know ourselves. We are confident that expediting will pay its way and ours in the years ahead.

Listening to you speak and seeing you do the good research you are doing, a big part of me wants to say, "YES! Go for it! You too can succeed as an expediter!" Diane and I remember well how long those days in the office became once we got bit by the expediting bug. We feel your pain! :eek:

But unless you are well capitalized, or have a plan to quickly get that way once you hit the road, you should think twice before jumping in.

Finally, if you have not already done so, I urge you to take some vacation time and make plans to attend the Mid America Trucking Show in Louisville, KY. The show dates are March 31 - April 2. I suggest you attend all three days, all day long. The show is huge and there is much to learn. Even if you attend all three days, you'll not be able to take in the entire show.

Of special interest to you will be the expediter section. Plan on spending at least one full day there. You'll see numerous expediter trucks on display. All the expediting carriers will be there with their recruiters, recruiting packets and sample contracts. EO will have a booth there and you might run into some of the folks from these forums. And there will be a bunch of plain ordinary truck drivers milling about - 50,000 or so - that you can strike up conversations with as part of your research. Some of those drivers will be expediters.

Here's the link to the truck show site:

http://www.truckingshow.com/
 

Weave

Veteran Expediter
Charter Member
I have found the smaller companies I have ran for generally keep their fleet sizes the same all year round. When things get super busy and no power is available, they will contract loads out to other carriers they are associated with. I feel this is very fair, and keeps the base set of contractors from having to suffer, at least not too much, when things slow down. This is another instance where it can help to be a name and not a number.
-Weave-
 

Tom Robertson

Veteran Expediter
ATeam:

>>>"But looking further down the road, and knowing that business WILL slow, what's out there to keep the same expediter failure cycle from happening again?"<<<

How about a one word answer to your question... "nothing".

In my humble opinion, the "expediter failure cycle" existed prior to your arrival and will continue well after your exit. The exodus may or may not occur in the numbers that occured in the late 90's and early into the 2000's, but rest assured that it will continue to happen.

In my company's 20 years in this industry, I have seen many companies as well as O/O's enter and exit. Some by choice, some by bankruptcy. As unfortunate as this fact may be, it is also a reality. Attitude, equipment and financial stability, while important, are not the only keys to success in the industry. There also is a tremendous amount of luck involved, and to quote an old adage "the harder I work, the luckier I get." I have "reinvented" my company several times to meet the ever changing requirements of "expedited" freight. Twenty years ago, the term used, was "hotshot" rather than "expedited".

My experience shows me that most companies and individuals who exit the industry leave because their expectations were higher than the reality of the industry. These expectations are normally constructed around those of us fortunate enough to have reached a certain level of success. Some of us have made statements that virtually assure others of success if they just "do your homework".

I think perhaps that some of us inadvertently lead others into making decisions that set them up to fail. How so, you may ask. Well sir...

I have read your post in the past and believe that you are have a tremendous attitude, did much research, crunched numbers, did your time as a newbie driving for others, and know how to save and spend(?) wisely. The mileage and income you have reported are well above the norm. I do not doubt your reports; however I do feel that they lead others to expect to achieve similar numbers. We all know which company you drive for, and I must say that having 1500 trucks on the road would certainly all but guarantee their continued success. However can you tell prospective O/O’s that this company is concerned about yours or any other O/O’s success? When you call into dispatch, do all of the dispatchers know you by your name, recognize your financial liabilities and care about your abilities to provide for yourself and loved ones? The obvious answer is a resounding NO> and rightly so. You are a truck number, and if you happen to be in the right place at the right time, you will get a load sooner or later. If you happen to be lucky enough to have gotten all the miles and income you desire or need, then recognize the facts that you are one of the lucky truck numbers. Again understanding that by knowing your company’s niche in the business you have placed yourself in the areas you need to be and that you have placed your truck “in service” for the times necessary to succeed.
In all of the above you are to be commended. In your verbose (like myself) and enthusiastic postings about what others can expect, no commodations are offered.

There is a gentleman who has posted questions on this forum for months, asking questions, about companies and equipment, and maintaining the positive attitude necessary to succeed. You sir, were one of his mentors, whether known by you or not. This man just purchased a brand new truck, although you and many others advised that he drive for an owner first. His enthusiasm, (based partially on your reports of mileage and income) and financial position caused him to ignore the most important parts of the advice he received. This gentleman purchased a truck with all the buttons, bells, whistles and chrome desirable, and after his first month, has barely made enough to make the payment on the truck. This gentleman is distraught, and has offered me his truck at 20K less than he paid for it. The really sad part is that I believe he paid about 20K more than he should have.
Have you ever thought to ask you company where your truck ranks in income? If, as I suspect, you are in the top 5 or 10% of the O/O’s, then PLEASE make those statements in your posts. We are all happy for you and your success. I enjoy reading and from time to time learning something new from your posts. You are obviously intelligent and well educated, but also understand that not everyone has the advantages that you had when you entered the industry, or the intellectual ability to parse the questionable from the various tidbits of advice espoused on this forum.
Please offer more caution when encouraging others into our industry.

The question mark beside the word “spend” earlier in this post was placed there with regards to the truck you have been planning for at least a year. I have read either from one of your posts or one concerning this truck that you will be spending in excess of $200k for the dream truck. I am more than curious about the following...
1. is this figure accurate?
2. what in the world could drive the price that high?
3. if it is “happening again”... will you survive?
4. if you decide that the industry is no longer profitable for you, what kind of return do you expect to get by selling this truck?... not many of us would consider an investment of that size for a straight truck to be a wise move. I certainly hope you are not making the same mistake made by the gentleman mentioned earlier.
Again sir, I do enjoy your posts and articles, and I admire your positive attitude, but please consider the influence you may have on those who cannot afford to make $100K mistakes.

Merry Christmas and a Happy New Year to you and yours.
 

raceman

Veteran Expediter
I just read this entire thread and am going to go back and read it again because I am missing something. What I did get out of it was something Tom R. said about being careful when talking to others or in this case writting to others. Tom makes a very important point at least I have taken it that way and that is the psoitive attitude. I tend to be very positive about things and I am also lucky. I have heard many folks say "I'd rather be lucky than good anyday" I don't know that I agree with that but there is a lot of luck that goes into this. I can certainly see, after reading Tom's post,that what seems natural to me may actually be luck. It may actually also be research or approach but there is surely some luck. I certainly have no plans to change my approach to anything I do as far as business goes, because I simply think research, applying learned skills and so on pay off. Always have and therefore I continue to use that. What does not always pay off is positive attitude and just feeling that failure is not an option. I guess what I am saying is what works for one of us may not work for another. No people use all the data, skills and resources the same way and therefore it is not as easy as just telling someone here is what you need to do and then they too do well. I was once told I can learn something from everyone. I just learned something. It makes alot of sence I will always remember that. When the chance comes up to share something about my business in the future I will share it in a more useful and helpful manner so as not to project a perfect picture. The picture is never just perfect. I am sure while I share my positive attitude I most likely gloss over the money lost due to shaddy repair shops, less than honest insurance companies,cost of new tires, drivers that quit, trucks that need repair etc. A-Team I think that article you are generating if written with all input will paint a very real look at this type of thing. Oh well just thought I would say I took something away from this thread that is very real and useful. Good Stuff.

RaceMan

---Why Hug a tree when you can sit on a Diesle---
 

davekc

Senior Moderator
Staff member
Fleet Owner
The expediter that has the financial resources to make his or her truck payments on a very expensive, brand new truck will be standing long after the expediter that bought a used truck for a fraction of new, if the used-truck expediter has no resources to carry him or her through the slumps.

It's less about your equipment and more about your capitalization. It's less about your carrier and more about your cash flow

A team
I wish you would elaborate more when making these kinds of statements. Just on its face value, it is very misleading. Maybe not intentional, but it appears that if one can make a truck payment, he or she would be in good shape. There is alot more to it. Unless operating under your own authority, the carrier has EVERYTHING to do with ones cash flow. Short of a little luck, the carrier is controling ALL of your cash flow. If the carrier makes poor management decisions, you will suffer along with the carrier.
It is very hard to work that into your business plan when you don't really know what their plan is.
Tom Robertson provides an excellent observation to the above posts. As I have told the A Team, I am somewhat of an advocate for the newcomers to the business. I cringe when someone takes misleading advise and then financially crashes. A positive attitude or business plan is important, but it is far from the only ingredients needed to be successful.
While addressed on another post, financing the wrong equipment can be devastating to a new owner. A truck that is speced incorrectly, or has financed liftgates and reefers that revenue may not be returned. Or in Tom's post, just simply overpaying for a truck that a carrier can't support.
Be careful folks and really do your research. Talk to the folks that have been doing this for a long time. Someone recently asked me, "what is a long time"? At least 10 years. Why? Because they have cycled several trucks through their career and understand all of the aspects of truck ownership and if applicable, fleet ownership.
Be weary of advise from folks who may be experienced, but have never owned a truck.
Davekc

I hope everyone as well has a Merry Christmas and a great New Year
 

terryandrene

Veteran Expediter
Safety & Compliance
US Coast Guard
Tom's post is one of the best I've read in my short tenure at this site. Mea Culpa, Mea Culpa.

I have long held the belief that each of us promotes our respective company in the best possible light during frequent "truck stop coffee sessions". Heaven forbid that anyone would admit to have chosen, and stayed with, the wrong carrier. I guess it stems from the common kindergarten saying "my dad can beat up your dad". This type of chatter among colleagues and school kids is acceptable puffery but has no legitimate place when we professional expediters promote our profession to the outsiders looking to understand our unique way of life.

Rene' and I have been honored and pleased to assist the EO team at a couple of Mid-America truck shows and at all of the Expediter Expos. And, since getting on-line we have been as honest as possible in sharing our experiences. We trust that we were impartial in promoting expediting in general and not our carrier; however, inevitably our pride in our 15 year association with one carrier often shows.

Having said all that, I'm sure there has been a time or two that I've painted a rosier picture than was appropriate and will, hereafter, consider the sage words of Tom Robertson when communicating with the Newbies and Wannabees. Thanx Tom.

Merry Chrismakwanzhundan to all

Terry and Rene'
 

ATeam

Senior Member
Retired Expediter
>ATeam:
>
>>>>"But looking further down the road, and knowing that business WILL slow, what's out there to keep the same expediter failure cycle from happening again?"<<<
>
>How about a one word answer to your question... "nothing".

That's pretty much what I figured, which is part of why I raised the question. The time to prepare for the next slump is now, in the middle of the current peak.

<snip>

>
>My experience shows me that most companies and individuals
>who exit the industry leave because their expectations were
>higher than the reality of the industry. These expectations
>are normally constructed around those of us fortunate enough
>to have reached a certain level of success. Some of us have
>made statements that virtually assure others of success if
>they just "do your homework".

I don't believe I've said just "do your homework." Diane and I have made major changes in our lives - some would call them sacrifices - to orient ourselves to expediting. Do your homework, yes. But do the deeds too.


>
>I think perhaps that some of us inadvertently lead others
>into making decisions that set them up to fail. How so, you
>may ask. Well sir...
>
>I have read your post in the past and believe that you are
>have a tremendous attitude, did much research, crunched
>numbers, did your time as a newbie driving for others, and
>know how to save and spend(?) wisely. The mileage and
>income you have reported are well above the norm. I do not
>doubt your reports; however I do feel that they lead others
>to expect to achieve similar numbers.

Just as we ourselves were led to expect the numbers. We modeled our business on the successful businesses of others.

We all know which
>company you drive for, and I must say that having 1500
>trucks on the road would certainly all but guarantee their
>continued success. However can you tell prospective O/O’s
>that this company is concerned about yours or any other
>O/O’s success?

Not at all. And I never have. In fact, I've made the point several times in this Forum and in other writings that you are more a number than a person with a large carrier.

When you call into dispatch, do all of the
>dispatchers know you by your name, recognize your financial
>liabilities and care about your abilities to provide for
>yourself and loved ones? The obvious answer is a resounding
>NO> and rightly so. You are a truck number, and if you
>happen to be in the right place at the right time, you will
>get a load sooner or later. If you happen to be lucky
>enough to have gotten all the miles and income you desire or
>need, then recognize the facts that you are one of the lucky
>truck numbers.

In our way of thinking, there is no such thing as enough miles or income. We'll always want a little bit more.

Again understanding that by knowing your
>company’s niche in the business you have placed yourself in
>the areas you need to be and that you have placed your truck
>“in service” for the times necessary to succeed.
>In all of the above you are to be commended. In your
>verbose (like myself) and enthusiastic postings about what
>others can expect, no commodations are offered.
>
>There is a gentleman who has posted questions on this forum
>for months, asking questions, about companies and equipment,
>and maintaining the positive attitude necessary to succeed.
>You sir, were one of his mentors, whether known by you or
>not. This man just purchased a brand new truck, although
>you and many others advised that he drive for an owner
>first. His enthusiasm, (based partially on your reports of
>mileage and income) and financial position caused him to
>ignore the most important parts of the advice he received.
>This gentleman purchased a truck with all the buttons,
>bells, whistles and chrome desirable, and after his first
>month, has barely made enough to make the payment on the
>truck. This gentleman is distraught, and has offered me his
>truck at 20K less than he paid for it. The really sad part
>is that I believe he paid about 20K more than he should
>have.

I hope all new and wannabee expediters reading this take the following words to heart:

No one except YOU is responsible for the advice you heed (or reject), decisions you make (or fail to make), and results you produce (or fail to produce). Just because you do a lot of research, it does not follow that you did good research. Just because you solicited advice, it does not follow that you received good advice. Just because you started with a fleet owner, it does not follow that you started with a good one. And just because you jumped into expediting, it does not follow that you are entitled to anything at all after that.

In this business, carriers, fleet owners, shippers and receivers care more about their success than yours. While some may help you a bit, none will put their best interests ahead of yours. From beginning to end in this business, you are responsible for everything you do....your research, your ability to guage the value of the advice you receive, and your decisions. There is no safety net in expediting. The fact that conflicting advice about expediting is the norm further points to the stormy seas expediting presents.

In such an arena, it is most important to know thyself. Are your business skills as good as you think they are? Can you listen objectively to and evaluate all information sources, or do you tend to hear what you want to hear? Do you know your weaknesses and have you compensated for them? Etc.

>Have you ever thought to ask you company where your truck
>ranks in income? If, as I suspect, you are in the top 5 or
>10% of the O/O’s, then PLEASE make those statements in your
>posts.

That's been hard to do because we've been in three trucks in less than a year, because our fleet owner changed trucks on us once, and because we changed fleet owners once. I can say that in the recent FedEx CC contest, 190 trucks of about 1,500 achieved the standard FedEx CC set for prize drawing eligibility. Diane and I were one of those 190. The standard was 80% in service and 80% load acceptance.

Were I researching the industry today as an expediter wannabee, I'd view the 80/80 number as an achievable goal, and I'd set about finding some of those 190 people (teams) to figure out what they did.

We are all happy for you and your success. I enjoy
>reading and from time to time learning something new from
>your posts. You are obviously intelligent and well
>educated, but also understand that not everyone has the
>advantages that you had when you entered the industry, or
>the intellectual ability to parse the questionable from the
>various tidbits of advice espoused on this forum.
>Please offer more caution when encouraging others into our
>industry.

Expediting in any form is not a business for unintelligent people. When I write, it's mostly with intelligent people in mind, and especially people that have no trucking experience and are considering a career change into expediting. If people continue to flow into the industry without accurate perceptions, well-founded expectations, and professional-grade business plans, they'll get ground up by the business in short order. Those that do enter well prepared will more likely than not be well treated by the business.

The question mark beside the word “spend” earlier in this
>post was placed there with regards to the truck you have
>been planning for at least a year. I have read either from
>one of your posts or one concerning this truck that you will
>be spending in excess of $200k for the dream truck. I am
>more than curious about the following...
>1. is this figure accurate?
>2. what in the world could drive the price that high?

As I've stated in previous posts, I'll not confirm or deny any information about our new truck until it's on the road. At that time a plethora of details - including the purchase price - will be made available.

>3. if it is “happening again”... will you survive?

Absolutely! Our business plan contemplates numerous worst case scenerios for which we're prepared.

>4. if you decide that the industry is no longer profitable
>for you, what kind of return do you expect to get by selling
>this truck?...

Zero. The truck was not designed with resale value in mind. We plan to run it into the ground. If we leave the industry earlier than expected, we'll either keep the truck for the fun of it, (the neighbors will love our ability to help them move a refrigerator, we'll enjoy the RV half of the truck and take a road trip from time to time) or sell it for whatever it will bring.

not many of us would consider an investment
>of that size for a straight truck to be a wise move.

Most people wouldn't and shouldn't. But do understand it's the right move for us given our desired lifestyle.

I
>certainly hope you are not making the same mistake made by
>the gentleman mentioned earlier.

He! He! That makes two of us!

>Again sir, I do enjoy your posts and articles, and I admire
>your positive attitude, but please consider the influence
>you may have on those who cannot afford to make $100K
>mistakes.

No amount of qualifiers or road hazard signs I put up will keep that from happening. I'm reminded of a client I once had when I worked as a securities broker and financial planner. I worked with him and his wife for years. We established their retirement accounts. We established savings accounts for their kids' college. We did annual reviews to monitor their progress. Then one day he called and wanted to liquidate everything right away, even to the point of paying early withdrawl penalties on his IRA money (under age 59.5). Another broker got his attention and tempted him with instant returns on casino stocks. This man then went and did his "research." He visited a local casino and found it to be packd with people. That confirmed for him the validity of the other info the broker was feeding him.

I wrote letters to him and all but pinned him to the ground and yelled he was making a bad move. His wife was on my side but was equally ineffective in getting through to him. He was done listening to me and made the move. It was his money. I was powerless to do anything but liquidate all as he instructed. A couple months later he was in a negative net worth situation with no capital to work with. His retirement prospects looked bleak and his kids would have to make their own way through college if they went at all.

Why did he do it? How did he convince himself it was the right thing to do? I honestly have no idea. But I do know he alone and not the other broker was responsible for the negative results.

>Merry Christmas and a Happy New Year to you and yours.

Back at you.
 

davekc

Senior Moderator
Staff member
Fleet Owner
Wouldn't it be much easier not to put misleading information out there in the first place? It would be more beneficial for the new folks that you provide accurate information from the start. That way they will know the facts from the fiction or whether you are just pimping your carrier.
Davekc
 

ATeam

Senior Member
Retired Expediter
Correction:

In my reply to Tom R, I wrote, "In this business, carriers, fleet owners, shippers and receivers care more about their success than yours. While some may help you a bit, none will put their best interests ahead of yours." There is a typo there.

I meant to say, "In this business, carriers, fleet owners, shippers and receivers care more about their success than yours. While some may help you a bit, none will put YOUR best interests ahead of THEIRS."
 

Jack Jackson

Expert Expediter
>Wouldn't it be much easier not to put misleading information
>out there in the first place? It would be more beneficial
>for the new folks that you provide accurate information from
>the start. That way they will know the facts from the
>fiction or whether you are just pimping your carrier.
>Davekc

True words Dave. Maybe it would help clear the air if more people knew why you are leased to Panther II instead of FedEx White Gloves where you used to be.
 

ATeam

Senior Member
Retired Expediter
>Wouldn't it be much easier not to put misleading information
>out there in the first place? It would be more beneficial
>for the new folks that you provide accurate information from
>the start. That way they will know the facts from the
>fiction or whether you are just pimping your carrier.
>Davekc

Oh oh! Here we go again... Down the path that may cause this otherwise useful thread to be deleted. Let's try to keep that from happening this time, OK?

I have never once posted misleading information. Suggestions to the contrary overlook the many cautionary statements I've posted, like "have a business plan" "do your research" "watch out for unethical fleet owners" "start with a fleet owner before buying a truck of your own" "be aware of the motivations of the people who are willing to finance your new truck" and more.

Additionally, I've written articles about the challenges of expediting that hardly sugar coat the business. In another venue I've written at length about our day to day experiences on the road, including the great joy we find in this career, AND including the times we've been marooned with no income for a week at a time without a load or with a broke down truck, and the times we've been too ill to drive and can do little more than lay with a fever and chills in the sleeper in a truck stop and suffer. I've written about the soul-deep fears we worked through when expediting friends of ours were seriously injured in a car/truck accident. I've written about the frustrations and lost income we experienced because our first fleet owners did not turn out to be the people we first thought they were (a misjudgement on our part, a mistake that cost us money). And I've written glowing praise about how those very same people provided excellent coaching when we first started (which is still true, they did provide good coaching).

The fact that Diane and I jumped into this business and made money from the very first day, and that we'll now be spending some of that money on a dream machine of our own, and that we work very hard and very smart as expediters, and that we've totally restructured our lives to succeed in this business; and that compared to the white-collar professional work we used to do, we find expediting to be the easiest and least stressful work we've ever done, is not misleading information at all. It is facutal and verifiable information.

If you feel the need to warn people away from the business because you think it's too hard for them or they may fail, be my guest. The FACT is hundreds, perhaps thousands of people make a fine living as expediters and that's good news that should be shared.

It's also true that a far greater number enter expediting and either fail outright or leave the industry very much the worse for wear. That was the case before Diane and I ever dreamed of being truckers. It was the case before I posted my very first word on any trucking site. And it will continue to be the case no matter what I post, do not post, or fail to post in the future.

The FACT is, I can factually verify and defend in good conscience EVERY WORD I've ever posted on any trucking site. If people find my words to be misleading, it's only because they've not read and equally weighed all of them.

OK. I've said my piece. And I can read between the lines in this thread. I'm going to give the Open Forum a rest for a bit (at least a few days). I have other writing to keep me busy.
 

Weave

Veteran Expediter
Charter Member
I hear all the talk about positive attitudes, passion, excitement, new endeavors, etc, when a new driver starts out. All great things to have, and things that will help make one becoming an expedited truck owner more successful. But all that stuff is truly just smoke and mirrors when it comes to reality in this business. Fact is, if you aren’t getting the greens, you are going to get the blues. This is regardless how much your equipment cost you. It is very much based on the amount of work you receive from your carrier.
Those blues, when they occur on occasion, (note when, not if) can kill off all of those great things one might have started out with very quickly if they don’t have a clue what corrective action they should take to be able to make a go of their dream if it is not working out at the start.

“The expediter that has the financial resources to make his or her truck payments on a very expensive, brand new truck will be standing long after the expediter that bought a used truck for a fraction of new, if the used-truck expediter has no resources to carry him or her through the slumps.”

That is logic of assumption. All loads pay the same rate at carriers regardless if the driver’s truck is a cheap one or expensive. Thus, the driver with the less expensive equipment WILL NOT REQUIRE as big of resources to carry them through the slumps. (That is too simple!)

For a brand new driver to jump right into a new expensive truck and expect to get rich is taking a gamble they most often lose in many more instances than new drivers who start out with a fleet owner, and buy a modest truck to start out in on their own. This is regardless of the resources (money, education, planning, etc) they started out with. It looks to me like Tom Robertson has pointed out a good example. I understand there have been exceptions to this general rule, but why chance it? How hard can it be for the newcomer to take six months out of their life to drive for a fleet owner at first? I did it, and I barely even remember it. If this fellow newcomer Tom Robertson is mentioning is having a rough time starting up, it’s no secret why. These are things that have been said on EO hundreds of times over. He just sounds like a newcomer who decided to not heed those with experience.

-Weave-
 

ATeam

Senior Member
Retired Expediter
>If you feel the need to warn people away from the business
>because you think it's too hard for them or they may fail,
>be my guest. The FACT is hundreds, perhaps thousands of
>people make a fine living as expediters and that's good news
>that should be shared.
>
>It's also true that a far greater number enter expediting
>and either fail outright or leave the industry very much the
>worse for wear.

One final point, if I may. Business failure is not unique to expediting. In any field of endeavor, the number of business failures far outnumber the number of business successes. America hosts millions of people that once tried to start a business of their own and failed at it. And that's in the face of countless business startup resorces and an abundant stream of good advice that are freely available.
 
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