Im running for president its offical!!

greg334

Veteran Expediter
Well Cheri, a contribution with a gift or something in return has to be declared by both the charity and the gift giver as an adjusted gift. So that golf game with Rush that someone donated $11,500 for, the golf game has a value and is deducted from the gift, say the game is worth 9,000 so the 2500 is the gift itself. The same thing goes for celebrities who 'give', some of them B********* actually write off the entire thing as a gift and do it through their shell company. One famous singer did just that for one of them "relief" concerts.

Just remember a large number of contributions happen because people actually care to give, not because of tax write off.

FW, passing a balanced budget amendment won't work with this congress and the mentality of the people. What happens when they can't pass a budget?

Nothing.

BUT our tax system has been focused on as the most damaging thing we have and the easiest to change so let's change it to see what happens. I will guess our economy will turn around and we will be the place to invest in.
 

fortwayne

Not a Member
FW, passing a balanced budget amendment won't work with this congress and the mentality of the people. What happens when they can't pass a budget?

Nothing.

BUT our tax system has been focused on as the most damaging thing we have and the easiest to change so let's change it to see what happens. I will guess our economy will turn around and we will be the place to invest in.

First, its not this Congress, its every Congress calling for it.....but talking the talk is just that.
Its time to pass it, end this absurd spending spree we have been on for 30 plus years...and walk the walk.
Our tax system is due for a tweak job. But this irrational call for a consumption tax or a so called fair tax is nothing more than the Obama agenda of hand feeding some while punishing others for achieving success....he calls it the shifting of burden
Yes, lets take a serious look at a tax structure but let us do it in a manner that doesn't restrict, hinder or burden businesses from expanding their business which should increase our nation's tax base
This Obama desire to shift the burden is nothing more than a path to another liberal entitlement program.

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greg334

Veteran Expediter
First, its not this Congress, its every Congress calling for it.....but talking the talk is just that.
Its time to pass it, end this absurd spending spree we have been on for 30 plus years...and walk the walk.

I agree it has been time to do that but I understand we are one vote away from passing it in the house. The senate is a different ballgame and than the states have to ratify it which they may not.

Our tax system is due for a tweak job. But this irrational call for a consumption tax or a so called fair tax is nothing more than the Obama agenda of hand feeding some while punishing others for achieving success....he calls it the shifting of burden

Well first I don't know where your love of this progressive punitive tax system comes from but it is one of the worst systems that was ever devised and isn't any where near a fair system as say a flat tax is.

On top of that, the Fairtax seems to be a better fit for our society, we are consumers. It is not like the other consumption taxes that have been bantered around and it is no where as bad as the present system. It isn't a vat tax, it is a tax applied to the retail sales of new stuff and as Turtle pointed out, the rich would pay more than what they pay now simply because they are the consumer of things that we can't afford.

Obama hasn't pushed anything like the Fairtax because it will remove the tax code out of the hands of the politicians and make one less thing that they can use to hold power over us.

Yes, lets take a serious look at a tax structure but let us do it in a manner that doesn't restrict, hinder or burden businesses from expanding their business which should increase our nation's tax base

The look has already happened, the people who were in charge of the last presidential panel ignored a lot of things and made up some of their own based on their opinions. SO I think that if we look at the present tax code, it could be reduced from the 70,000 plus pages to say 10 and in doing so, we can simplify everyone's need to put in a return. BUT you know that won't work, it is impossible to actually think that we can apply simple rules to the tax code and people will get it.

So let's do this, let's try the Fairtax and actually see it work. If it doesn't work, we can try something else but at this point our choices are this; raise taxes, have no jobs or lower taxes and still have no jobs.

WHY?

Because the republican congress, much of who we have here, didn't bother to make any of the Bush tax changes permenate while we now have a spilt congress and no way do we have a stable enough government (meaning indecisive) to show the business sector that they can actually do something other than hedge their capital for bad times.

This Obama desire to shift the burden is nothing more than a path to another liberal entitlement program.

Well I don't know about that, the president can't just decide tomorrow to fund another program, that's kind of the point I made in post #2, the president can't do much.

I am guessing that you don't know how the Fairtax works?

So here is a summary using my world.

We pay about 4000 in taxes a year, out of that I get a return of 1500. I can't take my charitable contributions as a whole but have to split them up, which means if I was a greedy rich person, I would not be giving at all - NOT!

If the Fair tax happened tomorrow, I would end up reducing the amount I give because I still need to buy things, but at this point it would save me 50 hours preparing for my tax return plus the $300 I spend on getting it done. which is a savings in itself.

Just a side bar - the cost of things should adjust themselves seeing that the tax component was removed from all businesses and it is no longer a thing that is passed on to the consumer. SO hence the price at the register should stay nearly the same.

On top of that, my retirement account will not be with a restrictive 401k/403b but will be in an investment account where i can control it closely. I don't have to worry about roll overs, tax penalties or anything like that. I no longer have to worry about the ford stock I purchased at $3 a share but now can sell it off to invest in something else without tax issues, which then the profit can go to buy something I want, like a new car.

Then in my business, I don't have to worry about quarterly filings but take that money and use it for the business without trying to find a shelter - more time saved. I can actually hire someone without making them a 1099 and worrying about if he is an employee or contractor. Beside every dime that goes into the business, like fuel, paper clips, tires and so on are not taxed under the Fairtax because those items are strictly business related and are there to make more money. To also understand, I don't have to worry about audits or how many days I log as being away from home or how many miles I ran my van - all of that just goes away and it is simplified because I don't need to worry about deductions or tax write offs AND I save more money just because I don't have to deal with it.

Will this cause an up spike in revenue creation?

I think so because as many of us saw with Bush's give us 600 to spend program, there was an up spike in spending and this would do more than just release billions of dollars to be spent, it would make the country attractive to outside investors and bring up the economy.
 

fortwayne

Not a Member
Greg while u make several good statements they r just that statements.
No study based upon the United States economic platform shows this so called fair tax would support our economic needs and demands at this time.
That is one reason why we must first increase our tax base while implementing changes in our tax formulas as we move forward with private sector job creation.!




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greg334

Veteran Expediter
What study has proven that we need to expand the tax base and that will help us?

What study has proven that increasing revenue generation is good for the economy?

Go to Fairtax.org and see what they say.

Outside of that, I seem to think that lowering taxes, giving money back to the people and actually having a clear objective by everyone in congress in telling the business community what taxes are going to be like in the next few years moves the economy forward - not trying to squeeze every penny out of the taxpayer to fix a problem that can only be fixed by cutting spending.

Remember the biggest obstacle that the business sector has been saying for the reason not to hire is the ambiguity with congress and the country's future. Giving them something that they can grasp and count on may be a lot better than hoping that we will recover to our 2009 levels.
 

xiggi

Veteran Expediter
Owner/Operator
The fair tax or flat tax whatever you choose to refer to it as would immediately expand the tax base. Those working for cash under the table would pay taxes. Those selling things on the side and not paying taxes would pay.
 

clcooper

Expert Expediter
leave the taxes the way they are now . just get rid of all the loop holes .

""The same thing goes for celebrities who 'give', some of them B********* actually write off the entire thing as a gift and do it through their shell company. One famous singer did just that for one of them "relief" concerts.""

wish i had a shell company . i could use that loop hole alot . so i would not have to pay my share in taxes on the money i am ever given /paid .
 
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