How Goes the New 34-Hour Restart for You?

[ATeam]

Dean was driving. We should have been able to get to the truck stop with a couple of minutes to spare before 1 a.m., but the exit was closed due to construction. So it was 1:15 a.m. before he parked, which meant he missed that 1 a.m. to 5 a.m. period of rest by 15 minutes. We only sat for that night and the next (over the weekend), so I reset, having had two nights rest which included the 1 to 5 period, but Dean did not.

On Monday morning we got a call back to the other coast. By the time it was over Dean was down to 6 hours available. That's much closer than we like to run.

That's the type of scenario that worries me under the new HOS rules. At some point in a year, maybe two or three times, the new rules might cost a team a coast-to-coast run. These runs pay $5,000 to $8,000 and sometimes more. How many of those do you wish to give up because of new rules that do absolutely nothing -- ABSOLUTELY NOTHING -- to improve the safety of a team operation?

 

[OntarioVanMan]

That's the type of scenario that worries me under the new HOS rules. At some point in a year, maybe two or three times, the new rules might cost a team a coast-to-coast run. These runs pay $5,000 to $8,000 and sometimes more. How many of those do you wish to give up because of new rules that do absolutely nothing -- ABSOLUTELY NOTHING -- to improve the safety of a team operation?

Expedite being as flakey as it is....reverse could also be said.....whilst doing one of these silly resets, a coast to coast becomes available....meanwhile because you were available you chose a 1,000 miler....hence losing the coast to coast ops.....Hind sight is 20/20....and loaded with "what if's"....you are thinking in the negative mode....I am neutral...

 

[AMonger]

NO, it did not conform. I was NOT able to start a 34 hour reset until 1900 Monday night. That is when my 168 hour clock dried up. I would have sat from then, for 34 hours + the 2 1-5AM periods to get a reset. It is a joke. 110+ hours off is not safe.

Are you saying you had a restart early in the week? That's the only thing that would prevent your restart. What if you do your recap on a piece of paper other than your logbook and then don't declare a restart until you really need it? By that, I mean you have a qualifying restart but don't zero-out your hours on your logbook. That way, you wouldn't have officially already had a restart unless you chose to zero-out later.

Other than that, yes, the 1-restart per week rule is absolutely retarded.

 

[ATeam]

Expedite being as flakey as it is....reverse could also be said.....

Perhaps, but I think not. Yes, expedite has flaky schedules, but there is also a rhythm and flow to what we do and to the freight that expediters, some of them at least, orient themselves to. You make certain assumptions and choices based on this rhythm and flow. It is not all random.

 

[ATeam]

Are you saying you had a restart early in the week? That's the only thing that would prevent your restart. What if you do your recap on a piece of paper other than your logbook and then don't declare a restart until you really need it? By that, I mean you have a qualifying restart but don't zero-out your hours on your logbook. That way, you wouldn't have officially already had a restart unless you chose to zero-out later.

That would not work for two reasons. First, with electronic logging, it is not possible to do what you suggest. Second, with paper logging, it is illegal to do as you suggest.

You are on the right track though with the idea of saving your restart until it is really needed. If your last restart began more than seven days ago, and you are eligible for another restart now, do not take it unless you really need it. That gives you the freedom to do a restart at anytime in the future. If you take a restart just because you can, and you end up really needing one within the next seven days, you may find yourself screwed because of the seven-day rule.

 

[AMonger]

That would not work for two reasons. First, with electronic logging, it is not possible to do what you suggest. Second, with paper logging, it is illegal to do as you suggest.

You are on the right track though with the idea of saving your restart until it is really needed. If your last restart began more than seven days ago, and you are eligible for another restart now, do not take it unless you really need it. That gives you the freedom to do a restart at anytime in the future. If you take a restart just because you can, and you end up really needing one within the next seven days, you may find yourself screwed because of the seven-day rule.

Hmmm, electronic logs, sure...They automatically invoke a restart for you?
It's not illegal to do the recap elsewhere because doing the recap isn't legally required. The recap is only there for your convenience. If the DOT wants to add up your hours, they'll flip through your logs page-by-page, not just look at your recap.

 

[ATeam]

Hmmm, electronic logs, sure...They automatically invoke a restart for you?
It's not illegal to do the recap elsewhere because doing the recap isn't legally required. The recap is only there for your convenience. If the DOT wants to add up your hours, they'll flip through your logs page-by-page, not just look at your recap.

You are correct about the recap but the restart is something different. Paper logs now issued by Landstar have a new feature on them. It is a box you check to declare that the sleeper or off-duty time you are now taking is qualifying for the restart. You have to declare in the present that your down time is being used for the restart.

 

[OntarioVanMan]

Perhaps, but I think not. Yes, expedite has flaky schedules, but there is also a rhythm and flow to what we do and to the freight that expediters, some of them at least, orient themselves to. You make certain assumptions and choices based on this rhythm and flow. It is not all random.

Yes..Exactly....instead of thinking in negative terms....you could think positive....like gee if that silly restart hadn't of held us up we would have taken that 900 miler...now we have a coast to coast...which could also fall into the rhythm and flow equation... it is all in attitude....

we've gotten held up at a pump before...but now because of the rule it is all the rules fault....really?.....and that like it or not..... is a driver fault.

 

[cheri1122]

Of course it's the driver's fault [parking in the fuel lanes], it always has been. But if you ever drove t/t, you'd know that one can easily waste more than 30 minutes looking for a spot, then getting backed into it. Now, the self centered drivers who always used the fuel lanes rather than waste their time will continue to do it for the mandatory break, and they'll be joined by many who didn't do it before, but see little choice when they HAVE to park for 30 minutes, or risk a 7 point CSA violation.
Neither the FMCSA nor the carrier has to deal with finding safe & legal parking, it's a problem that's put entirely on the drivers, and the penalty for failure is just ridiculous.
More points for this violation than for a DUI or having an open container of alcohol onboard - does that make any sense at all?!

 

[Ragman]

. . . - does that make any sense at all?!

No more than any of the other stupid regulations. Of course that's easy for me to say, as I don't have to log.

 

[teamjdw]

i'm seeing a pattern here,those of us who drove tractor trailer before straight trucks,seem to know how to recap. As far as a half hour break goes ,don't any of you need to stop to use the rest room?

 

[paullud]

I am definitely seeing more drivers parking and taking their 30 minute break at the fuel islands.

Sent from my SCH-I535 using EO Forums mobile app

 

[WanderngFool]

I hate the new 34 restart rules.

1. The 1am to 5am thing is stupid. I can see drivers racing to make it home by the 1am deadline so they don't lose a day's pay. It's going to be even more stupid in the winter. Icy roads and drivers pushing too hard is a bad mix.

2. I had a load a couple of weeks ago where I was dog tired on Saturday and wanted to stop but I couldn't because I had a noon appt on Monday and wouldn't have been able to start on Monday until after 5am. So I drove tired into the evening on Saturday because of this stupid rule.

3. My favorite load is the Friday/Monday. It's especially nice when I can pick up close to my home on Friday and spend Friday night, all day Saturday and Saturday night at home. Then I'll drive on Sunday and deliver the load Monday morning. But if I worked last Saturday then I can't take my day off until Sunday. So now instead of 2 nights and 1 day at home to recharge my batteries I get to spend just Friday night at home and if it adds many miles - why bother? More nights sleeping in the truck is supposed to make me more rested?!?! Stupid!

 

[ATeam]

Yes..Exactly....instead of thinking in negative terms....you could think positive....like gee if that silly restart hadn't of held us up we would have taken that 900 miler...now we have a coast to coast...which could also fall into the rhythm and flow equation... it is all in attitude....

No. It's not all attitude. There is more to it than making up a story after the fact.

After a delivery and when deciding what to do next, you don't get to make up the end of the story ahead of time. You only get to play the probabilities and position yourself as best as you know how.

Conditions are gauged, locations are judged, time of day and time of week are noted, and decisions are then made. You think about your present location, hours remaining, opportunity for a restart, fuel supply, truck supplies (food, water, etc.), preferred layover location, likelihood of freight popping up from known shippers, likelihood of freight popping up from new shippers, and may other things.

In this, there is not a single scenario that I can think of in which the new HOS rules will help you optimize your chances for the next load better than the old rules did. There are, however, scenarios in which the new rules degrade your ability to optimize your chances for the same.

This is not about attitude. It is about the fact that the new rules make it more difficult to optimize our chances for a load than the old rules did.

Expediters are adapting to the new rules but that does not make the rules good.

 

[ATeam]

we've gotten held up at a pump before...but now because of the rule it is all the rules fault....really?.....and that like it or not..... is a driver fault.

Yes, we have gotten delayed at the pumps before, and shame on the drivers who use the fuel islands as their personal parking place while they take a break, do their personal business inside, and force other drivers to wait on them.

And, yes, under the new rules, this problem has increased. The new rules create an incentive for more drivers to do that bad thing at the pumps. We still say shame on the drivers who take breaks at the pumps. We also say shame on the new rules for giving more drivers an incentive to do that.

 

[ATeam]

i'm seeing a pattern here,those of us who drove tractor trailer before straight trucks,seem to know how to recap. As far as a half hour break goes ,don't any of you need to stop to use the rest room?

We are in a straight truck and have been long enough to know what the recap system is. Now that 34-hour restarts are harder to come by, we are relearning the recap system. There is not much to learn, just dusting off old practices.

About rest room needs, we have a full bathroom and shower in the truck. Many straight trucks have bathroom facilities of some sort in them. All we need is a parking spot, usually at a rest area. The stop takes only a few minutes, not 30, and we are on our way.

 

[ATeam]

I am definitely seeing more drivers parking and taking their 30 minute break at the fuel islands.

Let's hope this is not an idea that is catching on and a practice that will spread.

 

[beachbum]

I'm going to ask a stupid question of you... Why didn't you think of stopping let's say at 12 am or even 1230 am and not try and take the time out to the last second? Next question, are you on a EOBR or do you have a QC that would stop you from backing up the log to show you got there at 1 am? just asking.

Dean was driving. We should have been able to get to the truck stop with a couple of minutes to spare before 1 a.m., but the exit was closed due to construction. So it was 1:15 a.m. before he parked, which meant he missed that 1 a.m. to 5 a.m. period of rest by 15 minutes. We only sat for that night and the next (over the weekend), so I reset, having had two nights rest which included the 1 to 5 period, but Dean did not.

On Monday morning we got a call back to the other coast. By the time it was over Dean was down to 6 hours available. That's much closer than we like to run.

 

[usafk9]

Next question, are you on a EOBR or do you have a QC that would stop you from backing up the log to show you got there at 1 am? just asking.

You mean, falsify the log......or lie? Just want to be sure I understand the question.

 

[MaidMarion]

I'm going to ask a stupid question of you... Why didn't you think of stopping let's say at 12 am or even 1230 am and not try and take the time out to the last second? Next question, are you on a EOBR or do you have a QC that would stop you from backing up the log to show you got there at 1 am? just asking.

We would have loved to stop sooner. This was the closest place after we delivered. The consignee took extra time to unload us, but we were still hoping to get to the truck stop in time for Dean to reset.

And we are on QC electronic logs.