Guns and Expediters

[terryandrene]

The following is a portion of GREG334's response to a post in the Newbie Conference. It is an oft discussed topic that deserves emphasis and repeating.

Knives, bats, guns, mace and pepper spray - anything that is not used for the work you do can be considered a weapon.

Look I know something that I am going to pass on to everyone who drives for any company and goes to any automotive company. It can be far worse with a government installation.

If for example you go to a Ford plant, they have the right to inspect your truck. Assuming they do a real inspection and if they find a weapon (again it is what THEY classify as a weapon, but lets assume it is a gun for this example), they will not only hold you for the local authorities AND press charges but they will forbid you from ever entering Ford company property ever again, put you in their not to hire database (which for those who don’t think it exists, dream on) and may forbid your company to do business with them ever again.

This is beside the fact that now you are in legal trouble with the local authorities with a felony and maybe with the DOT and lose your license. The defense cost could be thousands of dollars and you will not be able to file bankruptcy over legal problems. You are an “independent contractor” which also means that your company may also sue you to recoup the cost of lost business (I have been a contractor in IT and other industries and this does happen) and even if they don’t you will not get a dime out of them for your legal bills and may lose your latest settlement.

I have met three drivers that carry a gun, two who work for a fleet owner. I don’t think it is a wise thing blowing through weigh stations and carrying a gun, but these three drivers do both. DUMB


Greg
KC8YHN
Express - 1
Owner/Operator
1999 GMC G3500 Diesel

Additionally, As concealed carry permits become allowed by the laws of more states, carriers are sure to modify our lease agreements to include provisions that prohibit guns in our trucks. Given the generally non-dedicated run offers available in the expedite community, a gun carrying driver is sure to be offered an attractive load into a gun prohibitive state, or Canada. What, then, do you do with the run offer or the gun?

Terry

 

[redytrk]

Who knows what item we routinely carry is going to be considered a lethal weapon?

Box Cutters,paring knife,crescent wrench,crow bar,hammer,pocket knife,nail clippers,nail files,letter openers,etc.

 

[terryandrene]

If you don't like getting stung by bees, hornets or muggers, perhaps a can of hornet spray, the kind the shoots about 40 feet, would be a useful carry-on.

 

[theend]

**The driver, David Rhine of Newton Falls, OH, was walking between tractor-trailers at the stop – which is located along Route 11 near Middlesex Township – when a woman asking for a cigarette approached him.

According to police reports, as Rhine gave the woman a cigarette, a man appeared behind him and demanded money. Rhine complied and the couple the walked to a nearby vehicle, which was driven by another woman.

No weapons were displayed and Rhine was not injured.**

The guy was between trucks. Approached from the front and back. If he was you and carrying something to use as a weapon, what would you have been carrying?
A gun - where? Obviously you wouldn't have been able to use it quickly, and would it have been worth it?
A hammer, flashlight, can of ?, in broad daylight? A pocket knife in your pocket? (A legal pocket knife should be under 8" extended.)
You have 2 people coming at you. You have a folded up, small, pocket knife in your pocket.
I don't see any of these things working.
Cans explode. Sorry I don't have the email about an exploded can that went thru the back seat of a car like shrapnel, and blew out the windows.

You're facing death at worse, injury at best. The best thing to do is to look at the territory. Assess it. Go with your best instincts.
It works for me.
After reading that piece, I would never walk between trucks again. I'd walk between the rows where several drivers are sitting in their cabs looking around.
Early for arrival and it's dark, go somewhere where there's light.
Keep your windows up. Crack them a little to talk to a stranger on your running board. You've got an airhorn, tire thumper, flashlight, cup of hot coffee, at hand.
If the guy had all his money in his wallet I guess he lost it all. Divide it.
If someone wants the stuff in your vehicle, lock it, and hope your ins. covers theft. If a door is unlocked, theft is not covered. And most likely a break in will occur when you are out of the vehicle.
Read about incidents like the above and plan. Never let your guard down.
Most importantly, be at peace with death.
You can't stop a car from careening into you.
That one mistake in judgment where you go off the road and end up on your side.
Someone coming out of the shadows.
Even a heart attack.

Look at the percentages of something happening. If everyone on here would reply to the question: Has anyone ever threatened you? with a yes/no answer I wonder what the percentage would be.
I wasn't threatened, but I was stabbed, and not as a driver. I learned to plan an escape route when possible, and hope for the best when not possible.
As a driver I have only been worried a few times and been able to walk away from trouble.
Fear is your worse enemy.

 

[RobA]

These are all valid points and I must add that the Canada Border Services Agency (what we all call Canada Customs) is looking at truckers as a prime source of illegal guns that are flooding certain districts of Toronto so the gang bangers can shoot everybody up.
Do you want your truck impounded?

Please do not bring a gun or any other type of weapon across the border.

 

[tiredofsittn]

they will hand us a rifle and send us to liberate iraq, but we cant protect ourselves here at home, somethings wrong with that picture

 

[tiredofsittn]

oh yeah like an old man told me once, rather DOT to catch me with it than a crackhead to catch me without it

 

[Doggie Daddy]

>oh yeah like an old man told me once, rather DOT to catch me
>with it than a crackhead to catch me without it

and once the DOT catches you with it, you really will be tiredofsittn.in jail that is.
x(

 

[greg334]

Thanks Terry

I have a few more comments.

I only warn some that are ignorant to the facts that affect all of us. It is the same old story that there is a “need” for specific weapons, primarily a firearm of some type to protect you and your truck. But a great number of people don’t even know how to use a fire arm correctly or in a situation when their life is in danger. I have seen too many idiots almost kill a family member or a friend because they never were trained properly. Big deal ... you passed the concealed weapons requirment, shooting a target at 30 feet that don't shoot back. I gave up hunting simply because I got tired having to dodge bullets when someone who never picks up a rifle all year long and then goes out and shots a anything that moves because they think they have a right to kill a deer and endanger people. (No I am not against deer hunting, just wish they would outlaw idiots)

Today with paranoid people during paranoid times, we now have more ambiguity of what is considered a weapon and what is not. Part of the problem has to do with the rent-a-cop attitude (I can say rent-a-cop for a number of reasons, so no comments about that term please) and having people who want to make the world safe without regards of how it is done. These people are the real problem, no one else. It seems that now everything is a weapon, I am surprised dried spaghetti noodles are not considered a weapon. I mean I just finished jury duty and I could not enter the court with a pen that was made of metal, it was “surrendered”. One sign has OVER 80 items that were forbidden, which included combs, some types of glasses, felt tipped pens and highlighters. THAT IS JUST ONE SIGN. I had to take off my belt and some had to take shoes and even socks off.

P-A-R-A-N-I-O-D!

Now the Ford example I used is true. I changed a bunch of things that weren't important so not to get in trouble, but the driver worked for a sponsor of this site and I know that Ford was considering forbidding any of their trucks on their property for any reason at the time. It is taken very seriously at all auto companies and knowing a few of security people (not guards but management) I hear a bunch of stories when we get together, all kinds of things that I would not believe would happen with our intelligent autoworkers.

 

[tiredofsittn]

all jokes aside, i heard if dot finds it but everything else is in order most will look the other way. you always have a legal eagle though. if you feel safe with hornetspray or starting fluid thats cool. i like how these corporations and states trample on the bill of rights and the constitution. welcome to corporate america.

 

[greg334]

>all jokes aside, i heard if dot finds it but everything else
>is in order most will look the other way. you always have a
>legal eagle though. if you feel safe with hornetspray or
>starting fluid thats cool. i like how these corporations and
>states trample on the bill of rights and the constitution.
>welcome to corporate america.

OK I sort of agree with you about the corporate stuff, but as for the DOT officer looking the other way, here is what I was told.

You carry a gun, you get pulled over and the DOT officer finds the gun and says seeing it is locked in a case under all your clothes, he says just be careful with it. So a few days later, you get robbed and use the gun, killing someone.

So sometime later you are at the bar decompressing, you just mention that the DOT officer caught you with it and he let you go with only a warning. Someone, maybe someone who just don’t like you hears this and reports it back to the cops who start an investigation about this accusation. They find that you were inspected (this is recorded) and ask you if the accusation is true. You say yes, you have nothing to lose but the officer does. Depending on the prosecutor and the state laws, the officer could get time or a slap on the wrist. Which ever it is, it cost the DOT officer time and money, not to mention possibly shortening his/her career.

Now if I was a DOT office, do you really think that I could trust you if I let you go? No way and most will tell you the same.

 

[snipervictim]

I for one have a ccw and if i am going to canada i leave my gun at home .You are right you should train and train well there is nothing worst then a scared person trying to shoot a gun people who shouldnt get shot get shot and the person your trying to defend your self from might not get hit at all.I also know what states i can carry and the ones i cant there is a website packing.org thats keeps track of the laws i also ask myself by calling the locals .
I dont like the feeling of leaving my protection up to anyone but myself and I dont see the harm in owning a gun at all i dont hunt hell do not see the point we have supermarkets =) but as a cop once told my wife when see was getting her first gun WE ARE NOT HERE TO PROTECT YOU! we are here to find out who hurt you they are a after the fact kinda thing not a TV blaze of glory let me die for someone thing .I guess my point is to many people have died in thierr own homes because they coundnt protect their family.

 

[RobA]

That's Friggin INSANE !RE: Guns and Expediters

>I for one have a ccw and if i am going to canada i leave my
>gun at home
>
>I dont like the feeling of leaving my protection up to
>anyone but myself
>
> but as a cop once told my wife when see was
>getting her first gun WE ARE NOT HERE TO PROTECT YOU! we are
>here to find out who hurt you they are a after the fact
>kinda thing not a TV blaze of glory let me die for someone
>thing .I guess my point is to many people have died in
>thierr own homes because they coundnt protect their family.

That is BULLSH*T!
That "cop" should have been fired!
What else are they there for, other than to protect the citizeny?
I don't believe that a cop would tell anyone that.

What makes you believe that you could identify and shoot someone who is going to harm you?
Who is to say that the "bad guy" isn't also armed and ready?
Why do you believe that you would shoot straighter and faster?
You are crazy sir; the paranoid that the earlier poster was refering to.

 

[tiredofsittn]

RE: That's Friggin INSANE !RE: Guns and Expediters

i was laying over in dallas one weekend when a driver was killed. a group of thugs gathered around his truck. he and his wife was sleeping when they heard one trying to break in. he awoke and pushed the guy off his truck onto the pavement on his back. the thug then pulled out a gun and shot the driver. the driver managed to crank the truck and drive his wife safely away but then pasted away. where was the rent-a -cop. you cant expect them to protect you, and most crooks know drivers cant carry weapons.

 

[tiredofsittn]

RE: That's Friggin INSANE !RE: Guns and Expediters

oh yeah last time i was at the TA in dallas they had a sign on the door telling of a reward in the case and they still had not caught them. what a real injustice.

 

[guest]

RE: That's Friggin INSANE !RE: Guns and Expediters

I grew up in a suburb of Dallas about 10 miles from those truck stops on I-20. That whole area is very bad, lots of crime and drugs (the suburb I lived in was safe then, though it is not now). None of those truck stops were there 15 years ago. It was just a lot of undeveloped land that no one wanted because the area was so dangerous. I don't like to park in truck stops in urban areas because they tend to be in bad areas. Dallas is one of those places, though, where there isn't much else place to park. The TA on 35 north of town in Denton is MUCH safer.