Fuel Discounts

[Dynamite 1]

we have had no filter issues. we do seem to smoke a bit more with the flyinpilot fuel then the t/a petro due to unburned fuel and the truck is a wee bit sluggish. guess we will start using the cetane booster. cold weather is coming so purchasing the power service is a standard procedure. however that will add a few pennys to fuel cost for the winter cause the discount doesnt cover it.

in my previous post i ask john to please consider taking another look at the nastc/fleetone discount program with t/a and petro since the fuel is better and the discounts are at minimum triple what we have now. if we could get on this it would put a few more pennies per mile in all our pockets and make our trucks happier or at least mine. when i ran figures when we got home we lost 2-3/10 mpg since we started at load one and started fueling at flyinpilot versus when we were fueling at the t/a petro.

we are sure if john can work something out he will. things like this take time and there are other things that have to be taken into consideration. once again thanks in advance.

 

[Turtle]

Generally speaking, the extra few cents per gallon for Power Service is offset by the increase in fuel economy by the cetane boost.

One thing to note, the white bottle (winter - 4 cetane boost) give less of a cetane boost than the gray bottle (summer - 6 cetane boost), but of course not having gelled fuel or frozen filters is better than having the extra 2 cetane numbers. There are, of course, cetane boosters you can use in addition to Power Service. Synergen 20+ Cetane Diesel Fuel Conditioner has a 20+ cetane boost, but that's way overkill, won't provide any additional benefits above 10 cetane numbers, (once you get above 60 cetane fuel, it's actually a little more unstable), and when used with the relatively unstable B20 fuel, can cause additional problems. If you use Synergen, you'd want to cut the dose in half. FPPF has an 8+ cetane boost that works well, and is highly recommended by those TDI Club people (the ones with the VW's which won't run on anything less than 50 cetane). AMSOIL - Cetane Boost Diesel Fuel Additive is a 7+ cetane boost. Another one the TDI freaks recommend is Stanadyne Performance Formula, but it's more of a replacement for Power Service instead of a pure cetane boost, and it's not nearly as good in the winter as Power Service is. The last couple of winters I used the FPPF 8+ cetane in addition to the Power Service.

 

[Dynamite 1]

ya, its a real close trade off but if you are purchasing cetane boost on top of the power service then that adds more cost. we had been fine with a weaker dilution of the power service to protect from gelling along with the t/a fuel. just going to be cautious with the flyinpilot fuel as the temps decrease. maybe its just me but the truck just seems to do better on the t/a fuel, even all by itself in winter. we'll see.

 

[jelliott]

I will try and review the fuel program in the next few months again. To be honest, most all fuel comes from a very limited number of racks. TA does not own a private rack and is buying fuel from the same places as the other truckstops. If you order fuel for a terminal for instance you get the rack rates from multiple delivery companies. They all pull the fuel from the same place and half the time they use the same 3rd party carriers to deliver it.

 

[Dynamite 1]

thanks john, we will all appreciate it. i know they all pull from the same racks but the proof is in the numbers of several. we do see a drop in fuel mileage and the cetane numbers at the stops are different with the t/a petro being higher and the one that produces better mpg with out the use of cetane additives, which is an added cost. the biggest thing though is the big difference is in the savings. that extra .10 to .25 per gallon is huge at the end of the year. an extra bonus is the showers are much nicer. thanks again for all you do and we understand things like this take time and have to work for you also. thanks again, TNT

 

[Turtle]

That's true, but there are different racks and rack rates for different types of diesel, everything from #1 and #2 diesel to Bx biodiesel. BP has three different diesel fuels. One of the BP stations at home (the truck fuel stop on the north end of town on 641) offers Premium (50-51 cetane) year around.

The TA doesn't have their own rack, but they use separately branded fuels at most locations which doesn't necessarily come out of the same refinery barrel pipeline as the others. It all varies by region, of course, but those anal dudes at the TDI forums are constantly meticulously gathering information using several different confirmation sources to provide a list of cetane by brand. (One of the reasons they are so anal is that Volkswagen Group's warranty does not cover damage due to bad fuel, including fuel that's below the VW recommended 50 cetane). They are constantly checking in with different companies, refineries and others to obtain information that can be checked and confirmed.

You may have to dig into your state's requirements as well to find a true story for a given region. The pipeline minimum spec may be a cetane value of 40, but for example, the Texas Low Emissions Diesel program sets the minimum requirement for the 113 Eastern Texas counties at a cetane value of 48. : Texas Administrative Code Texas 30 TAC 114.312

Here's the current listing. You won't see TA listed, because they use any number of the various branded fuels below.

***Cetane levels by fuel company. To ensure accuracy if you have a level to add to the list please forward an email from a corporate office to me so it can be verified with the distributor. Please bear in mind that the current minimum from refiners in North America is 40. Depending on the quality of the oil used as well as refining processes you'll find 40-42 from refiners in the US and Canada. Anything above that has to do with specific companies additive packages. When companies give a minimum value then it will be listed as a single number. When a company gives a range of numbers bear in mind that more often than not you'll probably find the lower number rather than the higher number. If 40 is listed then it generally means that fuel is bought as is from the refiner--if someone messes up and doesn't put in enough additive at the refinery then that can cause major problems for your fuel system. It's recommended therefore that if you get the inexpensive fuel with low cetane you use a cetane booster (PowerService, Lubromoly Cetane booster or Stanadyne are all great choices), or run a little biodiesel in the tank. NOTE: If you have a 2009 Common rail diesel or later do not run additives in the tank! If something higher than 42 is listed then the retailer adds their own additive package in addition to the standard refinery additive package. Generally speaking as long as 49 or higher is listed you do not need to worry about adding any additives yourself.

BP (Amoco branded), 51;
Countrymark fuels Diesel-R, 50
Chevron, 49; or 51 with Techron D labels in select markets
ConocoPhillips through the 76 stations (California) 47-53
PetroCanada, 47-51
BP (Powerblend 47, otherwise 40-42)
Shell, 46;
Sinclair, 46;
Sunoco Gold, 45 (often +1-5) Sunoco regular is usually 40.
Exxon/Mobile, 43-46
Holiday Stations, 40-43
HESS, 40-42, can be up to 45.
Husky, 40 + diesel Max additives raise another 1-3 from there (41-45 max)
Love's: 40
Pilot: 40
Valero: 40
Sheetz: 40
Flying J, 40

Countrymark is an interesting one, as their fuels come solely from Illinois Basin crude, which is a very low in sulfur, light sweet crude oil. Most definitely 100% American made.

The reported numbers and experiences from truckers and TDI dudes alike are all consistent with the above list.

 

[OntarioVanMan]

What? No Speedway/Marathon on the list?

 

[Turtle]

What? No Speedway/Marathon on the list?

Lots of them that are missing from the list. One is the lesser known Flint Hills (the very excellent Performance Gold Diesel Plus found in upper midwest states, especially Kwik Trip in MN) which is 48 minimum. That stuff is loaded for bear in the winter months, too.

 

[Dynamite 1]

ya the quiktrips up there are great. thanks for the info. good proven quality source. we never researched it but we do pay attention to the brands, thats what we like about the t/a petro. better fuel, better mpg, less problems, happier mercedes. on a note john, just think about the cost savings if the tractor fleet all just got 2/10 better mpg. havent run the numbers, but it would be quite significant and when you add in the extra discount. $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$

 

[Wolfeman68]

I've been running on PFJ fuel for over 18 months on all my trucks and except for one incident, I haven't had any problems. The Sprinters have been averaging 20 to 21 mpg, and the straights have been sitting at 9 to 10 mpg, with the exception of the Freightliner I'm in. It gets 10.9 to 11.5 mpg. MBE 900 engine, 6 speed tranny. The engine has 805,000 on the clock.

I routinely put Diesel Service cetane in the tanks, and will continue to do so. I'll never trust fuel purchased from any source to do the job all by itself.

I made a deal with the manager of the O'Reilly's auto parts store near home to buy Diesel Service by the case. I save about $3 to $4 per bottle based on the prices I see in the truck stops.

Since there is a O'Reilly's near the shop, perhaps John could arrange a deal with them for us to get it by the case there as well.

 

[rfields200]

ya, its a real close trade off but if you are purchasing cetane boost on top of the power service then that adds more cost. we had been fine with a weaker dilution of the power service to protect from gelling along with the t/a fuel. just going to be cautious with the flyinpilot fuel as the temps decrease. maybe its just me but the truck just seems to do better on the t/a fuel, even all by itself in winter. we'll see.

I used power service for many many years with no problems until 2 winters ago. When fueling at Pilot and getting fuel with any biodeisel in it you have to double the dose of power service of there is a good chance for filter plugging. Instructions are on the back of the jug for dosing biodeisel.

 

[Turtle]

When using biodiesel in the Sprinter (Mercedes say B5 max for 09 and earlier, and none at all for the later models), I either double dose the Power Service, or, usually, dose Power Service and some Howes Meaner Kleaner.