Free speech

[OntarioVanMan]

Wallytrucker brought up the right to free speech thing...

I heard on a radio talk show...When the Supreme Court ruled in favor of flag burning under the First Amendment of free speech...how can an action be free speech if not a word is said? He went on to say that under free speech you can talk about burning the flag, have protest signs about burning the flag, BUT the ACT of burning the flag shouldn't have been acceptable and been illegal. Isn't defacing money down here illegal????

 

[greg334]

Well I may be wrong about this but the flag burning issue is actually a freedom of expression issue which is an extension of the freedom of speech. No words are needed to be spoken or written (remember there is something called interpretive arts which sometimes can be really offensive to some) to be covered under the amendment.

But with that said, the recent cases abot flag burning that have triggered the Supreme Court pass a ruling was Texas v. Johnson and United States v. Eichman and in the former Justice Brennan said that "…if there is a bedrock principle underlying the First Amendment, it is that government may not prohibit the expression of an idea simply because society finds the idea offensive or disagreeable."; which to me is a really broad interpretation when taken out of complete context of the case brought to them and opens the door for other protections of speech that nullify hate speech laws.

 

[OntarioVanMan]

former Justice Brennan said that "…if there is a bedrock principle underlying the First Amendment, it is that government may not prohibit the expression of an idea simply because society finds the idea offensive or disagreeable."

So by Justice Brennans own interpretation denying the haulicaust would not be a hate speech and permissable?

Or if I gave a speech to enslave the blacks again?

I mean theres even a movement to ban the Confederate Flag for petes sake.

 

[greg334]

The idea or concept of the basic freedoms we enjoy can not abridge by society just because it is offensive. If you or I deny the holocaust, as bad as some feel this is, it really is our right to do so, the same with someone who believes in slavery and other things that people find offensive.

The fine line to me (and my professors whose classes I attended) simply put it at the point where the words become actions. When we start acting like Germany who enacted a law that say no one can say there was no holocaust, we actually destroy the fundamental rights we have.

These laws suppress the freedoms for the common man under the guise of a hate law. This may sound extreme or off base but look at where we have been at with a society that accepted some words that were demeaning and offensive to a group to the point where it is no longer acceptable to say it openly to the point where we can’t even bring ourselves to even speaking the word to discuss the actual problems we have as adults. This is not done by a law yet but I bet will be.

To reinforce this, we now say that if you use these words in certain situations, it is a crime. We see this with certain religions who are complaining that it is really discrimination to say something that they find offensive or negative about the religion which is something that they are pushing as a law.

Now I said the common man, this is what I mean; if you take a serious look at society, it is alright for an artist to say, write or demonstrating anything as artistic expression, some is pretty deeming to certain groups or society in general, Rap artist for one – Madonna for another but they are ‘artist’ who were elevated to some level above the common man. This goes for journalist and other specific groups of people who also seem to be immune to criticism about what they say or write.

See to me it is not a good thing to say, write or express certain things but I or you or especially the government should tell people what to say feel or think.

Oh before I forget, with all my babbling about free speech, we have a serious assault on political free speech that is derived from the problems I mentioned.