Federal appeals court upholds God references in Pledge of Allegiance, currency

[witness23]

Thank God!

The 9th U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals panel rejected two legal challenges by Sacramento atheist Michael Newdow, who claimed the references to God disrespect his religious beliefs.

"The Pledge is constitutional," Judge Carlos Bea wrote for the majority in the 2-1 ruling. "The Pledge of Allegiance serves to unite our vast nation through the proud recitation of some of the ideals upon which our Republic was founded."

The same court ruled in Newdow's favor in 2002 after he sued his daughter's school district for forcing students to recite the pledge.

That lawsuit reached the U.S. Supreme Court in 2004, but the high court ruled that Newdow lacked the legal standing to file the suit because he didn't have custody of his daughter, on whose behalf he brought the case.

So Newdow, who is a doctor and lawyer, filed the challenge on behalf of other parents who objected to their children being required to recite the pledge. In 2005, a federal judge in Sacramento decided in Newdow's favor, ruling that the pledge was unconstitutional.

"I want to be treated equally," Newdow said when he argued the case before the 9th Circuit in December 2007. He added that supporters of the phrase "want to have their religious views espoused by the government."

In a separate 3-0 ruling Thursday, the appeals court upheld the inscription of the national motto "In God We Trust" on coins and currency.

 

[OntarioVanMan]

Great! Now lets put Christmas back where it belongs and dump those Happy Holidays and generic Seasons Greetings!!


Just say it! Merry Christmas! Now did that hurt???

 

[Ragman]

Thank God!

You're welcome

 

[OntarioVanMan]

You're welcome

11,000 members and it had to be you...*LOL*

 

[Ragman]

11,000 members and it had to be you...*LOL*

Aw schucks

 

[xiggi]

The sad part is it was a 2-1 vote. The decenter needs replaced. Oh wait its a judge probably a life long appointment.

 

[layoutshooter]

One of the few sane ruling of late.

 

[LDB]

First off why is it a 2-1 ruling and not 3-0, second why is such a waste of time/money/resources allowed to clog the courts and third who wants to bet that schmuck will push it forward again?

 

[Turtle]

"...atheist Michael Newdow, who claimed the references to God disrespect his religious beliefs."

He's an atheist, so by definition he has no religious beliefs to disrespect. He doesn't mind disrespecting those who do believe, however. If someone wants to reference God, or anyone else, let 'em. I'm a proponent of free think, as well as free speech.

I'm agnostic, with strong atheistic tendencies, but I don't think everyone should think like me. And I'm certainly not going to be a pansy whiner and use the courts to force my wants and beliefs onto others. All I know is, when prayer was still in school, we had significantly fewer problems in and out of school, and ever since school prayer was outlawed, things have gone to pot. I think there's a connection there.

 

[layoutshooter]

As do I. The kids need to be in school uniforms as well. The boys in dress shirts and ties. A tie makes it very hard for a boy to act up. It also gives teachers a good "handle" to grab a youthful offender by on the way to the principles office for his spanking.

I am also in favor off sex segregated schools, through high school. It is most important in jr high and high school.

Parents not being involved in their kids lives and education is a big contributing factor. At least one parent should be in the house when those kids are getting ready for school and when they get home.

 

[Poorboy]

I'm Happy that at Least 2 of the Judges had some Common Sense! If That Newdow or who ever he is and Claims that In God We Trust and One Country Under God is Offensive then there is Always Other Countries that don't use those Phrases that he Can Go To! Go On--Git!

 

[Turtle]

The Pledge of Allegiance has a fascinating history. The reference to God in the Pledge of Allegiance is a little off the wall, perhaps even hypocritical, since it was added as a response to those "Godless commies" back in the 50's. It wasn't in the original Pledge, which was written, oddly enough, by Baptist minister Francis Bellamy, for the national public school celebration of the 400th anniversary of Columbus' discovery of America. By presidential proclamation (Benjamin Harrison) the Pledge was recited in schools across the country for the first time on Columbus Day, Oct 12 1892, to coincide with the opening of the World's Columbian Exposition in Chicago, which was a celebration of the famous Italian explorer. The original Pledge was:

I pledge allegiance to my Flag and to the Republic for which it stands, one nation indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.

In 1923 the National Flag Conference recommended the words "my Flag" to be changed to "the Flag of the United States", to lessen confusion for the benefit of new immigrants. The words "of America" were added a year later. Congress officially recognized the Pledge as the official national pledge on June 22, 1942, in the wake of WWII.

Earlier, in 1940, the Supreme Court ruled that students and others could be compelled to recite the Pledge, while Jehovah's Witness and other defendants thought the flag salute to be idolatry. Widespread violence against Jehovah Witnesses followed the ruling. In 1943 the Supreme Court reversed it's decision in a case correctly citing that "compulsory unification of opinion" violated the First Amendment.

In 1948 Louis Bowman, chaplain of the Illinois Chapter of the Sons of the American Revolution, led the society in the Pledge with the words "under God" added, obtaining those words from Lincoln's Gettysburg Address. The Daughters of the American Revolution thought that was just peachy and quickly adopted the change. Shortly thereafter, the Knights of Columbus in New York did the same, and various chapter of the Knights followed suit. In 1952 the Knights adopted a resolution to make the changes universal and sent the idea to the President, Vice President and Speaker of the House. Several State legislative bodies adopted it, but it was a no go at the federal level after several attempts. In 1952 Truman got behind it, but all attempts in Congress to make the change failed.

Finally, in 1954, the Reverend George MacPherson Docherty, pastor at the New York Avenue Presbyterian Church, the same church that Lincoln attended, and the church that many presidents attend for services in honor of Lincoln's birthday, gave a sermon with Eisenhower sitting in the same pew in which Lincoln sat, delivered a sermon based on the Gettysburg Address titled "A New Birth of Freedom." In the sermon, he argued that the nation's strength was not in arms of war, but its spirit and higher purpose. He noted that the Pledge's sentiments could be those of any nation, nothing in particular made it uniquely American that was "the characteristic and definitive factor in the American way of life." He cited Lincoln's words "under God" as defining words that set the United States apart from other nations.

Eisenhower loved the idea, especially in light of the current Communism paranoia that gripped the nation. In addition, Eisenhower, who was raised as a Jehovah's Witness, was baptized a Presbyterian just a year earlier. Saying that Eisenhower embraced the idea would be an understatement. The next day after the sermon Eisenhower had Charles Oakman (R-Mich) introduce a Bill to make the necessary changes to the Pledge. It was passed and then signed into law by Eisenhower on Flag Day, June 14, 1954.

I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America, and to the republic for which it stands, one nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.

One of the most interesting things about the Pledge is that it is accompanied by a salute to the Flag. It has from the beginning, only the current salute of placing the hand over the heart is far different from the original "Bellamy Salute". The original "Bellamy Salute" was where you placed your outstretched arm, palm down, towards the flag while reciting the Pledge, and then at the very end you'd turn the palm up. That little bit of patriotic theater was outlawed by Congress in 1942 when it was discovered that the Hitler Nazi salute looked exactly the same.

The Bellamy Salute to the Pledge of Allegiance.

 

[letzrockexpress]

The Pledge of Allegiance has a fascinating history. The reference to God in the Pledge of Allegiance is a little off the wall, perhaps even hypocritical, since it was added as a response to those "Godless commies" back in the 50's. It wasn't in the original Pledge, which was written, oddly enough, by Baptist minister Francis Bellamy, for the national public school celebration of the 400th anniversary of Columbus' discovery of America. By presidential proclamation (Benjamin Harrison) the Pledge was recited in schools across the country for the first time on Columbus Day, Oct 12 1892, to coincide with the opening of the World's Columbian Exposition in Chicago, which was a celebration of the famous Italian explorer. The original Pledge was:

I pledge allegiance to my Flag and to the Republic for which it stands, one nation indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.

In 1923 the National Flag Conference recommended the words "my Flag" to be changed to "the Flag of the United States", to lessen confusion for the benefit of new immigrants. The words "of America" were added a year later. Congress officially recognized the Pledge as the official national pledge on June 22, 1942, in the wake of WWII.

Earlier, in 1940, the Supreme Court ruled that students and others couple be compelled to recite the Pledge, while Jehovah's Witness and other defendants thought the flag salute to be idolatry. Widespread violence against Jehovah Witnesses followed the ruling. In 1943 the Supreme Court reversed it's decision in a case correctly citing that "compulsory unification of opinion" violated the First Amendment.

In 1948 Louis Bowman, chaplain of the Illinois Chapter of the Sons of the American Revolution, led the society in the Pledge with the words "under God" added, obtaining those words from Lincoln's Gettysburg Address. The Daughters of the American Revolution thought that was just peachy and quickly adopted the change. Shortly thereafter, the Knights of Columbus in New York did the same, and various chapter of the Knights followed suit. In 1952 the Knights adopted a resolution to make the changes universal and sent the idea to the President, Vice President and Speaker of the House. Several State legislative bodies adopted it, but it was a no go at the federal level after several attempts. In 1952 Truman got behind it, but all attempts in Congress to make the change failed.

Finally, in 1954, the Reverend George MacPherson Docherty, pastor at the New York Avenue Presbyterian Church, the same church that Lincoln attended, and the church that many presidents attend for services in honor of Lincoln's birthday, gave a sermon with Eisenhower sitting in the same pew in which Lincoln sat, delivered a sermon based on the Gettysburg Address titled "A New Birth of Freedom." In the sermon, he argued that the nation's strength was not in arms of war, but its spirit and higher purpose. He noted that the Pledge's sentiments could be those of any nation, nothing in particular made it uniquely American that was "the characteristic and definitive factor in the American way of life." He cited Lincoln's words "under God" as defining words that set the United States apart from other nations.

Eisenhower loved the idea, especially in light of the current Communism paranoia that gripped the nation. In addition, Eisenhower, who was raised as a Jehovah's Witness, was baptized a Presbyterian just a year earlier. Saying that Eisenhower embraced the idea would be an understatement. The next day after the sermon Eisenhower had Charles Oakman (R-Mich) introduce a Bill to make the necessary changes to the Pledge. It was passed and then signed into law by Eisenhower on Flag Day, June 14, 1954.

I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America, and to the republic for which it stands, one nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.

One of the most interesting things about the Pledge is that it is accompanied by a salute to the Flag. It has from the beginning, only the current salute of placing the hand over the heart is far different from the original "Bellamy Salute". The original "Bellamy Salute" was where you placed your outstretched arm, palm down, towards the flag while reciting the Pledge, and then at the very end you'd turn the palm up. That little bit of patriotic theater was outlawed by Congress in 1942 when it was discovered that the Hitler Nazi salute looked exactly the same.

The Bellamy Salute to the Pledge of Allegiance.

Interesting...especially the last part...is that really true?
kinda ominous.

 

[layoutshooter]

Interesting...especially the last part...is that really true?
kinda ominous.

Yes it is true, I think it was innocent but not sure.

 

[Turtle]

Oh, yeah, it's true, all of it. There's a lot more history to the Pledge, but that about covers it. The Bellamy Salute, named obviously for the inventor of the salute and the original author of the Pledge, Francis Bellamy, predated the Nazi salute by many years, having been devised back in 1892.

In another similar coincidence, the Corn Palace in Mitchel, SD is a very unique place. The Corn Palace is a multi-functional facility smack in the middle of downtown Mitchell, and hosts basketball games and concerts and other events. It's called the Corn Palace because each year the facade of the building is decorated, every square inch of it, with primarily corn, but other grains are used. Corn kernels, cobs, stalks, you name it, they plaster it on the outside of the building. It is easily the world's largest bird feeder for several months out of the year. Well, not every square inch, not anymore, not since someone tossed an errant cigarette and the place burned down. Now the decorations start six feet from the ground.

Incidentally, the high school sports teams are the Kernels, and the local radio station is KORN. These people are serious about their corn.

Each year they decorate it with murals made of corn, with a different theme each year. The last time I was there was during the anniversary celebration of the Lewis and Clark Expedition, and the murals depicted those two, plus Sacajawea and Troussaint Charbonneau. It's very kewl, and is at the same exit as the Cabela's, about an hour west of Sioux Falls, SD. I highly recommend it, especially if you're around there near the end of August when the festival is going on, or any time in September or October when they are putting the final touches on the new murals. Half a million people visit the Palace every year, which is saying something considering there are more people in greater Memphis than there are in South Dakota.

This year the "Corn Week" festival begins August 27th with Kenny Rogers, and the rest of the week is filled with entertainment, as well. Admission to the concerts will cost you something (IIRC, Kenny Rogers is $45), but at all other times admission to the building is free. The corn murals are stripped at the end of August, and the new ones are completed by the end of October. Only naturally occurring colors are used in the decorations.

When you enter the building they have a gift shop, concession stand, and along the walls of the perimeter of the building there are framed pictures of each year's efforts. It's fascinating to see the incredible detail of each year's results. One year, 1914, the theme was a Native American theme, and included a symbol well known to the American Indians of the plains for hope and good luck. It is an old symbol, used in ancient Hindu and Indian architecture, in Asian and other cultures. During the Chinese Tang Dynasty it was the official symbol for the Sun.

Below is a picture of the Corn Palace from 1914. See if you can discover the symbol in question.

 

[chefdennis]

Turtle, I know that you do alot of research on the topics you post on, but i also realize that you also carry alot of information around in your head......great story....and the fact that that symbol was part of the native american indiana culture is fascinating in itself.....

 

[Turtle]

Thanks. Most of the research I do is just to confirm my memory, and to get the details right. I'm still not positive that 1914 was the year of Hope with the Native American Nazi symbol. I haven't researched it that closely. It may have been 5 or 6 years earlier, but it was around that time. Each picture in the Corn Palace has a metal placard on it with the year. That particular one above also has that little note in the lower left corner explaining the use of that symbol at that time.

Symbols are powerful things, but as the beginning of the movie "The Davinci Code" illustrates, many of them have been recycled over the centuries. Like, the white robes and the pointed hats of the KKK are unintended, but very close copies of the old Spanish Roman Catholic garments worn during the "Narezeno" tradition, in an act of penance. The origins of the costumes in Spain are many centuries old, but an American visiting certain parts of Spain during Holy Week would be freakin' out as to why Spain has such a large contingent of the Ku Klux Klan.

Here's a good one:

People are freaking out, rightly or wrongly. Ironic, isn't it, that to the American Indians, perhaps the most American of us all, the swastika means Hope. The people who create those posters poking fun at Obama, his Hope slogan, and the swastika likely have no idea how ironic they themselves are.

Of course, the Obamacare symbol only barely resembles the Nazi symbol, but for some that's close enough for jazz. The Obamacare symbol clearly comes from the symbol for the medical arts, the Caduceus. The truly ironic thing is that those who are fixated on the similarity of Obamacare and the Nazi's are missing the thing they should really be pίѕѕed off about, and that's the arrogance at which the Obamacare logo is trying to manipulate our minds. The subliminal message isn't one of Nazism, but one of magical reverence of all-things-Obama.

With the United States (mysteriously without Alaska and Hawaii) at their feet, the people of the United States stand there, almost in awe and wonder at this bright and colorful hovering orb. The people are blurred, but the familiar Obama logo is in the center of the orb, in focus, clear as day, except the familiar rising sun on the logo has been replaced with the rising Caduceus. It's a combination of magic and savior descending from above. The logo is a brand, pounded into the American psyche. The DNC Web page has the Obama logo, and not the logo of the Democratic party. The online store at the DNC is all-things Obama, with the logo and the Obama catchphrases aplenty, and nary a donkey to be found. They have mugs and t-shirts and coats and hats, all with the logo, which as far as I'm concerned should be a sign that means "Give me a wedgie," 'cause that's what wearers of such mindless symbolism deserve.

 

[witness23]

alrighty then........