Drinking beer in the sleeper berth

[wesaypop]

Hi everyone, I have a rather weird question. Is beer allowed inside the sleeper berth/truck when we are off duty?

This is my first week as a contractor. Friday I got a run from Indiana to deliver in Oklahoma. Only problem is, the delivery is scheduled for Monday. I made it to Oklahoma about 4pm today (Saturday). So I won't be driving any time soon.

A guy parked next to me at the truck stop asked why I wasn't watching the game and invited me inside his truck to watch the game and have a few beers. Which I did. I then asked him if drinking in the truck was legal even though we are off duty. He responded with, "idunno".

So I'm asking you guys, is it legal to buy beer from the truck stop and drink (inside our trucks) if we are off duty?

 

[FlyingVan]

Hi everyone, I have a rather weird question. Is beer allowed inside the sleeper berth/truck when we are off duty?

This is my first week as a contractor. Friday I got a run from Indiana to deliver in Oklahoma. Only problem is, the delivery is scheduled for Monday. I made it to Oklahoma about 4pm today (Saturday). So I won't be driving any time soon.

A guy parked next to me at the truck stop asked why I wasn't watching the game and invited me inside his truck to watch the game and have a few beers. Which I did. I then asked him if drinking in the truck was legal even though we are off duty. He responded with, "idunno".

So I'm asking you guys, is it legal to buy beer from the truck stop and drink (inside our trucks) if we are off duty?

Alcoholic beverages may only be transported in a commercial motor vehicle as part of a manifested load.

 

[Ragman]

Alcoholic beverages may only be transported in a commercial motor vehicle as part of a manifested load.

But the beer isn't not being transported.

The question is ( at least the way I read it), If you are logged as off duty, and the vehicle is not moving, is it legal to consume said beverage?

 

[cheri1122]

"Idunno" is an idiot for not knowing what the rules are. Getting caught with alcohol in the sleeper while in physical control of the truck [not driving, but having the keys] will get you put OOS for 24 hours.
You are also required to report it to your carrier within 24 hours. With most carriers, having a customer's freight on board will get you relieved of the remainder of the trip, and possibly your contract. They will view anything else as a risk they don't need or want to take.

 

[cheri1122]

Wesaypop: do yourself a big favor, and get a copy of the FMCSA Safety handbook, [the green one] and learn to find out for yourself what the rules are [and aren't]. It's better to know for sure than to risk your livelihood on someone else's ignorance.
You may still choose to take the risk, but at least you'll know what it is.

PS I absolutely love your username, lol.

 

[wesaypop]

Wesaypop: do yourself a big favor, and get a copy of the FMCSA Safety handbook, [the green one] and learn to find out for yourself what the rules are [and aren't]. It's better to know for sure than to risk your livelihood on someone else's ignorance.
You may still choose to take the risk, but at least you'll know what it is.

PS I absolutely love your username, lol.

I will do that right away. I had no idea such a book existed, which is why I'm glad I posted on this forum.

So beer is a no no, even while off duty but sleeping in the truck. Guess if I ever feel like driving I'll just get a motel room.

Thanks everyone for your response. Again, I'm brand new to this. It all kinda happened to me all at once so I have a lot to learn.

Glad you like my user name. I'm sitting in Oklahoma until Monday, and everyone here says soda lol.

 

[cheri1122]

Actually, the book sucks: it's written in hard to understand legalese jargon, and many rules are ambiguous [you interpret it one way, the law another], and it doesn't answer every question. Still, it's good to get familiar with it, because when you can find the answer, it's THE answer, period.

 

[ATeam]

Hi everyone, I have a rather weird question. Is beer allowed inside the sleeper berth/truck when we are off duty?

This is my first week as a contractor.

You are wise to ask. Have you been to your motor carrier's orientation yet? I would think that topic would have been addressed there.

Keep doing your good research. There are a number of books and guides that can be found that explain the rules for CDL holders.

Back to beer in the sleeper, I'll share this. When we were running with Landstar, a report was shared at a training meeting about a BCO (contractor) who had many years with the company (over 20, if I remember right) and a fantastic record.

One day this seasoned professional was bobtailing home for a break. He stopped at a liquor store a very short distance from his house, purchased some booze and put it in his truck to complete the trip home (the cargo bin if I remember the story correctly).

The items were not opened. The bag was not opened. Had a cop not seen him do this, the driver would have completed the trip home and enjoyed his drinks there. But a cop did see and cite him for the violation.

That was the end of his career at Landstar. The carrier instantly terminated him. His exemplary driving record and decades of good service counted for nothing. The violation trumped everything. Additionally, he had to deal with the ticket too and whatever future effects it would have on his record.

Diane and I kept it simple. If we were out on the road, no alchohol ever entered the truck. That included alchohol in our bodies. While we might have been out of service on a nice weekend layover, and while we might have been able to safely enjoy a drink with a meal at a restaurant before returning to the truck to bed down for the night, we passed on the drink.

Even on a break, you never know when you might have to move the truck for whatever reason. This is especially true for expediters. For that reason we never drank while out on the road.

 

[Turtle]

The question is ( at least the way I read it), If you are logged as off duty, and the vehicle is not moving, is it legal to consume said beverage?

In short, yes. But there's more to it.

As Cheri noted, the keys had better not be in the ignition. If they are, you are considered in control of the vehicle, whether the engine is running or not, and you could actually be cited for DUI.

If you are on-duty or operate the motor vehicle, or are in-control of the vehicle, you cannot have any beer, wine or liquor inside the truck at all unless it is part of a manifested load. If that happens, even if you haven't swallowed a drop, as she stated, you could be placed OOS for 24 hours.

You cannot consume any alcohol of any kind (including mouthwash, if you swallow that sort of thing, cold medicine, whatever) within 4 hours before operating a CMV. Your blood alcohol level must be 0.04% or lower when operating a CMV or performing any safety function. The regulation actually states, "Use alcohol, be under the influence of alcohol, or have any measured alcohol concentration or detected presence of alcohol, while on duty, or operating, or in physical control of a commercial motor vehicle;" but .04% or less is considered to be no measurable amount.

So yeah, off-duty, keys not in the ignition, you can possess and consume adult beverages all you want. Just keep in mind that off-duty is not the same as Out-of-Service, and unless you are OOS you can still be called for a random (unless you are actually out of hours).

Having said that, Ateam's advice is really good advice. There's always some little unforeseen gotcha that'll getcha. If you eliminate alcohol in the truck, be it in a bottle or in your body, you eliminate that from ever being a problem. There have been a scant few handful of times (once or twice a year, tops) when I've taken NyQuil while on the road, but I always go OOS when I do. Not only because NyQuil puts me out like a light, which is what I'm after, but if I don't go OOS I'll get called in for a random.

I should add that I don't drink, at all. Never have, so they know I'm a slam dunk when it comes to a random.

The relevant regulation is 49 CFR 392.5 - Alcohol prohibition.

 

[cheri1122]

This might be just a trucker's 'urban legend', but I've heard of drivers leaving a bar, walking to their trucks, and being busted for DUI the minute they climbed inside. They had no intention of going anywhere except to sleep, but the LEO watching the bar said their intentions didn't matter - they could change their minds. He was right, too. As ATeam said, you never know.

Note: the keys don't have to be in the ignition, either: in your possession is all that's required.

 

[cheri1122]

I will do that right away. I had no idea such a book existed, which is why I'm glad I posted on this forum.

Guess if I ever feel like driving I'll just get a motel room.

I just noticed what that actually says, lol.
If I feel like drinking, I go home. With my luck, I'd get nabbed when I went to get something I forgot from the truck. And I remember it after I'm all settled in jammies, natch.

 

[Turtle]

This might be just a trucker's 'urban legend', but I've heard of drivers leaving a bar, walking to their trucks, and being busted for DUI the minute they climbed inside. They had no intention of going anywhere except to sleep, but the LEO watching the bar said their intentions didn't matter - they could change their minds. He was right, too. As ATeam said, you never know.

Your first instinct is correct. Urban legend, probably started by a Bible thumper who doesn't like the fact that beer can be bought at truck stops, or that some truck stops have bars in them. I've heard the same crap on the radio, too. Even a mediocre public defender can get a DUI charge like that dismissed in a heartbeat. At the very least the LEO would have to have you to blow into a straw before be could bust you the minute you climbed inside. Merely exiting a bar is not evidence of, or even probable cause for being intoxicated. I've exited a bar many times, and not once in my entire life have I left a bar with any alcohol in my system.

Be that as it may, leaving a bar and entering the vehicle is a completely different scenario than of the question asked, that of consuming alcohol inside the truck in the sleeper berth.

Note: the keys don't have to be in the ignition, either: in your possession is all that's required.

In a few states that's true, but not in most of them. In most states, where driving or operating a motor vehicle is central to the charge, if one is drunk while sitting in their vehicle, and it is reasonable to infer that he (or she) had just driven, or was probably about to drive, he (or she) can be convicted of a DUI. In those states the key generally needs to be inserted into the ignition and the engine started (or at least attempted to be started), or the driver needs to be in the driver's seat and in possession of the keys.

Many states, about half, including Ohio, and the National Highway Transportation Safety Administration define "physical control" as: "Physical control" means being in the driver's position of the front seat of a vehicle or in the driver's position of a streetcar or trackless trolley and having possession of the vehicle's, streetcar's, or trackless trolley's ignition key or other ignition device.

Most states handle it the same way that Kentucky does, meaning it's not clearly defined in law, and instead uses precedent to decide. In Kentucky the controlling case is Wells v. Commonwealth. It outlines the four factors a court must look at in order to determine whether or not a person operated or was in actual physical control of a motor vehicle. The factors are:

1. Whether or not the person in the vehicle was asleep or awake;
2. Whether or not the motor was running;
3. The location of the vehicle and all of the circumstances bearing on how the vehicle arrived at that location; and
4. The intent of the person behind the wheel.

Basically, it is a totality of the circumstances analysis. The court will look at the factors above along with any other facts and circumstances, and determine whether or not that constitutes "operation" or "physical control."

But even in the states where "in physical control" is spelled out in the law (like Arizona, where the state wanted more DUI convictions and the revenue that comes with it) where having the keys on you or you know where they are and they are within close proximity where you can easily get to them, it still depends on the circumstances for most cases involving CMVs. If, as in the example in the first paragraph above, you and your truck are at an actual bar and not at a truck stop, the presumption is that you are not going to remain parked there for an extended period of time and that you will indeed need to drive that vehicle to a safe place to park, and thus you are likely to do so. You pose a public threat by your potential and imminent control of the vehicle. You'll be convicted for sure if you are in possession of the keys.

If, on the other hand, you are already parked at a truck stop and you leave the truck stop's bar and walk across the parking lot to enter your vehicle, there is no presumption that you will start driving before your HoS allows you to. A quick check of the logbook will not only tell the officer if you are legally able to drive within 4 hours, but it will also show a recent history of any logbook violations that may or may not predict your adherence to the law. You'll likely win the case in the latter scenario. It'll probably be expensive, but you'll probably win it.

Since I don't drink at all, it's very easy for me to take Ateam's advice. And like I said, if you eliminate alcohol in the truck, be it in a bottle or in your body, you eliminate that from ever being a problem. Not only do you never really know when you might have to move the truck for some reason, but why give the cops an opening to give you a hard time and look for something else to cite you for? It's what they live for, it's what they do best.

 

[cheri1122]

I'm still laughing over the presumption that a truck won't remain parked for the night at a bar, because the tractor trailer in which I drove with a trainer did just that. In Phoenix, the company's actual HQ. [Trainer was getting a new truck.] The next morning, when we returned to HQ to finish the swap, Security told him that they'd heard from a dozen company people about the truck they saw parked at a bar on their way to work, and if he wanted to spend the night at such a place again, to park the truck behind the place.
It wouldn't have fooled the cops, of course, but it would have kept the complaints to Security down, lol.

 

[wesaypop]

@ A Team, there was no orientation at all. I answered an ad on craigslist, and later that day I met with two Russian guys at their office. They sent me down for a drug test, then showed me their trucks. By Tuesday they had deposited $300 into my bank account for food and I was on the road. This all happened really fast. I have a basic idea of dot rules but I still have lots more to learn.

I had to use Google to figure out the log book with sleeper berth lol.

To every one else, I've just decided not to drink while out. I don't want to take any chances at all. I really want to make a go at this new career so my aim is to learn everything I can.

As for the guy who I had a drink with, he obviously knew we weren't supposed to be drinking in the truck because he told me later to be careful when buying alcohol and taking it to my truck because other drivers are snitches.

Thanks for all of your knowledge.

 

[Moot]

Minnesota Supreme Court Rules DUI Possible in Inoperable Vehicle
Minnesota Supreme Court upholds drunk driving conviction on a man asleep behind the wheel of an undriven, possibly inoperable vehicle.

The Supreme Court of Minnesota on Thursday upheld the drunk driving conviction of a man caught asleep behind the wheel of a vehicle that would not start. At 11:30pm on June 11, 2007, police found Daryl Fleck sleeping in his own legally parked car in his apartment complex parking lot. The vehicle's engine was cold to the touch, indicating it had not been driven recently. The keys were in the center console, not the ignition. Fleck admitted to having consumed around a dozen beers that night. Officers at the scene arrested him, and his blood alcohol level was found to be .18. A few weeks after Fleck's vehicle was impounded, a police officer tested the vehicle using the keys found in the car's center console.

"Although the key turned in the ignition, the vehicle would not start," Justice Alan C. Page explained in the unanimous decision.

Laws covering driving under the influence of alcohol (DUI) have evolved over the years to cover the situations where police find a parked, but recently driven, vehicle with a drunk behind the wheel. In the 1992 case Minnesota v. Starfield, the court found a drunk passenger sitting in a vehicle stuck in a ditch guilty of DUI, but not because it could prove she really was the one who drove and caused the accident. Instead, the court ruled that "towing assistance [was] likely available" creating the theoretical possibility that the immobile vehicle could "easily" be made mobile. These defendants have been charged under an expanded definition that suggests having "dominion and control" with the mere potential to drive is a crime. Intending to sleep off a night of drinking treated as the same crime as attempting to drive home under this legal theory which does not take motive into account.

As Fleck was an unsympathetic figure with multiple DUI convictions in his past, prosecutors had no problem convincing a jury to convict. The court took up Fleck's case to expand the precedent to cover the case of mere presence in an undriven -- and perhaps undrivable -- car into the definition of drunk driving. The court relied on Fleck's drunken claim that his car was operable to set aside the physical evidence to the contrary.

"Although the facts of this case are not those of the typical physical control case in which a jury can infer that the defendant was in physical control because he drove the vehicle to where it came to rest, a jury could reasonably find that Fleck, having been found intoxicated, alone, and sleeping behind the wheel of his own vehicle with the keys in the vehicle's console, was in a position to exercise dominion or control over the vehicle and that he could, without too much difficulty, make the vehicle a source of danger," Page wrote. "Based on the totality of the circumstances, the facts in the record, and the legitimate inferences drawn from them, we hold that a jury could reasonably conclude that Fleck was guilty beyond a reasonable doubt of being in physical control of a vehicle under the influence of alcohol and with an alcohol concentration of .08 or more."

Fleck's three prior convictions elevated his sentence to a felony for which the trial judge imposed four years in prison. A copy of the decision is available in a 90k PDF file at the source link below.

Source:

Minnesota v. Fleck (Supreme Court of Minnesota, 1/21/2010)

 

[xiggi]

He probably had a full trash can.

 

[BobWolf]

I asked the DOT inspector a few years ago when I had my new entrant review done about alcohol possession and consumption while away from home. I was told alcohol is off limits any time you are in, on, around, including in custody or control of a C.M.V. due to the possibility you might need to repair, fuel, work on, move, drive, load or unload the vehicle. This even applies to a pickup on the way home or to a hotel, in some areas, even if its in the cargo box. So, if you take a weekend off and stay at a hotel, or home either walk, or use your car to go to the store, and transport the beverage.

New York state has the same catch 22 when it comes to D.W.I.

Last year a family was busted and convicted of D.W.I. He was actually sleeping in the back seat in his driveway, and the keys were in the front seat area. He didn't want to be hassled by the soon to be ex-wife. He thinks his soon to be ex called the cops.
This is his first B.S. offense and he still got slapped with 9 months in jail, followed by probation, and forced to do rehab that he doesn't need. His licence was revoked, If he wants to drive when h gets out of jail, he has to have a Breathalyzer installed in any and all motor vehicles he drives.

Got a legal question???
Follow the money, and Big Brother domination and control machine.

Bob Wolf

 

[ATeam]

@ A Team, there was no orientation at all. I answered an ad on craigslist, and later that day I met with two Russian guys at their office. They sent me down for a drug test, then showed me their trucks. By Tuesday they had deposited $300 into my bank account for food and I was on the road. This all happened really fast.

You might want to learn more about the company you chose to drive with. Go to this web site and enter your motor carrier's (company's) DOT number where it says Check Motor Carrier Safety and Performance Data.

 

[LDB]

Short answer, if you want to keep your license and your job and in income, NO ALCOHOL ever, period, when in or around your unit. That eliminates any possibility of confusion or misunderstanding that could bite you in the there.

 

[mjmsprt40]

I don't know about others, but-- if I'm going to have a beer, I will first call in off-duty til---.

Then, I'll drink my beer. I never can manage more than one bottle, probably not even all of that. Then, lights out for the night. I don't go on duty again until overnight passes at least, and I prefer the weekend for this since it's not likely I'll hear anything all weekend anyway. By the time I roll again, my blood-alcohol level should show the same as if I had not had anything.

As it happens, I hardly ever drink. A beer now and then-- we're talking a six-pack could easily last a couple of months. When I have it at all. But then, that's just me.

On the road---- nope, not gonna do it. Coffee, sweet tea and/or water-- that's it.