DOT Came a callin

P51bombay

Expert Expediter
Set down a while - this is a real comedy of errors.
Yesterday I get a letter from DOT saying they tried on three separate occasions to contact me to schedule a new carrier safety audit and since all three failed they consider it refusal to submit and give 10 days from the date of notice (April 24) to reply in writing to the state office shown. I get this on May 4th - exactly 10 days from the above date! I imediatly call and leave a message then notice the postmark is dated May 1st - they sat on the thing for 6 of the 10 days given. Then first thing this morning I call (DC) and get two extremely rude and unhelpful ladies (ahem) who verge on refusal to answer questions regarding just what contact details they have on file but finally give up the goods and over a two day period last month they made two calls to my cell and one email but low and behold they have my cell phone jumbled and only half of my email - duh! No wonder you can't get in touch but apparently they didn't bother sending snail mail to my (correct) mailing address of useing my also correct home number and go straight to fourth and final notice.

DC supervisor finally gives another number for the state office, which I promtly call and end up speaking with the director of that office who's both nice and helpful - straightens it out in minutes, rescinds the warning letter and puts me in contact with an audiitor to schedule a meeting next month.

So I talk with the auditor and she asks some questions and wants to know if I'm operating under my own authority or someone else s. Not thinking it matter I tell he take your pick how you want to look at things which brings on more questions - she's thinking leased and that the company I'm contracted with is responsibility for dug tests, and other safety related issues which I know they want no part of.

The deal is they pay me a flat fee each month for the use of my trucks, they also pay an hourly fee for drivers to operate the trucks with a 40 hour minimum for each. The never take physical possession of any truck, plates (IRP) are in my name, insurance is in my name, IFTA license is in my name, trucks have my name and DOT/MC numbers on the door and company's on the box. They do all dispatches and when those are done each day we are done for the day, BOL's we use are theirs and they bill their customers independently


I don't know why DOT is asking or why it even matters to them who's authority is used but the $64K question is - am I "leased" or not? I don't see where I am, at least not in the traditional sense of things - they pay me X amount of $$$ for the use of my trucks as needed whether it be 1 dispatch or 15 and Y amount of $$$ for drivers to run the trucks. DOT is asking to see a copy of the agreement, so question 2 - do they have any right to see it and if not will flags rise if one or both of us say no? Lastly what are the defining factors that makes someone with their own authority "leased on" to another company who also has operating authority?
 

Poorboy

Expert Expediter
Sounds Like they should be Hanging with Moot in Minnesota to go On That Fishing Expedition! Lol But seriously though, It does sound like they are "Fishing" for something. I Think I would be in Contact with My Attorney Before and during their so called Inspections.:D
 

bluejaybee

Veteran Expediter
Just for your information, I now carry my lease agreement in the cab of my tuck, cause I have been asked by DOT at the scales to see it. At the time, I didn;t have it in there. Didn't get a violation, but they said I could. Anyway, if you think for one minute that you can win with them, give it your best shot. I am a one man show and the BS I was going to have to do to get my own authority was too much for me for what I was wanting to do. Well, getting it was no problem, becoming compliant was the bi**ch. So I chose to run under someone elses numbers. Hence the lease agreement. I got my authority one month and the next, they were already hounding me to set up a safety audit. Plus, I got my drug plan set up after I had already made several runs, and they suspended me for it. No problem getting them to reinstate me other than the time and more BS to call and beg to them. The way it looked to me, I would have had to hire someone to appease the DOT while I was out trying to make a dollar. I decided to just lease to someone. Had my insurance company withdraw my coverage with FMCSA and here came the threating letters.

Example of BS: I was supposed to have an application for employment for me on myself for me. That make sense. Of course not. I was supposed to have on file, a plan in which I could fire myself for whatever. I guess I just let the anger run over me and figured out an easier way for me. Just too much BS for a one puppy dog show.
 

davekc

Senior Moderator
Staff member
Fleet Owner
I would certainly seek some council at this point. Based on what you are saying, the DOT is identifying you as the carrier rather than a lease operator. While it is water under the bridge at this point, you should have had a accountant and attorney, both with a transportation background, involved from the start unless you are really familiar with setting this up. The single company you are hauling for is regarding you as the carrier rather than themselves.
That is why the focus is solely on you.
Sounds like you have somewhat of a mess on your hands.
 

P51bombay

Expert Expediter
Well, it seems they are trying to figure out just "who" is the carrier as I see it. As far as I can see that's me and I don't see that as a problem unless I'm missing something. I do have a process agent who did the filings for me (costs a bit but way easier) and they are also doing a DOT compliance package for me - most of which I have in place already. Pre emplyment drug tests were done prior to operation, employment applications were filled out, agent has me enrolled in a random drug test consortium, insurance, plates and IFTA are all good. Auditor said this was more an educational thing they do with all new carriers and owner/ops where they check to see if things are correct and if not show you what needs to be done.
 

bluejaybee

Veteran Expediter
I spent $1200 getting my numbers and trying to get compliant before I threw the towel in. It just kept getting more and more complex. More and more expensive. But also very time consuming. And every place I turned, I had to argue with them. Enough for me. I came up with another option and I took it.
 

x06col

Veteran Expediter
Charter Member
Retired Expediter
US Army
I would certainly seek some council at this point. Based on what you are saying, the DOT is identifying you as the carrier rather than a lease operator. While it is water under the bridge at this point, you should have had a accountant and attorney, both with a transportation background, involved from the start unless you are really familiar with setting this up. The single company you are hauling for is regarding you as the carrier rather than themselves.
That is why the focus is solely on you.
Sounds like you have somewhat of a mess on your hands.

I'd a prolly had my status figgured a long, long time ago frankly. Your advice Dave is on spot. He don't realize YET, that he don't have time to sit and take a while to type on here right now. Fines for DOT infractions START at 10 - 20K, an "geez I didn't know" don't cut it.
 

bluejaybee

Veteran Expediter
Exactly. The fines are what scared me in to doing something different. My friend had his first safety audit 4 years after getting his authority. They tried to blame him for it being 4 years. Duh! Anyway, he didn't have a bunch of stuff the way they wanted it. The fines they told him were unreal. He had to buy some kind of a book that was as thick as a Sears catalog used to be. In the book was all he needed to do to get compliant and they would be back in 6 weeks. He wound up paying several thousands to some company to get him compliant. And, like they did me, they are going to fine him for not being in a drug program. Only they suspended me. No fine. I am just not geared towards that much paper work and BS. My log book is too much for me. I envy people who have an authority and several trucks under it. DOT must be a living hell at times.
 

x06col

Veteran Expediter
Charter Member
Retired Expediter
US Army
Yepper. Went thru a lota years of that. It gets plenty intense once in a while. Never did hjave any infractions (thankfully), but ya gotta keep on top of it every second. That is the main reason the Carriers have to be so horse#%$^ and physical with drivers, because it is fiscal big time for them.
 

hz909

Seasoned Expediter
Example of BS: I was supposed to have an application for employment for me on myself for me.

Not only do you have to apply for employment to yourself (driver qualification file), you have to give yourself a road test to make sure you really can drive.

Common sense and good intuition serve as hindrances when one's goal is to comply with DOT rules and regulations. I pity the poor basturds unable to devoid themselves of these attributes.


My log book is too much for me.

Well, at least you know your limitations.


The original post expresses the importance of making sure that your information with the DOT is up to date and correct. If you give them a fax number, make sure your machine is monitored. If you give them a home number, make sure those messages get to you when you're out on the road. Have someone alert you if you're out and receive a letter from them.

The simple answer is to just give them your cell phone number as your main contact number. That is, if you don't mind the 24,000+ calls you'll receive from the factoring, insurance, and compliance companies throughout the day.
 

pjjjjj

Veteran Expediter
It seems many carriers use a service to ensure they keep up to date with all the compliance demands of the FMCSA. Such a service will also preview your stuff before your appointment, for a fee of course, including logs.

I have heard warnings from carriers that when FMCSA says, 'we're here to help you', or 'don't worry, it's for educational purposes', not to believe them.

Be prepared, and figure out whose authority you're actually running under, which carrier is responsible for what, and make sure you're both on the same page. Sounds like this carrier you are exclusive to, has hired you to take care of all this stuff, so they don't have to. Better make sure it's right! Good luck! When is your appointment?

FMCSA Regulations


Part 376: Lease and interchange of vehicles


Part 385: Safety fitness procedures
 
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